60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

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kapital98
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby kapital98 » Sat Aug 06, 2011 11:03 am

Lawl Shcool wrote:
ndirish2010 wrote:
LOL.


Look man, I would bet good money you don't know anyone who goes or went to TJ and have never been to the school. I bet it feels great to go to a quasi-good school and bash people at lower ranked schools anonymously on the internet. It makes you feel special right?


+1

I hate when people come looking for REAL advice and all they get is "drop out." It completely derails the thread from the beginning and doesn't help the OP at all.

I'm guessing the OP did quite well at TJ to be able to transfer (class rank would be nice.)

Thank you for actually helping the OP.

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Lawl Shcool
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby Lawl Shcool » Sat Aug 06, 2011 11:06 am

OP is top 10%

kapital98 wrote:
Lawl Shcool wrote:
ndirish2010 wrote:
LOL.


Look man, I would bet good money you don't know anyone who goes or went to TJ and have never been to the school. I bet it feels great to go to a quasi-good school and bash people at lower ranked schools anonymously on the internet. It makes you feel special right?


+1

I hate when people come looking for REAL advice and all they get is "drop out." It completely derails the thread from the beginning and doesn't help the OP at all.

I'm guessing the OP did quite well at TJ to be able to transfer (class rank would be nice.)

Thank you for actually helping the OP.

CanadianWolf
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby CanadianWolf » Sat Aug 06, 2011 11:11 am

Loyola Marymount is an excellent law school surrounded by substantial competition. For a thorough overview of Loyola Marymount read its Law School Profile on this website (TLS).
My opinion is that OP should transfer to Loyola which is a borderline Tier One/Tier Two law school.

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thedogship
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby thedogship » Sat Aug 06, 2011 11:36 am

CanadianWolf wrote:Loyola which is a borderline Tier One/Tier Two law school.


Justify this assertion, please. Its L.A. location and having some famous alumni don't cut it.

CanadianWolf
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby CanadianWolf » Sat Aug 06, 2011 11:53 am

Tiers are determined primarily by USNews rankings; Loyola Marymount is ranked #54 in the 2012 USNews Best Graduate Schools in which the top 53 law schools are Tier One (as 4 law schools are tied at #50).
See USNews rankings for factors considered.

According to another current thread, Loyola Marymount also ranks 25th among US law schools for number of partners at NLJ 250 law firms---which are the nation's largest law firms.

Aqualibrium
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby Aqualibrium » Sat Aug 06, 2011 12:00 pm

Is TJ free for you? IMO, top 10% at TJ with law review and no debt puts you in the same position with regards to job prospects as Loyola with no law review and 140k in debt; you'll be scraping and struggling to find something, OCI will not be a viable option. The difference is, therefore, the debt. I say stay.

Aqualibrium
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby Aqualibrium » Sat Aug 06, 2011 12:01 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:According to another current thread, Loyola Marymount also ranks 25th among US law schools for number of partners at NLJ 250 law firms---which are the nation's largest law firms.


Are we seriously quoting this random, unhelpful list now? Like I'm really not sure if you're serious. Do you really think that list matters enough to cite it as a reason for someone to go to Loyola?

CanadianWolf
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby CanadianWolf » Sat Aug 06, 2011 12:02 pm

OP specified in the thread title that Loyola Marymount is only $60,000 more expensive--not $140,000--than her current law school.

Yes, the list of NLJ 250 partners is relevant as compared to Tier Four Thomas Jefferson because most attend law school in order to obtain gainful employment as an attorney. Additionally, Loyola-LA has a strong public interest component loan repayment program according to its TLS law school profile.

Are you really advocating for Tier Four Thomas Jefferson ?

Aqualibrium
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby Aqualibrium » Sat Aug 06, 2011 12:15 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:OP specified in the thread title that Loyola Marymount is only $60,000 more expensive--not $140,000--than her current law school.

Yes, as compared to Tier Four Thomas Jefferson.

Are you really advocating for Tier Four Thomas Jefferson ?



I saw that, I just assumed op meant to say 60k per year. Could be wrong.

Anyway, not advocating for either school, just saying that if op has a significant scholarship at TJ, there is really no point in op going into debt to have a similar struggle to get a job.

I'm still dumbfounded that you think that list has anything more than nominal when attempting to make a decision about law school.

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scrowell
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby scrowell » Sat Aug 06, 2011 12:24 pm

Lawl Shcool wrote:
ndirish2010 wrote:
LOL.


Look man, I would bet good money you don't know anyone who goes or went to TJ and have never been to the school. I bet it feels great to go to a quasi-good school and bash people at lower ranked schools anonymously on the internet. It makes you feel special right?


Don't worry about that guy. He's posted in a few of my threads and he seems like a jerk. Comparing people with lower LSAT scores to monkeys is pretty cruel. Only someone with their own insecurities to deal with would write something like that.

CanadianWolf
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby CanadianWolf » Sat Aug 06, 2011 12:45 pm

The list is relevant to employment prospects especially in the context of OP's situation because most (probably an overwhelming majority) of those Loyola Marymount partners are in Southern California. Top 14 law school partners are often spread among several cities & regions.
Additionally, I would recommend Loyola -LA over Thomas Jefferson in almost every situation imaginable to me.

AlvinJames
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby AlvinJames » Sat Aug 06, 2011 2:46 pm

Is there a link to the list of the law schools with partners in the top 250 law firms? Thought I would take a look at it.

CanadianWolf
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby CanadianWolf » Sat Aug 06, 2011 2:53 pm

"Law Schools That Make The Most Partners" is currently a thread on this website (TLS).

missmae3
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby missmae3 » Sat Aug 06, 2011 5:12 pm

Thank you! I have nothing but praise for TJ. The professors, deans, and students are all wonderful and bright people. I have seen several TJ grads and students doing really well. I think that these people doing the bashing must have some insecurity about their own school. I wouldn't go around trashing something I had no actual knowledge about.

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Grizz
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby Grizz » Sat Aug 06, 2011 5:15 pm

missmae3 wrote:I wouldn't go around trashing something I had no actual knowledge about.


TJ's struggles and the lawsuit against TJSL are well documented on the internet and in the media.

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$1.99
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby $1.99 » Sat Aug 06, 2011 5:45 pm

the amount of delusion in this thread can sustain a mental hospital for years. TJ school is a joke, on par with cooley.

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scrowell
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby scrowell » Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:13 pm

Yes, there has been a lawsuit against TJ, but even "great" schools like BC have faced them as well: http://www.bostonherald.com/news/region ... id=1290088. I don't see anyone crapping on that place on this board. If you ask me, it's laughable that people sue their respective schools for their own shortcomings. This says much more about the horrific character of the plaintiffs than it does about TJSL or BC. Anyone who feels that entitled doesn't deserve to get a job anyway, so I don't see how that applies to the OP-clearly a hard working person looking to better his/her situation through hard work, as demonstrated by his/her grades.

Aqualibrium
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby Aqualibrium » Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:15 pm

scrowell wrote:Yes, there has been a lawsuit against TJ, but even "great" schools like BC have faced them as well: http://www.bostonherald.com/news/region ... id=1290088. I don't see anyone crapping on that place on this board. If you ask me, it's laughable that people sue their respective schools for their own shortcomings. This says much more about the horrific character of the plaintiffs than it does about TJSL or BC. Anyone who feels that entitled doesn't deserve to get a job anyway, so I don't see how that applies to the OP-clearly a hard working person looking to better his/her situation through hard work, as demonstrated by his/her grades.


I was with you until the "suing for your own shortcomings" part. You must either be a 0L or a 1L who hasn't experienced what the legal hiring market is like right now. It's not just the people who didn't work hard or try hard who struggle for jobs. Trust me on that one.

taxguy
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby taxguy » Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:29 pm

OP< if you were in the top 10% of TJ, have your consider other and perhaps cheaper alternatives to Loyola, especially since their tuition was almost $42,000 per year. For example, you can apply to University of Florida, Florida State ( and get instate for your third year)and Miami, most of which are better than Loyola and certainly cheaper.

Even better, you could apply to a state university in your home state for much cheaper tuition than Loyola. I am just curious as to why Loyola vs TJ, when there are many good alternatives? Other top choices would be Emory, Fordham, University of Maryland etc.

By the way, I am NOT knocking Loyola. I think they provide a very good legal education from the folks that I met who went there. However, in today's economy, you need every edge possible. Either go cheaply incase you don't get a decent paying job or do to a very well ranked law school. Even better would be if you can achieve both considerations.
Last edited by taxguy on Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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$1.99
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby $1.99 » Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:36 pm

scrowell wrote:Yes, there has been a lawsuit against TJ, but even "great" schools like BC have faced them as well: http://www.bostonherald.com/news/region ... id=1290088. I don't see anyone crapping on that place on this board. If you ask me, it's laughable that people sue their respective schools for their own shortcomings. This says much more about the horrific character of the plaintiffs than it does about TJSL or BC. Anyone who feels that entitled doesn't deserve to get a job anyway, so I don't see how that applies to the OP-clearly a hard working person looking to better his/her situation through hard work, as demonstrated by his/her grades.


are you five years old where you live in your own world where hard work = better situation/success all the time? yes they can work hard at a disgraceful school like TJ but they have to compete with hard workers who attend schools like harvard. hard workers are everywhere bud.

now i know why you defend TJ. you go to CUNY lol

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scrowell
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby scrowell » Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:36 pm

Aqualibrium wrote:
scrowell wrote:Yes, there has been a lawsuit against TJ, but even "great" schools like BC have faced them as well: http://www.bostonherald.com/news/region ... id=1290088. I don't see anyone crapping on that place on this board. If you ask me, it's laughable that people sue their respective schools for their own shortcomings. This says much more about the horrific character of the plaintiffs than it does about TJSL or BC. Anyone who feels that entitled doesn't deserve to get a job anyway, so I don't see how that applies to the OP-clearly a hard working person looking to better his/her situation through hard work, as demonstrated by his/her grades.


I was with you until the "suing for your own shortcomings" part. You must either be a 0L or a 1L who hasn't experienced what the legal hiring market is like right now. It's not just the people who didn't work hard or try hard who struggle for jobs. Trust me on that one.


I'm a 1L, so I can't say that I have. I guess I'm considering feeling entitled to not struggle for a while to be the shortcoming in these cases. Some lawyers have to make shit money, and hell, some have to temp or find other types of work. But I'll tell you one thing, I'm not going to cry if I get a 30k/year job, or even just temp work, right out of the gate. I would NEVER blame a school I've attended.

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Grizz
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby Grizz » Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:37 pm

taxguy wrote:OP< if you were in the top 10% of TJ, have your consider other and perhaps cheaper alternatives to Loyola. For example, you can apply to University of Florida, Florida State and Miami, most of which are better than Loyola.

You could apply to a state university in your home state for much cheaper tuition than Loyola. I am just curious as to why Loyola vs TJ, when there are many good alternatives.


If you're not from FL, this isn't a good idea.

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scrowell
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby scrowell » Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:43 pm

$1.99 wrote:
scrowell wrote:Yes, there has been a lawsuit against TJ, but even "great" schools like BC have faced them as well: http://www.bostonherald.com/news/region ... id=1290088. I don't see anyone crapping on that place on this board. If you ask me, it's laughable that people sue their respective schools for their own shortcomings. This says much more about the horrific character of the plaintiffs than it does about TJSL or BC. Anyone who feels that entitled doesn't deserve to get a job anyway, so I don't see how that applies to the OP-clearly a hard working person looking to better his/her situation through hard work, as demonstrated by his/her grades.


are you five years old where you live in your own world where hard work = better situation/success all the time? yes they can work hard at a disgraceful school like TJ but they have to compete with hard workers who attend schools like harvard. hard workers are everywhere bud.

now i know why you defend TJ. you go to CUNY lol


Obviously I'm aware of that. But realize that we all have different goals. Who said that OP wants to compete for the same jobs as Harvard grads? I'm assuming that's not the case, so I don't think a hard worker in the 10% of TJ will have a hard time getting some type of legal employment: --LinkRemoved--

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kapital98
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby kapital98 » Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:03 pm

scrowell wrote:
$1.99 wrote:now i know why you defend TJ. you go to CUNY lol


Obviously I'm aware of that. But realize that we all have different goals. Who said that OP wants to compete for the same jobs as Harvard grads? I'm assuming that's not the case, so I don't think a hard worker in the 10% of TJ will have a hard time getting some type of legal employment: --LinkRemoved--


This is absolutely right.

Why should where Scrowell goes to school matter? They are offering helpful advice (and check out his/her prior posts -- very funny: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=123652.)

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YourCaptain
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Re: 60K more in debt and go to a T2 or stay at T4?

Postby YourCaptain » Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:09 pm

missmae3 wrote:I currently go to Thomas Jefferson in San Deigo and I am considering transferring to Loyola in Los Angeles.


Cavalier wrote:Drop out. Not trolling.



I am very good friends with a TJ grad who graduated in 2003... ie before the recession. She was a paralegal and after she graduated in the top 10% of her class her own firm wouldn't hire her because it's TJ. Also, and I hate to say this, but TJ has no reputation to speak of in Southern California.


Fullride+stipend & LR or drop out.




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