BU, Chicago, or Wait?

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Should I stay at BU, accept at Chicago, or wait for Columbia?

Go to Chicago
16
46%
Wait til the end of the week and ask Columbia for a decision
11
31%
Let the Chicago deadline pass in hopes of Columbia
1
3%
Stay at BU
7
20%
 
Total votes: 35

smiley
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BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby smiley » Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:03 pm

Hey everyone, got my first acceptance today and am excited in the anxious way. Currently at BU, no money, secondary journal. Got into Chicago today. I know it seems like an obvious decision, but my concern is that Boston is definitely my ideal market, with New York being a distant second. I like the fact that Chicago opens up way more opportunities in markets across the country and maybe (mayyyyybe) academia. I just worry that BU for Boston is the duh choice.

I need to give Chicago a decision by Monday, but I also have an app out at Columbia, my undergrad. I'm not sure what shot I realistically have at Columbia, but I would hope it's at least as good as my chances at Chicago. I would definitely prefer Columbia because it's close to home and not so out of the way of Boston.

Oh, and BU seems really reluctant about giving out more money. I sent a very polite email, and they said "we can't treat you differently than other 2Ls, we'll let you know by the fall, etc etc."

So what should I do?

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Moxie
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby Moxie » Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:07 pm

Grades at BU? If you have high grades, I would imagine you already have a very good shot at getting Boston Biglaw (which I assume you want by your post)

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Helmholtz
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby Helmholtz » Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:09 pm

If you want Boston, I don't see why you're trying to transfer anywhere, with the possible exception of Harvard. If I was a Boston biglaw interviewer, and I saw that you made the BU -> CCN move, I would immediately think that you just didn't want to be in Boston, and I doubt you'd be able to convince me otherwise.

smiley
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby smiley » Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:10 pm

Yeah, I have pretty high grades. Anything could happen, but I think I could pull off Boston biglaw from BU, which is what I want. I'm certainly being greedy, but I'm wondering if I could get Boston biglaw PLUS all the Chicago extras (prestige, chance at academia or clerkship, opportunities in other markets) if I transfer.

smiley
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby smiley » Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:12 pm

Helmholtz wrote:If you want Boston, I don't see why you're trying to transfer anywhere, with the possible exception of Harvard. If I was a Boston biglaw interviewer, and I saw that you made the BU -> CCN move, I would immediately think that you just didn't want to be in Boston, and I doubt you'd be able to convince me otherwise.


Point well taken, this is my big transfer fear, especially with Chicago. I think if I got Columbia I'd take my chances with Boston and wouldn't be too sad if I ended up in New York. My undergrad has a special place in my heart and would be worth the risk to me. I'm not Harvard material.
Last edited by smiley on Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

kaiser
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby kaiser » Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:13 pm

Im at BU also (and pretty sure I know who this is) and my intuition tells me you should stay if Boston is your goal. The best firms in Boston are filled with BU grads. If you have the grades to get into Chicago, them you obviously are very high in the class. You seem really well set up for any Boston position so I don't see the point in transfering.

My focus is NYC so taking NYU up on their offer seems like it makes most sense for me, but if Boston were my first choice, I wouldn't want to go as far away as NYU, let alone Chicago. Good luck with your choice.

concurrent fork
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby concurrent fork » Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:16 pm

Helmholtz wrote:If you want Boston, I don't see why you're trying to transfer anywhere, with the possible exception of Harvard. If I was a Boston biglaw interviewer, and I saw that you made the BU -> CCN move, I would immediately think that you just didn't want to be in Boston, and I doubt you'd be able to convince me otherwise.

Credited. BU ---> CCN most likely reduces your chances of Boston biglaw.

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JollyGreenGiant
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby JollyGreenGiant » Mon Jul 11, 2011 9:17 pm

Helmholtz wrote:If you want Boston, I don't see why you're trying to transfer anywhere, with the possible exception of Harvard. If I was a Boston biglaw interviewer, and I saw that you made the BU -> CCN move, I would immediately think that you just didn't want to be in Boston, and I doubt you'd be able to convince me otherwise.

+1.

And isn't it exceptionally hard to get academia without law review? (I don't know for sure, just guessing)

smiley
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby smiley » Mon Jul 11, 2011 9:37 pm

JollyGreenGiant wrote:
Helmholtz wrote:If you want Boston, I don't see why you're trying to transfer anywhere, with the possible exception of Harvard. If I was a Boston biglaw interviewer, and I saw that you made the BU -> CCN move, I would immediately think that you just didn't want to be in Boston, and I doubt you'd be able to convince me otherwise.

+1.

And isn't it exceptionally hard to get academia without law review? (I don't know for sure, just guessing)


yeah i think this is right, but i don't have law review now, whereas chicago i can try the write on and maybe get a secondary journal. secondary journal from a T5 must be better for a clerkship attempt than secondary journal from T25.

bmic
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby bmic » Mon Jul 11, 2011 11:45 pm

You should leave. As someone transferring to BU I don't need the competition! Just kidding, I think it sounds like you should stay at BU, but I'm not sure how it will affect your academia opportunities. But if you do well enough at BU, they might hire you as a professor. At my old school a pretty big chunk of the faculty graduated from that school, but I think you need to be at the top of your class for that to happen (I am basing this solely on rumors of how the professors did so take that with a grain of salt)

smiley
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby smiley » Tue Jul 12, 2011 11:51 pm

so in light of these responses and other advice, i'm definitely leaning towards staying. would anyone's opinion change if i said i've got a significant other currently looking for jobs, and we have no idea what market he's going to end up in? i certainly prefer boston, and so does he, but i like the mobility chicago offers. as in, if he gets a random job in california, i probably have a better shot of being able to go there from chicago than bu. thoughts?

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Helmholtz
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby Helmholtz » Wed Jul 13, 2011 12:19 am

smiley wrote:so in light of these responses and other advice, i'm definitely leaning towards staying. would anyone's opinion change if i said i've got a significant other currently looking for jobs, and we have no idea what market he's going to end up in? i certainly prefer boston, and so does he, but i like the mobility chicago offers. as in, if he gets a random job in california, i probably have a better shot of being able to go there from chicago than bu. thoughts?


I'm not sure what the answer is, but my opinion on "going somewhere else means giving up Boston" still stands. When Boston biglaw firms ask you why in the hell you transfered away from your target market, are you going to tell them that Chicago or Columbia gives you more mobility since you may need to high-tail it out of Boston if your SO finds work elsewhere? I just can't see that going well.

lawgod
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby lawgod » Wed Jul 13, 2011 12:22 am

Can't you say yes to chicago and still wait on columbia? Do they require you to withdraw from all your apps?

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unc0mm0n1
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby unc0mm0n1 » Wed Jul 13, 2011 12:48 am

It's funny everyone in this thread is saying stay at BU but the poll is heavy leaning toward Chicago. I voted for Chicago, because Chicago at sticker seems like a much more sound choice than BU at sticker. But that's just me. I suspect Boston firms wouldn't look down on a Chicago degree. I just can't see a hiring partner telling you well you shouldn't have transfered to one of the best schools in the nation. As long as you have a good answer for the question of why you transfered you'll be fine. There are a ton of Chicago people working for the most prestigous firms in Boston. If you're really worried I'd write one of the partners at Ropes (or another prestigous Boston firm) who went to Chicago and ask them the question you asked on the board. I bet you no one would hold U of C against you. Plus you'll leave your self with better exit options.

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JusticeHarlan
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby JusticeHarlan » Wed Jul 13, 2011 7:01 am

unc0mm0n1 wrote:I suspect Boston firms wouldn't look down on a Chicago degree. I just can't see a hiring partner telling you well you shouldn't have transfered to one of the best schools in the nation. As long as you have a good answer for the question of why you transfered you'll be fine. There are a ton of Chicago people working for the most prestigous firms in Boston. If you're really worried I'd write one of the partners at Ropes (or another prestigous Boston firm) who went to Chicago and ask them the question you asked on the board. I bet you no one would hold U of C against you.

This is true for someone who went to Chicago for 1L. But for someone who was in Boston, at a Boston feeder school, then bailed for a different city? It's a tough, tough sell. You could say, you wanted to experience the educational opportunities of Chicago, but the skepticism will be pretty high.

I guess it depends on how strong OPs ties are to Boston. If she can make a strong pitch for wanting to stay in Boston (grew up there, family is there, hates the Yankees, etc.) it might work to say the reason for heading to Chicago was the education, which is admittedly one of the few schools that might work for. But even so, it's a hard sell to a fairly insular market, and if OP's ties are weak, then it might be impossible. I've got pretty strong ties, and this was the main reason I didn't apply to CCN.

Obviously, going to Chicago is going to open more doors in more cities. But that's exactly why people from Boston will be skeptical.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Wed Jul 13, 2011 7:46 am

smiley wrote:
JollyGreenGiant wrote:
Helmholtz wrote:If you want Boston, I don't see why you're trying to transfer anywhere, with the possible exception of Harvard. If I was a Boston biglaw interviewer, and I saw that you made the BU -> CCN move, I would immediately think that you just didn't want to be in Boston, and I doubt you'd be able to convince me otherwise.

+1.

And isn't it exceptionally hard to get academia without law review? (I don't know for sure, just guessing)


yeah i think this is right, but i don't have law review now, whereas chicago i can try the write on and maybe get a secondary journal. secondary journal from a T5 must be better for a clerkship attempt than secondary journal from T25.


FYI, unless Chicago has changed things from prior years, you missed the write-on - they don't have a seperate one for transfer students.

smiley
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby smiley » Wed Jul 13, 2011 11:50 am

[/quote]

FYI, unless Chicago has changed things from prior years, you missed the write-on - they don't have a seperate one for transfer students.[/quote]

Fair enough, this may be true. I thought I saw on their admit website, though, that they had opportunities for anyone to try to write on during 2L or 3L year, not just transfers. I have to look again though.

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unc0mm0n1
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby unc0mm0n1 » Wed Jul 13, 2011 5:11 pm

JusticeHarlan wrote:
unc0mm0n1 wrote:I suspect Boston firms wouldn't look down on a Chicago degree. I just can't see a hiring partner telling you well you shouldn't have transfered to one of the best schools in the nation. As long as you have a good answer for the question of why you transfered you'll be fine. There are a ton of Chicago people working for the most prestigous firms in Boston. If you're really worried I'd write one of the partners at Ropes (or another prestigous Boston firm) who went to Chicago and ask them the question you asked on the board. I bet you no one would hold U of C against you.

This is true for someone who went to Chicago for 1L. But for someone who was in Boston, at a Boston feeder school, then bailed for a different city? It's a tough, tough sell. You could say, you wanted to experience the educational opportunities of Chicago, but the skepticism will be pretty high.

I guess it depends on how strong OPs ties are to Boston. If she can make a strong pitch for wanting to stay in Boston (grew up there, family is there, hates the Yankees, etc.) it might work to say the reason for heading to Chicago was the education, which is admittedly one of the few schools that might work for. But even so, it's a hard sell to a fairly insular market, and if OP's ties are weak, then it might be impossible. I've got pretty strong ties, and this was the main reason I didn't apply to CCN.

Obviously, going to Chicago is going to open more doors in more cities. But that's exactly why people from Boston will be skeptical.


I just don't believe this. The program I am in gives us opportunities to meet hiring partners every week and they all say go to the best school you can go to. I told them I want to work in Chicago but I got into Harvard and of course they told me go to Harvard because it will open more doors than say Northwestern. If I went to NW for my first year and had a chance to transfer to Harvard I would do it in a heartbeat and I bet I could still get Chicago probably easier. BU and Chicago are not peers or even close to peers Chicago has way better opportunities in every sector including clerking, in-house and big law. OP please don't listen to the people in this thread or even me for that matter write someone at a law firm. You'd be surprised at how friendly most of them are and they'd answer your questions and I'd bet dollars to donuts they'd say a Chicago degree will not hurt you in your Boston job search. BTW, where is everybody else who voted for Chicago? Nobody else is backing up their vote.

Edit: The only way I could see this is if BU was free and UC was sticker but both are sticker. OP go to Chicago, make great connections, get a great job, profit.

smiley
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby smiley » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:24 pm

So I got into Columbia, and I'm thrilled. This definitely knocks Chicago out of the picture. So now it's BU v. Columbia, which I feel is a much easier decision for me. Feel free to weigh in, and I appreciate everyone's opinion.

flexityflex86
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby flexityflex86 » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:32 pm

smiley wrote:So I got into Columbia, and I'm thrilled. This definitely knocks Chicago out of the picture. So now it's BU v. Columbia, which I feel is a much easier decision for me. Feel free to weigh in, and I appreciate everyone's opinion.

columbia for what you said before about not minding being stuck in NYC.

they're both sticker so i think having columbia increases your odds of big law everywhere outside the northeast, and i think partners will understand.

i understand you're leaving boston from a boston feeder school, but can't you say, "As much as I loved my 1L year in BU, I did have a fear I would not be sitting at this interview today if I stayed, and I would rather have had gainful employment in New York where I could save up enough to return to Boston someday than struggle in Boston."?

Headybrah
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby Headybrah » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:34 pm

seems like you want columbia.

you will get big law.

but in 20 years do you want to look back and think - I could have gone to Columbia, a school that would have made me really happy?

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Helmholtz
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby Helmholtz » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:39 pm

Headybrah wrote:seems like you want columbia.

you will get big law.

but in 20 years do you want to look back and think - I could have gone to Columbia, a school that would have made me really happy?


Frankly, if you're looking back in twenty years and mourning the day you decided not to transfer to a (albeit better) school outside your target region, you did something wrong with your career.

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Helmholtz
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby Helmholtz » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:40 pm

flexityflex86 wrote:i understand you're leaving boston from a boston feeder school, but can't you say, "As much as I loved my 1L year in BU, I did have a fear I would not be sitting at this interview today if I stayed, and I would rather have had gainful employment in New York where I could save up enough to return to Boston someday than struggle in Boston."?


Is this a joke?

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Helmholtz
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby Helmholtz » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:45 pm

unc0mm0n1 wrote:
JusticeHarlan wrote:
unc0mm0n1 wrote:I suspect Boston firms wouldn't look down on a Chicago degree. I just can't see a hiring partner telling you well you shouldn't have transfered to one of the best schools in the nation. As long as you have a good answer for the question of why you transfered you'll be fine. There are a ton of Chicago people working for the most prestigous firms in Boston. If you're really worried I'd write one of the partners at Ropes (or another prestigous Boston firm) who went to Chicago and ask them the question you asked on the board. I bet you no one would hold U of C against you.

This is true for someone who went to Chicago for 1L. But for someone who was in Boston, at a Boston feeder school, then bailed for a different city? It's a tough, tough sell. You could say, you wanted to experience the educational opportunities of Chicago, but the skepticism will be pretty high.

I guess it depends on how strong OPs ties are to Boston. If she can make a strong pitch for wanting to stay in Boston (grew up there, family is there, hates the Yankees, etc.) it might work to say the reason for heading to Chicago was the education, which is admittedly one of the few schools that might work for. But even so, it's a hard sell to a fairly insular market, and if OP's ties are weak, then it might be impossible. I've got pretty strong ties, and this was the main reason I didn't apply to CCN.

Obviously, going to Chicago is going to open more doors in more cities. But that's exactly why people from Boston will be skeptical.


I just don't believe this. The program I am in gives us opportunities to meet hiring partners every week and they all say go to the best school you can go to. I told them I want to work in Chicago but I got into Harvard and of course they told me go to Harvard because it will open more doors than say Northwestern. If I went to NW for my first year and had a chance to transfer to Harvard I would do it in a heartbeat and I bet I could still get Chicago probably easier. BU and Chicago are not peers or even close to peers Chicago has way better opportunities in every sector including clerking, in-house and big law. OP please don't listen to the people in this thread or even me for that matter write someone at a law firm. You'd be surprised at how friendly most of them are and they'd answer your questions and I'd bet dollars to donuts they'd say a Chicago degree will not hurt you in your Boston job search. BTW, where is everybody else who voted for Chicago? Nobody else is backing up their vote.

Edit: The only way I could see this is if BU was free and UC was sticker but both are sticker. OP go to Chicago, make great connections, get a great job, profit.


I'm sorry, but I don't think you know what you're talking about. Going to HLS as a 1L instead of Northwestern is a no-brainer even if you want Chicago. Very different situation than what OP's facing.

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bk1
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Re: BU, Chicago, or Wait?

Postby bk1 » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:57 pm

Helmholtz wrote:
flexityflex86 wrote:i understand you're leaving boston from a boston feeder school, but can't you say, "As much as I loved my 1L year in BU, I did have a fear I would not be sitting at this interview today if I stayed, and I would rather have had gainful employment in New York where I could save up enough to return to Boston someday than struggle in Boston."?


Is this a joke?


Dear god I hope so. Though I hear people in Boston love it when subtly you trash their city and lavish praise on New York.




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