To transfer or not?

A forum for those current students who are or may be transferring from one school to another. Post any questions, advice, or other transfer related comments here.
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Chicago or Illinois?

Stay at Illinois
25
56%
Go to Chicago
20
44%
 
Total votes: 45

jimmy55555
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:28 pm

To transfer or not?

Postby jimmy55555 » Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:33 pm

Got accepted to UChicago as a transfer, but my current school (U Illinois) offered me a full scholarship to stay. I am currently top 5%.

My goal is Chicago BigLaw and I am confident that I can stay in the top 10% + LR at Illinois.

Should I stay to save money? Or move for more prestige?

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You Gotta Have Faith
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby You Gotta Have Faith » Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:42 pm

If Biglaw in Chicago is your only objective, you'd probably save money by staying at UIUC. You should get Biglaw in Chicago with either option in this case. Your call really. I was thinking Chicago, until you said full scholarship. Full-rides are enticing. If it were me, I'd probably just save the $$.

If you care about lawyer and academic prestige a LOT, then Chicago. Lay prestige won't be all that exciting with either option, as surprising as that may sound.

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Cavalier
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby Cavalier » Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:50 pm

ITE I think Illinois is safer. With a full ride, you won't be totally screwed if you can't get BigLaw from Illinois, whereas, if you borrow the full amount of tuition for Chicago and fail to get big law, you will be in a lot of trouble.

I don't know how 2Ls (now rising 3Ls) did in the 2009 OCI at Chicago, or how the Chicago BigLaw market is doing. I'm risk averse, and as enticing as Chicago would be, unless I was very confident that I would get BigLaw as a transfer student I would probably play it safe at Illinois.

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98234872348
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby 98234872348 » Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:52 pm

Cavalier wrote:ITE I think Illinois is safer. With a full ride, you won't be totally screwed if you can't get BigLaw from Illinois, whereas, if you borrow the full amount of tuition for Chicago and fail to get big law, you will be in a lot of trouble.

I don't know how 2Ls (now rising 3Ls) did in the 2009 OCI at Chicago, or how the Chicago BigLaw market is doing. I'm risk averse, and as enticing as Chicago would be, unless I was very confident that I would get BigLaw as a transfer student I would probably play it safe at Illinois.

I concur with this.

2009 Prospective
Posts: 236
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 12:32 pm

Re: To transfer or not?

Postby 2009 Prospective » Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:52 pm

I'm guessing you got in ED if you know this early? If so, isn't Chicago's offer binding? If not, I'd vote to stay if you don't care about academia etc.

jimmy55555
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:28 pm

Re: To transfer or not?

Postby jimmy55555 » Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:56 pm

^No ED. So it seems that most people who are willing to rationalize their thoughts in the form of a comment seem to think I should stay.

Illinois top 10% + LR > Chicago transfer (basically median) at 2010 OCI?

Thanks for all the comments thus far.

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98234872348
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby 98234872348 » Wed Jun 09, 2010 5:03 pm

jimmy55555 wrote:^No ED. So it seems that most people who are willing to rationalize their thoughts in the form of a comment seem to think I should stay.

Illinois top 10% + LR > Chicago transfer (basically median) at 2010 OCI?

Thanks for all the comments thus far.

I have heard that you're not necessarily treated as "median" for all effects and purposes; the employers are going to see your gpa and class rank from your school and, if those employers interview at UIUC, they'll be able to evaluate you as a potential candidate. However, I don't see that there is much added benefit if you're already in a position where you should be able to get some sort of gainful employment (unless UIUC's OCI goes to hell). Unless you were shooting for academia or had some specific goals that could only be accomplished with a UChi degree, it just doesn't seem worth it to take on the extra debt.

jimmy55555
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:28 pm

Re: To transfer or not?

Postby jimmy55555 » Wed Jun 09, 2010 5:08 pm

mistergoft wrote:
jimmy55555 wrote: Unless you were shooting for academia or had some specific goals that could only be accomplished with a UChi degree, it just doesn't seem worth it to take on the extra debt.


What if I want a clerkship? I'm worried that I will not be able to make LR at Chicago and that this will adversely affect me.

I would consider academia down the line. But would Chi still be better if I didn't make LR?

2009 Prospective
Posts: 236
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 12:32 pm

Re: To transfer or not?

Postby 2009 Prospective » Wed Jun 09, 2010 6:13 pm

jimmy55555 wrote:^No ED. So it seems that most people who are willing to rationalize their thoughts in the form of a comment seem to think I should stay.

Illinois top 10% + LR > Chicago transfer (basically median) at 2010 OCI?

Thanks for all the comments thus far.


Damn congrats on the quick turnaround, we haven't even gotten spring grades back yet. Good luck deciding.

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Cavalier
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby Cavalier » Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:27 pm

jimmy55555 wrote:
mistergoft wrote:
jimmy55555 wrote: Unless you were shooting for academia or had some specific goals that could only be accomplished with a UChi degree, it just doesn't seem worth it to take on the extra debt.


What if I want a clerkship? I'm worried that I will not be able to make LR at Chicago and that this will adversely affect me.

I would consider academia down the line. But would Chi still be better if I didn't make LR?

I think ~20% of Chicago grads do a clerkship, so obviously you don't need to be on law review at Chicago. But if you think you can maintain your place in the top 5% at Illinois, I think that would be preferable to uncertainty at Chicago. If you keep doing well in your classes, you'll have an impressive transcript, and you'll impress your professors (who almost certainly clerked) who can help you get a clerkship.

If academia is your goal then transfer to Chicago, work your ass off, get onto law review, publish something impressive, get a court of appeals clerkship, and maybe you'll stand a small chance at getting academia.

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thesealocust
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby thesealocust » Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:35 pm

nm
Last edited by thesealocust on Sat Jun 26, 2010 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Cavalier
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby Cavalier » Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:58 pm

thesealocust wrote:
Cavalier wrote:I think ~20% of Chicago grads do a clerkship

I'm filling for a divorce. CHECK YOU STATISTICS.


http://www.law.uchicago.edu/prospective/careerstats

Career Services Statistics

With what type of employers do University of Chicago graduates begin their careers?

* 72-75% Law Firms
* 18-25% Judicial Clerks
* 3-4% Government
* 2-3% Public Interest
* 1-2% Business and Industry
* 1-2% Academia

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thesealocust
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby thesealocust » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:08 pm

nm
Last edited by thesealocust on Sat Jun 26, 2010 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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thesealocust
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby thesealocust » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:11 pm

nm
Last edited by thesealocust on Sat Jun 26, 2010 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Cavalier
Posts: 1994
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby Cavalier » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:39 pm

Those statistics look like BS. They are about clerkships with Article III Judges (i.e. prestigious clerkships). They say 13% of Chicago grads clerk for Article III Judges, and 13% of Chicago grads clerk at all. In other words, not a single Chicago grad clerks for a state court. I find that hard to believe. Even Harvard and Yale grads take non-Article III clerkships, so I assume Chicago grads do as well.

Journeybound
Posts: 254
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:12 pm

Re: To transfer or not?

Postby Journeybound » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:45 pm

Jimmy, Congrats on your acceptance. Did you wait for your official transcript to go through LSAC, or did you send an unofficial copy to Chicago? Thanks!

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thesealocust
Posts: 8447
Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:50 pm

Re: To transfer or not?

Postby thesealocust » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:52 pm

edit
Last edited by thesealocust on Sat Jun 26, 2010 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Cavalier
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby Cavalier » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:58 pm

The NLJ chart from 2005 shows about 20% going to clerkships. Maybe Chicago actually is in decline.

http://www.law.com/pdf/nlj/20080414empl ... trends.pdf

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thesealocust
Posts: 8447
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby thesealocust » Wed Jun 09, 2010 9:00 pm

edit
Last edited by thesealocust on Sat Jun 26, 2010 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

stinger35
Posts: 615
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 2:37 pm

Re: To transfer or not?

Postby stinger35 » Wed Jun 09, 2010 10:04 pm

Really tough call....overall, I'd say stay but Chicago is extreme prestige.

Just wondering... how did you hear so quick??

ToTransferOrNot
Posts: 1928
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:45 am

Re: To transfer or not?

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Wed Jun 09, 2010 10:22 pm

Mayer Brown: University of Michigan, University of Chicago, Northwestern, Harvard. That's it for the SA class this year.
Kirkland: I think they hired a bit more broadly, down to Indiana, but still.
Sidley/Jenner/etc: Probably the same story.

Top 5-10% at UIUC is fantastic. LR is great. Honestly, you have a good chance at HYS, so I hope you're planning on applying to them. This is a rough decision. Also, you should be aware that the LR write-on for Chicago started today... unless things changed from last year, potential transfers have to do the competition along with rising 1Ls, so yeah. (And Chicago isn't the only school like that--you need to be on top of checking the write-on process for transfers. Harvard does the same thing Chicago does.)

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bwv812
Posts: 548
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby bwv812 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 1:06 am

.

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Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 141
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Thu Jun 10, 2010 1:09 am

A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

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20160810
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Re: To transfer or not?

Postby 20160810 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:37 am

The only reason I could see for going to Chicago would be if you're interested in a career in legal academia

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XxSpyKEx
Posts: 1741
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2006 5:48 am

Re: To transfer or not?

Postby XxSpyKEx » Fri Jun 11, 2010 7:11 pm

Cavalier wrote:ITE I think Illinois is safer. With a full ride, you won't be totally screwed if you can't get BigLaw from Illinois, whereas, if you borrow the full amount of tuition for Chicago and fail to get big law, you will be in a lot of trouble.


TCR.

Also, it sounds like you are pretty much guaranteed LR at UIUC, and from what ToTransferOrNot has posted in the past, it sounds like you are pretty much guaranteed to not get LR at UChi if you transfer. Personally, I would take UIUC + LR @ $0 /year over UChi + NO LR @ $70,000 /year in a heartbeat. However, if you get into any of HYS, I think that changes things a bit (and in your position you should apply to all 3 of those schools).




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