UVA Class of 2013

(housing, friendships, future exams, all things 2013)
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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 06, 2010 10:48 am

Doritos wrote:Ending protections for homosexuals is calling for discrimination.

TITCR. It's also worth noting this is a state that, 60 years ago, shut down its entire public school system in order to prevent compliance with a federal ruling that segregated schools was discrimination.

I am kind of hoping that this will finally motivate the Virginia legislature to act and pass a bill formally recognizing sexual orientation as protected from discrimination. It'll be interesting to see if the governor tries to veto that, though; after all this fuss about how it should be the legislative process that decides, what grounds would he veto it on?

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YCrevolution
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby YCrevolution » Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:13 am

..

slider
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby slider » Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:28 am

vanwinkle wrote:
Doritos wrote:Ending protections for homosexuals is calling for discrimination.

TITCR. It's also worth noting this is a state that, 60 years ago, shut down its entire public school system in order to prevent compliance with a federal ruling that segregated schools was discrimination.

I am kind of hoping that this will finally motivate the Virginia legislature to act and pass a bill formally recognizing sexual orientation as protected from discrimination. It'll be interesting to see if the governor tries to veto that, though; after all this fuss about how it should be the legislative process that decides, what grounds would he veto it on?


Wow. This is an eye opener. Coming from a state where sexual orientation is protected from discrimination, we sometimes takes these liberties for granted. I didn't realize Virginia lacked this legislation.

Is this the reason behind the law school's diversity pledge?

BigJiggaJ87
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby BigJiggaJ87 » Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:41 am

Are there any decent public golf courses around? I doubt I'll have much time to play but still...

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:15 pm

slider wrote:Wow. This is an eye opener. Coming from a state where sexual orientation is protected from discrimination, we sometimes takes these liberties for granted. I didn't realize Virginia lacked this legislation.

Is this the reason behind the law school's diversity pledge?

Virginia has lacked this legislation, and while the previous governor issued an executive order prohibiting discrimination based on sexual orientation, there were protests from people (including the man who is now governor) that he didn't have the authority to do that.

Also, the way I understand it, the diversity pledge came about as a response to an attack on a pair of UVA Law students after they were perceived to be homosexual. That happened in... 2006, I believe. The pledge is designed to encourage students to take steps to combat what is apparently a problem here in VA even in the 21st century.

Oddly I can't find anything about that incident at all. I remember reading about it when I signed the Diversity Pledge, but I can't find anything online about it. It's like they want to talk about the pledge and how great it is, but nobody wants to talk about what prompted its existence.

I found a video with someone saying, "Three years ago, the student body just felt the need to bring diverse issues into the forefront of the law school..." Yeah, they just felt the need, nothing was wrong at all happened that motivated it. :roll:

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Muckduck
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby Muckduck » Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:50 pm

Doritos wrote:
Muckduck wrote:
YCrevolution wrote:On a completely unrelated note, the Commonwealth's stupid AG sent a letter to Virginia's public universities yesterday (leaked to various media outlets today) warning them that they can't prohibit discrimination based on sexual orienation.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 01582.html


Looks like Cuccinelli is just trying to make sure that state policies originate from policymakers, not intermediary bureaucracies. This doesn't suggest at all that he is calling for discrimination.


Ending protections for homosexuals is calling for discrimination.

"It is my advice that the law and public policy of the Commonwealth of Virginia prohibit a college or university from including 'sexual orientation,' 'gender identity,' 'gender expression,' or like classification as a protected class within its non-discrimination policy absent specific authorization from the General Assembly"

So give them authorization. Why do they want to rescind protections in the first place? Oh Virginia...I love your state but hate your politics.


False. Don't be so short-sighted.

Not that Cuccinelli is intending this, but by removing anti-discrimination policies put in place by those who didn't have the authority to pass them, this is going to put pressure onto the state legislature that can legitimately get the job done. At the end of the day, if enough Virginians/public interest groups mobilize, this unpleasant step could result in lasting anti-discrimination for homosexuals...

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gladiator
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby gladiator » Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:50 pm

BigJiggaJ87 wrote:Are there any decent public golf courses around? I doubt I'll have much time to play but still...


Birdwood is UVA's golf course and there are student discounts.

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RVP11
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby RVP11 » Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:52 pm

BigJiggaJ87 wrote:Are there any decent public golf courses around? I doubt I'll have much time to play but still...


Not public, but plenty of 3Ls spent more time out there than in the law school:

http://www.boarsheadinn.com/Golf/About- ... Passes.asp

BigJiggaJ87
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby BigJiggaJ87 » Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:55 pm

Looks great. I better start hitting some balls again...

How much are the greens fees (18 riding week/weekends) for students?

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:40 pm

Muckduck wrote:False. Don't be so short-sighted.

Not that Cuccinelli is intending this, but by removing anti-discrimination policies put in place by those who didn't have the authority to pass them, this is going to put pressure onto the state legislature that can legitimately get the job done. At the end of the day, if enough Virginians/public interest groups mobilize, this unpleasant step could result in lasting anti-discrimination for homosexuals...

It's short-sighted to label an action discriminatory just because it spurs an appropriate anti-discrimination response? By that argument segregation was the most pro-minority policy ever because it eventually led to the Civil Rights Act. Let's celebrate the heroes who created segregation for ultimately causing racial equality! :roll:

It does not make sense to say that schools don't have the authority to currently get this done. They have the right to set policies that provide for a safe learning environment for all students, and an expansive anti-discrimination policy arguably falls within that. Unless the VA legislature has expressly forbidden such an anti-discrimination policy it's not exactly clear-cut that these schools can't do this at all. The lack of affirmative legislation by the state legislature does not make this action prohibited.

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Kohinoor
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby Kohinoor » Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:50 pm

Muckduck wrote:
False. Don't be so short-sighted.

Not that Cuccinelli is intending this, but by removing anti-discrimination policies put in place by those who didn't have the authority to pass them, this is going to put pressure onto the state legislature that can legitimately get the job done. At the end of the day, if enough Virginians/public interest groups mobilize, this unpleasant step could result in lasting anti-discrimination for homosexuals...

Don't be so naive. The repeated failure of anti-discrimination bills necessitated the school policies. Theoretically, this unpleasant step could result in lasting anti-discrimination for homosexuals, but realistically it won't. Theoretically, the schools having to take matters into their own hands should have shamed the legislature into action, but it didn't. Instead, somebody got the Attorney General to force them to revoke their protections. That's a strong signal of the stance of the state government on this issue.

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badwithpseudonyms
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby badwithpseudonyms » Sat Mar 06, 2010 2:44 pm

Kohinoor wrote:Don't be so naive. The repeated failure of anti-discrimination bills necessitated the school policies. Theoretically, this unpleasant step could result in lasting anti-discrimination for homosexuals, but realistically it won't. Theoretically, the schools having to take matters into their own hands should have shamed the legislature into action, but it didn't. Instead, somebody got the Attorney General to force them to revoke their protections. That's a strong signal of the stance of the state government on this issue.

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Muckduck
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby Muckduck » Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:18 pm

Good stances. Let's take a defeatist attitude towards society's problems and try to solve them with band-aids. Sweet.

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:20 pm

Muckduck wrote:Good stances. Let's take a defeatist attitude towards society's problems and try to solve them with band-aids. Sweet.

Proactively enacting and enforcing anti-discrimination policies when the state legislature refuses to act is a defeatist attitude? What planet are you from?

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Muckduck
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby Muckduck » Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:32 pm

I was reacting to an interesting article. I'm simply suggesting that this isn't the end of the world, this unfortunate turn of events may turn out for good. Unlike many of you who are providing many grand monologues against the evils of discrimination. I don't disagree with you. Law school has made many of you too argumentative. Or maybe you want everyone to think that you are white knights?

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:51 pm

Muckduck wrote:I was reacting to an interesting article. I'm simply suggesting that this isn't the end of the world, this unfortunate turn of events may turn out for good. Unlike many of you who are providing many grand monologues against the evils of discrimination. I don't disagree with you. Law school has made many of you too argumentative. Or maybe you want everyone to think that you are white knights?

Nobody here is suggesting it's the end of the world, but we are suggesting that it's not something that should be painted in any kind of positive light, as you have suggested. Your labeling people who support universities' proactive policies against discrimination as "defeatist" is especially baffling and confusing, as it makes no logical sense at all. Referring to the only recourse that universities have available when the political system continues to fail as "band-aids" also makes no sense. It's more akin to keeping civil rights on life support until a cure is developed for the entire state. They're doing everything they can to combat the problem, which is pretty much the opposite of "defeatist".

Law school teaches you to spot the flaws in arguments and poke holes in them.

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Muckduck
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby Muckduck » Sat Mar 06, 2010 5:31 pm

vanwinkle wrote:
Muckduck wrote:False. Don't be so short-sighted.

Not that Cuccinelli is intending this, but by removing anti-discrimination policies put in place by those who didn't have the authority to pass them, this is going to put pressure onto the state legislature that can legitimately get the job done. At the end of the day, if enough Virginians/public interest groups mobilize, this unpleasant step could result in lasting anti-discrimination for homosexuals...

It's short-sighted to label an action discriminatory just because it spurs an appropriate anti-discrimination response? By that argument segregation was the most pro-minority policy ever because it eventually led to the Civil Rights Act. Let's celebrate the heroes who created segregation for ultimately causing racial equality! :roll:

It does not make sense to say that schools don't have the authority to currently get this done. They have the right to set policies that provide for a safe learning environment for all students, and an expansive anti-discrimination policy arguably falls within that. Unless the VA legislature has expressly forbidden such an anti-discrimination policy it's not exactly clear-cut that these schools can't do this at all. The lack of affirmative legislation by the state legislature does not make this action prohibited.


And to use as many fallacious analogies as you can it seems...

But no need to drag this out any longer I guess, especially since we seem to agree on the central issues here.

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 06, 2010 6:08 pm

Muckduck wrote:And to use as many fallacious analogies as you can it seems...

There's nothing fallacious about analogizing one discriminatory move that prompts a response to another.

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Muckduck
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby Muckduck » Sat Mar 06, 2010 6:16 pm

You were projecting pro-segregation/racist sentiments onto me (someone who agrees with you that anti-discrimination policies are important) because I disagreed with your perception of this policy reversal.

Fallacious analogy or not?

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jdavid901
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby jdavid901 » Sat Mar 06, 2010 6:43 pm

Sooo, what do you guys think of the military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy? ...I'm kidding, I'm kidding... Seriously though, what is everyone doing this summer, 0Ls and 1Ls+ alike?

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:03 pm

Muckduck wrote:You were projecting pro-segregation/racist sentiments onto me (someone who agrees with you that anti-discrimination policies are important) because I disagreed with your perception of this policy reversal.

Fallacious analogy or not?

I wasn't projecting it on to you, I was using it to rebut your point. I hope you can learn to tell the difference, as it's a rather important skill for law school.

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YCrevolution
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby YCrevolution » Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:14 pm

..

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Cavalier
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby Cavalier » Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:35 pm

I'll be an RA as well.

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Muckduck
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby Muckduck » Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:37 pm

vanwinkle wrote:
Muckduck wrote:You were projecting pro-segregation/racist sentiments onto me (someone who agrees with you that anti-discrimination policies are important) because I disagreed with your perception of this policy reversal.

Fallacious analogy or not?

I wasn't projecting it on to you, I was using it to rebut your point. I hope you can learn to tell the difference, as it's a rather important skill for law school.


Haha. I'll take your word for it.

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OneKnight
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Re: UVA Class of 2013

Postby OneKnight » Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:40 pm

jdavid901 wrote:Sooo, what do you guys think of the military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy? ...I'm kidding, I'm kidding... Seriously though, what is everyone doing this summer, 0Ls and 1Ls+ alike?


I'm going to be a beach bum in the Ventura County area. Seriously :)




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