rondemarino wrote:TTT-LS: Playing with this idea, what data can one reasonably expect law schools to have by January 15th?
Class of 2011 Data (current 2Ls):
- % of class with paid summer positions in 2009 (breakdown by law firm, govt., RA, PI)
- % of class with offers for paid summer positions in 2010 (similar breakdown)
Class of 2010 (current 3Ls)
- % with employment offers
Class of 2009 (graduates)
- % currently employed or in deferral land (breakdown and salary)
Each school's career office unquestionably has this kind of data, with a few caveats:
First, career offices may not be able to give exact numbers as to the c/o 2009, since firms have been rescinding offers, buying some people out, extending deferrals, and doing lots of other things that might cause (1) what was an offer of employment to evaporate; or (2) someone with a really bad offer (e.g., 2 year unpaid deferral) to begin looking elsewhere, such that they effectively are unemployed.
Second, I'm not sure career offices will be ready to give data on "paid" 2L summer employment by January, since many gov/PI employers, plus some small firms, do not hire until the spring. Large law firm hiring, on the other hand, will absolutely be over by then, such that the career offices can definitely give you numbers if they want to.
Third, for current 3Ls (c/o 2010), it may be tough to nail down numbers for firms like Dechert that have not made final decisions on who to hire from their summer classes. But still, there must be some rough numbers floating around internally that schools could disclose if they wanted to.
The bottom line is this: schools have the data, even if they claim otherwise. Career offices are surely providing info to their school's dean, even if there are small uncertainties built into the data.
This is highly credited. To take it in a different direction (which TTT-LS might not ascribe to), if someone with an acceptance in hand contacts a law school and asks to see this information, and the school's response is "we don't have that, sorry," your assumption should be that the school does not value you enough to be honest. The concerns I've heard some schools raise about privacy are just a pretext for not wanting to disclose all the data because they are hiding the worst of it and overrepresenting the best.
At least at our school each career services counselor has a list of 20-30 students, and they have a friendly competition each year to see who does the best. Dean Guthrie's email out to the 2Ls cites to "approximately 50% with summer associate positions," but there is certainly a lot more to discover about that statistic. Per usual, I want to see all law schools operating in a more ethical manner than their historical reputations, so I would suggest anyone considering Vanderbilt to contact the CSO asking them to release better information about 2L and 3L hiring.
Until people convince the ABA to start requiring better employment reporting, schools will only do so if you make it clear their reputations depend on making ethical representations about employment outcomes. And if enough of you do it, the schools that are hiding the bottom halves of their classes will take a hit.
In short, the beatings will continue until morale improves.