TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

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Roth Mantel
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Roth Mantel » Thu Sep 03, 2009 12:14 am

PKSebben wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I completely struck out at firms that did OCI at my original school as well as my new school. I also struck out with my mailings to firms that do OCI at my original school but not my new school, presumably because they don't buy my pitch that I wouldn't mind going back to their market. I can't blame them too much--they're right--but I would sure as hell rather go back to that market as opposed to the jobless shitstorm that I've put myself in to now.

Transferring: Absolutely the worst decision of my life. T40, top 1% to a T6, wrote on to a freaking secondary journal at the T6 even, tripple the debt, two goddamned callbacks. If one of the callbacks works out, great, but at this point, I am surveying several of the higher bridges in the area.


I think it's too early to be looking at bridges. It's a brave new world out there with legal hiring -- you'll need to see what hiring looks like during the upturn to judge your decision fairly, I think.


I agree. First of all, you have two callbacks, so there's a solid chance something will work out for you now. Second, even if you don't get an offer from one of the callbacks, 3L recruiting may be better than usual next year because I suspect firms will err to the side of under-enrolling this summer. Sure, 3L recruiting is even worse than usual this year, but that's probably in large part because a lot of firms over-enrolled last summer; this summer might well be exactly the opposite, and thus so might next year's 3L OCI...

Plus, even if neither of those possibilities work out, you could keep your grades up, clerk, and probably land a good job coming off of that.

I'm not saying that your situation is ideal, or even necessarily that transferring was the right move, but you haven't struck out -- that was only your first swing. Hang in there.

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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Sep 03, 2009 12:22 am

T20 transfer 2 interview 0 callbacks. I don't think/haven't heard any transfers at my school getting a callback yet either. I am starting to mail out resumes/cover letters. We will see if anything comes up.

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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Sep 03, 2009 12:28 am

transferguy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I completely struck out at firms that did OCI at my original school as well as my new school. I also struck out with my mailings to firms that do OCI at my original school but not my new school, presumably because they don't buy my pitch that I wouldn't mind going back to their market. I can't blame them too much--they're right--but I would sure as hell rather go back to that market as opposed to the jobless shitstorm that I've put myself in to now.

Transferring: Absolutely the worst decision of my life. T40, top 1% to a T6, wrote on to a freaking secondary journal at the T6 even, tripple the debt, two goddamned callbacks. If one of the callbacks works out, great, but at this point, I am surveying several of the higher bridges in the area.


How well would you say you interview?


(I am the quoted anon)

I'm not the world's best interviewer, but I'm not awful, either.

PK--that is assuming things ever turn up for the CO 2011. It is quite possible that if things improve in the biglaw hiring market, it will be too late to help the CO 2011; we'll just end up as a discarded class. Obviously, I'm going to be doing everything I can to get a clerkship--that was already my plan, and now it is even more important since I'm going to need to reset the hiring clock.

If transferring loses me even one year of working at biglaw, I'm looking at a $260,000 mistake (~$120k salary(assuming I get some kind of job after graduation), 120k extra debt, $24k from the 2L summer) --and that ISN'T including interest on the extra loans. Hell, even if it just loses me one summer, transferring will have cost me $150,000, again, without interest on the extra loan money. I'm having a very, very difficult time seeing the "silver lining" that people keep preaching, particularly because I honestly don't believe that the biglaw market is going to recover quickly enough to ever correct for the CO 2011.

I'm going to have a much fancier piece of paper that is going to increase my debt by three times, for *inferior* job prospects, at least in the short term. We all know that the short term largely dominates the long term in this process.

Regarding the two callbacks that I have--one of the firms is giving a huge number of callbacks. There were two other people on callbacks at the same time as me, as well as other people on the morning schedule; it was the first day they scheduled callbacks. We were told that we would hear back after they finished callbacks in a few *weeks.* I wouldn't say that gives me a good shot at an offer. No idea on the other firm, but I know that I couldn't fit in my callback with them until next week because they already had a full callback schedule for this week.

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nativedelta
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby nativedelta » Thu Sep 03, 2009 12:51 am

My school does 7 weeks of rolling OCI. We are now in week 3 of actual interviews, but all the bids have gone out as of yesterday for the remaining 4 weeks.

Bid on 15 firms
Finished 4 screening interviews so far
Received 1 callback
Received 1 rejection
4 more screening interviews to go next week
crossing fingers

transferguy
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby transferguy » Thu Sep 03, 2009 1:14 am

Anonymous User wrote:I completely struck out at firms that did OCI at my original school as well as my new school. I also struck out with my mailings to firms that do OCI at my original school but not my new school, presumably because they don't buy my pitch that I wouldn't mind going back to their market. I can't blame them too much--they're right--but I would sure as hell rather go back to that market as opposed to the jobless shitstorm that I've put myself in to now.

Transferring: Absolutely the worst decision of my life. T40, top 1% to a T6, wrote on to a freaking secondary journal at the T6 even, tripple the debt, two goddamned callbacks. If one of the callbacks works out, great, but at this point, I am surveying several of the higher bridges in the area.



Despite your anonymity, I am familiar enough with your stats to know who you are, and therefore know your 1L and 2L schools. Given the school you left and the school you are now attending, I don't see how the "regional" firms from your old schools's state can interpret your transfer as "fleeing." You are literally like right down the block from you old school. I made a similar move (with respect to geography and markets between old school and new) and have received a lot of callbacks in my old school's region. I don't think I had to do a lot of persuading interviewers to ensure them that I wasn't fleeing, either.

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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:03 pm

transferguy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I completely struck out at firms that did OCI at my original school as well as my new school. I also struck out with my mailings to firms that do OCI at my original school but not my new school, presumably because they don't buy my pitch that I wouldn't mind going back to their market. I can't blame them too much--they're right--but I would sure as hell rather go back to that market as opposed to the jobless shitstorm that I've put myself in to now.

Transferring: Absolutely the worst decision of my life. T40, top 1% to a T6, wrote on to a freaking secondary journal at the T6 even, tripple the debt, two goddamned callbacks. If one of the callbacks works out, great, but at this point, I am surveying several of the higher bridges in the area.



Despite your anonymity, I am familiar enough with your stats to know who you are, and therefore know your 1L and 2L schools. Given the school you left and the school you are now attending, I don't see how the "regional" firms from your old schools's state can interpret your transfer as "fleeing." You are literally like right down the block from you old school. I made a similar move (with respect to geography and markets between old school and new) and have received a lot of callbacks in my old school's region. I don't think I had to do a lot of persuading interviewers to ensure them that I wasn't fleeing, either.


Yeah, obviously the other transfer folks that have been on the boards are probably going to know who I am.

You have to understand--none of the firms from my original market interviewed at my new school; everything I did in the old market was resume-mailing. One of the firms that was going to interview at the new school completely cancelled its summer program, another cancelled its participation at the new school for lack of interest.

The geography isn't the problem--what I gave up by transferring makes my desire to return look more supsicious than most people. I'm assuming that is what the problem is, otherwise the lack of any interest in my application materials from my old market is just completely illogical.

Anonymous User
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:17 am

Anonymous User wrote:
transferguy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I completely struck out at firms that did OCI at my original school as well as my new school. I also struck out with my mailings to firms that do OCI at my original school but not my new school, presumably because they don't buy my pitch that I wouldn't mind going back to their market. I can't blame them too much--they're right--but I would sure as hell rather go back to that market as opposed to the jobless shitstorm that I've put myself in to now.

Transferring: Absolutely the worst decision of my life. T40, top 1% to a T6, wrote on to a freaking secondary journal at the T6 even, tripple the debt, two goddamned callbacks. If one of the callbacks works out, great, but at this point, I am surveying several of the higher bridges in the area.



Despite your anonymity, I am familiar enough with your stats to know who you are, and therefore know your 1L and 2L schools. Given the school you left and the school you are now attending, I don't see how the "regional" firms from your old schools's state can interpret your transfer as "fleeing." You are literally like right down the block from you old school. I made a similar move (with respect to geography and markets between old school and new) and have received a lot of callbacks in my old school's region. I don't think I had to do a lot of persuading interviewers to ensure them that I wasn't fleeing, either.


Yeah, obviously the other transfer folks that have been on the boards are probably going to know who I am.

You have to understand--none of the firms from my original market interviewed at my new school; everything I did in the old market was resume-mailing. One of the firms that was going to interview at the new school completely cancelled its summer program, another cancelled its participation at the new school for lack of interest.

The geography isn't the problem--what I gave up by transferring makes my desire to return look more supsicious than most people. I'm assuming that is what the problem is, otherwise the lack of any interest in my application materials from my old market is just completely illogical.


Are you kidding? Most firms from Wisconsin interviewed at my new school, which is no where near that region. I really don't understand how those firms could not hit Chicago considering it is literally a hop-skip away. In fact, the Wisconsin firms that interviewed at my new school were ecstatic about even getting people to come interview with them (e.g. Whyte (the largest firm in Wisconsin) had a total of 6 slots, 2 of which were taken). I, unfortunately, didn't sign up for interviews in Wisconsin like I probably should have.

BTW- are you still planning on dropping out before tuition becomes due?

Anonymous User
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 08, 2009 10:13 am

Not part of the anonymous chain re: Chicago.

e.g. Whyte (the largest firm in Wisconsin) had a total of 6 slots, 2 of which were taken)


Um, where did you get this? Whyte is not "the largest firm in Wisconsin." It's a hundred lawyer Milwaukee firm.

The big Milwaukee firms are

Foley
Quarles
Godfrey & Kahn
Reinhart
Michael Best

Of these, most are under one degree or another of financial strain. Compensation got much, much too high in the Milwaukee market. None of the firms can really handle it.

Anonymous User
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:51 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Not part of the anonymous chain re: Chicago.

e.g. Whyte (the largest firm in Wisconsin) had a total of 6 slots, 2 of which were taken)


Um, where did you get this? Whyte is not "the largest firm in Wisconsin." It's a hundred lawyer Milwaukee firm.

The big Milwaukee firms are

Foley
Quarles
Godfrey & Kahn
Reinhart
Michael Best

Of these, most are under one degree or another of financial strain. Compensation got much, much too high in the Milwaukee market. None of the firms can really handle it.


HAHAHA. The fucking whyte interviewer told me that. I didn't think the guy was lying to me. Wow.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Tue Sep 08, 2009 3:58 pm

I've never even heard of Whyte.

Foley is in a league all its own in Wisconsin, I'm pretty sure it is the only Vault firm with an office of any kind in Milwaukee (and the Milwaukee office is Foley's main office).

Quarles and Brady isn't doing a summer program this year.

Add Whyte Hirschboeck Dudek to that list, it is about the same size as Reinhart. Of course, they are only taking 4 summers this year, and one of them is going to be a 1L from the diversity clerkship BS.

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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 08, 2009 5:08 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:I've never even heard of Whyte.

Add Whyte Hirschboeck Dudek to that list, it is about the same size as Reinhart.


Wow.

You never answered my question, are you still planning on dropping out of Chicago before tuition becomes due?

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Tue Sep 08, 2009 5:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
ToTransferOrNot wrote:I've never even heard of Whyte.

Add Whyte Hirschboeck Dudek to that list, it is about the same size as Reinhart.


Wow.

You never answered my question, are you still planning on dropping out of Chicago before tuition becomes due?


Wow, lol, I'm not sure how I missed that. Quoted for me being a tired idiot today.
I know a lot of people at WHD--I'm having a hard time believing they said they are the biggest firm in Wisconsin--that's probably why I didn't make the connection right away.

Also, I never said I was going to drop out before tuition came due, I said it was something I was considering. While it is still something I'm considering, because I'm in an absolute panic about being $180k in debt, I'm leaning no, at this point.

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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 09, 2009 7:49 pm

transfer to t-10.

20 interviews
12 cbs
1 ding
waiting on rest (fingers crossed)
no offers yet though, which is why I have to take every cb.

I feel like I've gotten very lucky. Have work experience. This probably helped a lot.

No problem with interviewers being snobby about transfers. The only question I tended to get regarding it was why I left. If you know why, and can say so articulately, this question shouldn't pose an obstacle.

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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Sep 28, 2009 2:26 am

Transferred to HLS from t14. The grade change left a lot of students in the dust, while all of the transfers in my class did amazingly well. It's an unusual situation, but I think this was the best year to be an HLS transfer. I personally got callbacks from more prestigious firms than most of my friends on Law Review.

Definitely glad I transferred.

goldschlager
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby goldschlager » Thu Oct 15, 2009 3:10 am

a lot of these OCI transfer horror stories seem like its a combination of bad economy, and firms not having much to evaluate you on. Is this the case with all transfers, or ones that transfer across entire markets (cali --> new york)?

i ask because i will likely end up at a tier 2 texas school with the intent of transferring to UT, so all the big firms in texas (vinson & elkins, fullbright & jaworski) will still have a good idea of where i stand since i would (presumably) be good enough at a school they already recruit at, to transfer to a T15

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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 15, 2009 10:01 am

T4 to GULC transfer.

Screenings: 17
Callbacks: 12 (went on 10 of the 12)
Dings: 2
Offers: 3
Pending: 5
Decided today on a V60 firm in DC.

Most transfers that I know have at least 1 offer in the V100. Granted, I don't know that many transfers or many other people at GULC. This place is huge, and it's been hard for me to meet people. I feel super lucky and am very happy with my decision.

Anonymous User
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 15, 2009 10:30 am

Anonymous User wrote:T4 to GULC transfer.

Screenings: 17
Callbacks: 12 (went on 10 of the 12)
Dings: 2
Offers: 3
Pending: 5
Decided today on a V60 firm in DC.

Most transfers that I know have at least 1 offer in the V100. Granted, I don't know that many transfers or many other people at GULC. This place is huge, and it's been hard for me to meet people. I feel super lucky and am very happy with my decision.


Wow. Congrats. Are you a good interviewer? Or have significant work experience? I transferred T3 to MVP...no callbacks, no offers.

Anonymous User
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 15, 2009 10:49 am

I'm the T4-GULC anon.

I'd say I'm a terrible interviewer. I get very nervous very easily. That being said, there were a few that I felt I blew out of the water. Not sure what I did differently, but I felt confident and connected well with the interviewers on those days. I ended up getting offers at those firms.

I don't have significant work experience - but I did not come straight from undergrad to law school. I worked at a consulting firm for about 1 year. Although not huge, my experiences there were the main topic of almost every single interview I went on.

Tave
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Re: TRANSFERS-- how are you doing in OCI?

Postby Tave » Thu Oct 15, 2009 10:59 am

Anonymous User wrote:Also, being a bad interviewer doesn't do much justice for explaning the 500+ dings I got from mass mailings.


The 500 number itself, on the other hand...




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