Military Law

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shock259
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Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 2:30 am

Re: Military Law

Postby shock259 » Wed Jan 11, 2012 5:16 pm

I didn't think the AF had any 1L summer internships. Guess I was wrong. I'll be on the lookout for that application. Guessing it'll be even more competitive than the Navy one (~15%) since the Navy one is unpaid.

Finally got my SJA interview scheduled. Did a mock interview with my CDO which was pretty helpful. I know I've got solid answers for almost all likely questions, but I'm scared that I'm going to get nervous in the presence of a Colonel and I won't do as well as I could. When I get anxious, it's painfully obvious. And the anxiety probably won't be looked upon favorably. But alas, I'll get through it. I'm not expecting to get GLP anyway, seeing as most people seem to apply 3-5 times before being accepted.

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Patrick Bateman
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Re: Military Law

Postby Patrick Bateman » Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:11 pm

shock259 wrote:I didn't think the AF had any 1L summer internships. Guess I was wrong. I'll be on the lookout for that application. Guessing it'll be even more competitive than the Navy one (~15%) since the Navy one is unpaid.

Finally got my SJA interview scheduled. Did a mock interview with my CDO which was pretty helpful. I know I've got solid answers for almost all likely questions, but I'm scared that I'm going to get nervous in the presence of a Colonel and I won't do as well as I could. When I get anxious, it's painfully obvious. And the anxiety probably won't be looked upon favorably. But alas, I'll get through it. I'm not expecting to get GLP anyway, seeing as most people seem to apply 3-5 times before being accepted.


This is the first year I have seen the AF offer internships for 1Ls.

I'd like tell you that Colonels are just like anyone else and that they put their pants on one leg at a time - unfortunately it is SOP that all Colonels jump into their pants with both legs simultaneously. Seriously though, there is no need to be nervous interviewing with an O-6. If you PM me, I'd be happy to answer any questions that might help put your anxiety to rest.

GLP is a different ball of wax than DAP. Do not count yourself out. As the great Yogi Berra noted, it ain't over till it's over.
Last edited by Patrick Bateman on Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Esquire
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Re: Military Law

Postby Esquire » Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:32 pm

us.army.jag.hopeful wrote:After the Army AD results, what do you all think the chances of getting picked up are for those on the Alternate List? And what will likely happen to the Army Reserves results?

No one was selected off the Alternate List in FY2011. I can't speak to anything else.

Texan09
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Re: Military Law

Postby Texan09 » Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:32 pm

Air Force 1L and 2L internship applications have been posted.

http://www.usajobs.gov/JobSearch/Search ... orce%20jag

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sowfpaw757
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Re: Military Law

Postby sowfpaw757 » Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:30 pm

I was on the Army FY 2011 Alternate List (Fall). My contact at JARO said only 2 people were selected from that list and therefore they did not bother to post a revised selectee list like that had in the past when 20-30 folks came off the alternate list. Not sure if anyone was picked up off of last Spring's alternate list and, as you know, there will be no Board this spring.

Did anyone who got selected on this Jan. 9th list get anything in the mail yet?

PVTJohnson1
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Re: Military Law

Postby PVTJohnson1 » Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:35 am

I havent recieved anything yet. I am sure it will come though. I imagine they are swamped trying to get everything in order for this process.

shock259
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Re: Military Law

Postby shock259 » Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:15 pm

Thanks PB, as always. :) I'll let you know if I have any specific questions.

The Air Force 1L summer internship looks fantastic - I'm so glad I got the info. 1) app looks pretty simple, no letters of rec. 2) paid! 3) the 1L internship is not posted on the AF JAG site. Perhaps this will limit the number of applicant's and increase my own chances of acceptance. :twisted:

Deutschebag
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Re: Military Law

Postby Deutschebag » Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:12 pm

In regards to the GLP and OYCP programs with the Air Force, has anyone else encountered the difficulty of getting the local school's ROTC to sign off? At my school, apparently nobody has ever attempted this before, so it has caused some confusion in what they are supposed to do.

Obviously it's a bit late in the game, so I'm worried that this is going to kill my chance at even applying.

shock259
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Re: Military Law

Postby shock259 » Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:28 pm

I had some issues with my GLP app and the ROTC office. They were really nice, but the ROTC rep was also unfamiliar with GLP/OYCP. I eventually called the AF JAG hotline when the ROTC was confused about some things. The JAG hotline recommended that I have the ROTC rep call the JAG hotline. She did and everything was resolved after that. This whole process took about a month and a half and a lot of back and forth, though.

I would say that it is quite unlikely you'll be able to do all that before the app deadline. The SJA interview is supposed to be completed by Jan 15th (not Feb 1), and you can't schedule that interview without an ROTC approval letter. So you're a few steps behind, and some of those steps are out of your control. Note that is purely based on my experiences, which may not be a typical one.

Good luck regardless!

/fellow GLP applicant

Deutschebag
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Re: Military Law

Postby Deutschebag » Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:38 pm

Well the whole back and forth between HQ and the ROTC office has been going on for the past month, so this isn't something that just popped up. Fortunately I just spoke to the base at which I will be interviewing, and they are willing to budge the 15th deadline for me after explaining the issue in detail - I just hope the ROTC office figures it out soon.

Also, the interview needs to be set by the 15th, not completed by. At least for the OYCP.

shock259
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Re: Military Law

Postby shock259 » Fri Jan 13, 2012 6:35 pm

Oh you are much further along than I thought. I bet you can make the deadline, then! :D

bobkat12
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Re: Military Law

Postby bobkat12 » Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:13 am

Hello All:

I just wanted to thank you for the wealth of information this thread provides. I have read it in its entirety and feel a lot better in terms of the many questions I first had when I began researching about becoming a Judge Advocate. I'm only a 3rd year UG, but I know this is the path for me. I yearn to serve as many in my family have before me.

I won't linger with the many reasons why I have chosen to pursue this path, I suppose that's best saved for the SJA. I will, however, ask kindly of you all to entertain a question, one which I'm not sure I found a definitive answer to amongst all the text accumulated over the years on the thread. I was wondering to what extent, if any, do Judge Advocates, regardless of branch, practice appellate and Constitutional law?

Thanks very much.

navy_jag
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Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 6:17 am

Re: Military Law

Postby navy_jag » Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:28 am

Hi everyone, I wanted to get some advice. Do you think graduating from Rutgers/USan Fran (T2) vs UMaine (T3) would make much of a difference in my chances of getting picked up for JAG? I'm prior enlisted with a very good record. Trying to figure out where I should decide to go this fall, with an eye towards JAG. Thanks in advance and good luck to everyone still waiting on schools!

lpecan
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2011 8:24 am

Re: Military Law

Postby lpecan » Mon Jan 16, 2012 12:27 pm

navy_jag wrote:Hi everyone, I wanted to get some advice. Do you think graduating from Rutgers/USan Fran (T2) vs UMaine (T3) would make much of a difference in my chances of getting picked up for JAG? I'm prior enlisted with a very good record. Trying to figure out where I should decide to go this fall, with an eye towards JAG. Thanks in advance and good luck to everyone still waiting on schools!


It would seem based on this thread that the difference would be marginal. The best advice is probably to go the school with the best employment prospects overall, because you really can't count on getting picked up for JAG, or anything else for that matter.

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Patrick Bateman
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Re: Military Law

Postby Patrick Bateman » Mon Jan 16, 2012 6:41 pm

bobkat12 wrote:Hello All:

I just wanted to thank you for the wealth of information this thread provides. I have read it in its entirety and feel a lot better in terms of the many questions I first had when I began researching about becoming a Judge Advocate. I'm only a 3rd year UG, but I know this is the path for me. I yearn to serve as many in my family have before me.

I won't linger with the many reasons why I have chosen to pursue this path, I suppose that's best saved for the SJA. I will, however, ask kindly of you all to entertain a question, one which I'm not sure I found a definitive answer to amongst all the text accumulated over the years on the thread. I was wondering to what extent, if any, do Judge Advocates, regardless of branch, practice appellate and Constitutional law?

Thanks very much.


The verbosity in this question is borderline Dickensian.

In regard to practicing Constitutional Law: Yes, in the sense in that I spend a considerable amount of my time trying to prevent other agencies on my base from violating things like the 4th Amendment or Posse Comitatus but no in the sense of whatever you have in mind as an undergrad. Another way to put it is best captured by this classic clip, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMvARy0lBLE): "There are like three lawyers in America who argue in Constitutional issues. They all went to Harvard in the 1970s."

Appellate Law: Yes - the Air Force has both an Appellate Government and Appellate Defense shop. They are staffed primarily by former Area Defense Counsel and Senior Trial/Defense Counsel types - significant courtroom experience and at the senior Captain/junior Major point in their careers (6-8 years in). All the services have their own appellate courts (Air Force Court of Criminal Appeals, etc) which are overseen by the Court of Appeals for the Armed Forces (CAAF).

Relatively recently (as in the last decade), LCDR Charles Swift, JAGC, USN, did take the Hamdan case all the way to the SCOTUS level. While he was ultimately passed over for promotion and fired, he was also featured in Esquire, which I consider a push.

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Patrick Bateman
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Re: Military Law

Postby Patrick Bateman » Mon Jan 16, 2012 6:47 pm

navy_jag wrote:Hi everyone, I wanted to get some advice. Do you think graduating from Rutgers/USan Fran (T2) vs UMaine (T3) would make much of a difference in my chances of getting picked up for JAG? I'm prior enlisted with a very good record. Trying to figure out where I should decide to go this fall, with an eye towards JAG. Thanks in advance and good luck to everyone still waiting on schools!


I'll second Pecan's advice above. These are all schools in wildly different markets - the smart money is to attend the school that is the appropriate balance between manageable debt and access to a job market where you would be happy practicing. The previous couple pages beat the already long dead horse regarding any connection between USNWR rank and JAG selection. Pick somewhere you will be happy staying in the event that you decide against JAG or JAG just doesn't work out.

brownshoe
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Re: Military Law

Postby brownshoe » Mon Jan 16, 2012 8:25 pm

Patrick Bateman wrote:
navy_jag wrote:Hi everyone, I wanted to get some advice. Do you think graduating from Rutgers/USan Fran (T2) vs UMaine (T3) would make much of a difference in my chances of getting picked up for JAG? I'm prior enlisted with a very good record. Trying to figure out where I should decide to go this fall, with an eye towards JAG. Thanks in advance and good luck to everyone still waiting on schools!


I'll second Pecan's advice above. These are all schools in wildly different markets - the smart money is to attend the school that is the appropriate balance between manageable debt and access to a job market where you would be happy practicing. The previous couple pages beat the already long dead horse regarding any connection between USNWR rank and JAG selection. Pick somewhere you will be happy staying in the event that you decide against JAG or JAG just doesn't work out.

Totally agree with the advice. However, I am going to throw a monkey wrench in the conventional wisdom regarding schools for NAVY ONLY. Having just looked at the list of schools selected over the past few boards (not released publicly), the USN definitely favors higher ranked schools. Upon a quick reading of the list, I only saw maybe two schools outside of the top two tiers. Again, I wouldn't base my school choice on that, because it's just too difficult to get in right now, regardless of school. Just want to get accurate info out there for those who care.

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FlanAl
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Re: Military Law

Postby FlanAl » Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:04 am

is the air force the only branch with programs like the GLP and OYCP? by that I mean programs where you apply with no prior service but where you do rotc in law school.

navy_jag
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 6:17 am

Re: Military Law

Postby navy_jag » Tue Jan 17, 2012 7:31 am

brownshoe wrote:
Patrick Bateman wrote:
navy_jag wrote:Hi everyone, I wanted to get some advice. Do you think graduating from Rutgers/USan Fran (T2) vs UMaine (T3) would make much of a difference in my chances of getting picked up for JAG? I'm prior enlisted with a very good record. Trying to figure out where I should decide to go this fall, with an eye towards JAG. Thanks in advance and good luck to everyone still waiting on schools!


I'll second Pecan's advice above. These are all schools in wildly different markets - the smart money is to attend the school that is the appropriate balance between manageable debt and access to a job market where you would be happy practicing. The previous couple pages beat the already long dead horse regarding any connection between USNWR rank and JAG selection. Pick somewhere you will be happy staying in the event that you decide against JAG or JAG just doesn't work out.

Totally agree with the advice. However, I am going to throw a monkey wrench in the conventional wisdom regarding schools for NAVY ONLY. Having just looked at the list of schools selected over the past few boards (not released publicly), the USN definitely favors higher ranked schools. Upon a quick reading of the list, I only saw maybe two schools outside of the top two tiers. Again, I wouldn't base my school choice on that, because it's just too difficult to get in right now, regardless of school. Just want to get accurate info out there for those who care.


Thanks for the advice everyone! There's a lot for me to consider when making my choice. I'm leaning towards Maine, for all of the reasons mentioned--affordability, livability (for me). Hoping that its ranking won't be too much of a red flag to the accession board. Maine definitely doesn't give off the for-profit, diploma mill vibe; then again, neither does Rutgers... We'll see. Hoping my prior military service will nudge me in the right direction.

us.army.jag.hopeful
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:07 am

Re: Military Law

Postby us.army.jag.hopeful » Tue Jan 17, 2012 7:14 pm

Has anybody on the AD Army JAG select or alternate list received any communication from JARO yet? Thank you!

ZeroDay
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:29 pm

Re: Military Law

Postby ZeroDay » Tue Jan 17, 2012 8:35 pm

us.army.jag.hopeful wrote:Has anybody on the AD Army JAG select or alternate list received any communication from JARO yet? Thank you!


I'm on the alternate list. I haven't received any communication from JARO.

PVTJohnson1
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 11:42 pm

Re: Military Law

Postby PVTJohnson1 » Tue Jan 17, 2012 9:01 pm

My FSO said they are absolutely swamped right now. Basically what will happen is we will start hearing from them in a bit. Patience is a virtue in this process. Its going to be well over a year before we actually step off to VA.

bobkat12
Posts: 11
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:54 pm

Re: Military Law

Postby bobkat12 » Tue Jan 17, 2012 10:04 pm

Patrick Bateman wrote:
bobkat12 wrote:Hello All:

I just wanted to thank you for the wealth of information this thread provides. I have read it in its entirety and feel a lot better in terms of the many questions I first had when I began researching about becoming a Judge Advocate. I'm only a 3rd year UG, but I know this is the path for me. I yearn to serve as many in my family have before me.

I won't linger with the many reasons why I have chosen to pursue this path, I suppose that's best saved for the SJA. I will, however, ask kindly of you all to entertain a question, one which I'm not sure I found a definitive answer to amongst all the text accumulated over the years on the thread. I was wondering to what extent, if any, do Judge Advocates, regardless of branch, practice appellate and Constitutional law?

Thanks very much.


The verbosity in this question is borderline Dickensian.

In regard to practicing Constitutional Law: Yes, in the sense in that I spend a considerable amount of my time trying to prevent other agencies on my base from violating things like the 4th Amendment or Posse Comitatus but no in the sense of whatever you have in mind as an undergrad. Another way to put it is best captured by this classic clip, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMvARy0lBLE): "There are like three lawyers in America who argue in Constitutional issues. They all went to Harvard in the 1970s."

Appellate Law: Yes - the Air Force has both an Appellate Government and Appellate Defense shop. They are staffed primarily by former Area Defense Counsel and Senior Trial/Defense Counsel types - significant courtroom experience and at the senior Captain/junior Major point in their careers (6-8 years in). All the services have their own appellate courts (Air Force Court of Criminal Appeals, etc) which are overseen by the Court of Appeals for the Armed Forces (CAAF).

Relatively recently (as in the last decade), LCDR Charles Swift, JAGC, USN, did take the Hamdan case all the way to the SCOTUS level. While he was ultimately passed over for promotion and fired, he was also featured in Esquire, which I consider a push.


Thanks for the information! As for the verbosity, I guess my university is really starting to rub off on me.

shock259
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Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 2:30 am

Re: Military Law

Postby shock259 » Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:50 pm

Don't worry. Law school will beat that out of you. 8)

Shit just got real over here. Got my grades back: top 15%. I think I have a real shot at GLP. Interview is this Friday. I'm going to spend the rest of the week prepping for it.

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bouakedojo
Posts: 321
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Re: Military Law

Postby bouakedojo » Wed Jan 18, 2012 5:07 pm

Wow. I got word back from DODMERB I'm qualified, no waiver needed, even with my acid reflux. Crazy! I never thought I'd pass without a waiver.

Does anyone know if my acceptance from my DODMERB physical for the Marines would transfer to other branches as well, should I apply to them for JAG or is my DODMERB acceptance specific to my application?




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