NYC to 200k

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 1:57 pm

Only one question remains: wtf are Latham and Gibson doing? Hard to fault other firms when they haven't moved.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:15 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Only one question remains: wtf are Latham and Gibson doing? Hard to fault other firms when they haven't moved.


Maybe...but I’m still going to.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:25 pm

Law students ITT: when are your bid lists due for OCI? Will firms that haven't matched by then take a hit? Will firms that matched after a delay?

Associates in my office think our firm will move by bid deadlines or not at all this summer.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:27 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Law students ITT: when are your bid lists due for OCI? Will firms that haven't matched by then take a hit? Will firms that matched after a delay?

Associates in my office think our firm will move by bid deadlines or not at all this summer.


^This. What firm?

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:29 pm

I'm a slightly above median student at HYS. I'm not bidding on any firms that haven't matched by the time bid lists are due, except maybe firms like Latham/Gibson that surely will have to match...but if they haven't matched by the time CBs and offers are going out, hopefully I have options.

Don't need prestige for prestige's sake. I just want to get paid top of the market, but realistically don't have a shot at crazy high-paying shops like Wachtell.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:29 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Law students ITT: when are your bid lists due for OCI? Will firms that haven't matched by then take a hit? Will firms that matched after a delay?

Associates in my office think our firm will move by bid deadlines or not at all this summer.


2L at T13 here, we still have til early July to finalize our bid lists, so I have mine ordered as if salaries were set at pre-190k levels. When we are a couple of days out, I'll move the firms that haven't matched down accordingly.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:33 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Law students ITT: when are your bid lists due for OCI? Will firms that haven't matched by then take a hit? Will firms that matched after a delay?

Associates in my office think our firm will move by bid deadlines or not at all this summer.


I'm at one of the firms with well over $2M+ PPP that has seen a lot of growth over the past few years. The sentiment here is that the firm doesn't care about bid deadlines because law students will just assume, probably rightfully so, that the firm will match. I could see it mattering a lot more for firms that are perceived to not be doing as well financially though, i.e. firms in the $1-2M PPP range and/or with little to no profit growth.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Barrred » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:35 pm

So Munger is raising pay for first year associates to 190K starting July 1, and doing the same for summer associates retroactive to the beginning of the summer. Unless I am missing something, doesn't this mean that for about a month or two (the start of the summer program to July 1) Munger will have effectively paid summer associates more than first year associates? I'd be pissed if I were a Munger first year if that's the case.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:37 pm

Barrred wrote:So Munger is raising pay for first year associates to 190K starting July 1, and doing the same for summer associates retroactive to the beginning of the summer. Unless I am missing something, doesn't this mean that for about a month or two (the start of the summer program to July 1) Munger will have effectively paid summer associates more than first year associates? I'd be pissed if I were a Munger first year if that's the case.


Yes, but I'm pretty sure all firms do this.

I was a summer during the 180k raises, and we got a bonus that reflected the additional amount we would've earned had we been paid 180 for the full 10 weeks.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:39 pm

HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:50 pm

Anonymous User wrote:HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.


This is why it's shortsighted to not match. And this is why delaying when you're just going to match anyway doesn't do you any good.

Associates and summer associates are keenly aware of which firms are raising and which aren't. If you want to hire people from the best law schools who have offers from firms that matched the new salaries, you need to match the new salaries.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:52 pm

Firms may save a few dollars in the short term by not matching. In the medium and long term, they'll take hits to morale, recruiting, and retention. If you want to be a top firm, you have to pay what the top firms pay.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:53 pm

Anonymous User wrote:HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.


Yep. The only thing that will save us now is pressure from other firms with DC presences.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:59 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.


Yep. The only thing that will save us now is pressure from other firms with DC presences.


HoLove associate too? WTF is WilmerFail doing? They have a 400 person office! They would definitely push DC to 190.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:01 pm

Anonymous User wrote:HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.


HoLove is now a V25 firm. That’s worth more to me than any raise or bonus.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:03 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.


HoLove is now a V25 firm. That’s worth more to me than any raise or bonus.


Oh hey there Steve Immelt.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:05 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.


HoLove is now a V25 firm. That’s worth more to me than any raise or bonus.


yeah and wilmerfail is v20 now lol

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:08 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.


Yep. The only thing that will save us now is pressure from other firms with DC presences.


HoLove associate too? WTF is WilmerFail doing? They have a 400 person office! They would definitely push DC to 190.


Yeah I'm at Hogan, and I've talked to friends at Covington and they feel the same. [hint: rest of the world, DC isn't that different, we care more about money than "legacy" or "prestige"]. Honestly at this point I'm not even sure Wilmer moving would bump us up. Covington and Hogan definitely follow each other, but both might be willing to let Wilmer with its higher PEP take center stage in this town.

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
HoLove is now a V25 firm. That’s worth more to me than any raise or bonus.


Oh hey there Steve Immelt.


Looooollllll

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:11 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.


This is why it's shortsighted to not match. And this is why delaying when you're just going to match anyway doesn't do you any good.

Associates and summer associates are keenly aware of which firms are raising and which aren't. If you want to hire people from the best law schools who have offers from firms that matched the new salaries, you need to match the new salaries.

[different DC old guard associate]

Yup. Us regulatory folks don’t have a lot of options at much higher PPP firms (and my situation is probably too good to take the risk of lateralling even over $20k), but we arent the really profitable ones. The lit/white collar associates who soak up the hours can easily go elsewhere and do the exact same job.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:15 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Yeah I'm at Hogan, and I've talked to friends at Covington and they feel the same. [hint: rest of the world, DC isn't that different, we care more about money than "legacy" or "prestige"]. Honestly at this point I'm not even sure Wilmer moving would bump us up. Covington and Hogan definitely follow each other, but both might be willing to let Wilmer with its higher PEP take center stage in this town.


I'm assuming Covington and Hogan are already trying to figure out how to characterize Wilmer as a "Boston firm" rather than a DC peer firm.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:HoLove associate: People throughout the firm, including current summer associates, are talking about this. At the start, it was a foregone conclusion that we would raise, but that seems more unlikely by the day. I'm thinking 60% chance we match. I know multiple people who have started picking up calls from recruiters about firms that have raised just to get the process started since it takes so long.


This is why it's shortsighted to not match. And this is why delaying when you're just going to match anyway doesn't do you any good.

Associates and summer associates are keenly aware of which firms are raising and which aren't. If you want to hire people from the best law schools who have offers from firms that matched the new salaries, you need to match the new salaries.

[different DC old guard associate]

Yup. Us regulatory folks don’t have a lot of options (and my situation is probably too good to take the risk of lateralling even over $20k), but we arent the really profitable ones. The lit/white collar associates who soak up the hours can easily go elsewhere and do the exact same job.


Don't give them any ideas...don't think for one second that these clowns won't send out an email saying something like "Colleagues: As a token of our appreciation, we have decided to increase the salaries for Corporate and Litigation associates. While we will continue to monitor the market, we do not believe that the raises have spread to Regulatory associates at peer firms, even though we understand that many of you work side-by-side with your Corporate and Litigation colleagues on achieving bold, distinctive, and valuable solutions for the firm's clients. Sincerely yours, Steve"

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:20 pm

Anonymous User wrote: HoLove is now a V25 firm. That’s worth more to me than any raise or bonus.


Won't be for long if it doesn't raise salaries/give bonuses.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:K&S has a firm-wide meeting tomorrow (was already on the books). Wouldn't be a bad time to announce...


Anyone know how this went?

Sincerely,
Every ATL associate

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:30 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:K&S has a firm-wide meeting tomorrow (was already on the books). Wouldn't be a bad time to announce...


Anyone know how this went?

Sincerely,
Every ATL associate


Hopefully either celebratory or painfully awkward. Associates at V50/AmLaw 50 firms need to start straight up asking management when the final decision will be made on raises. No more of this waiting it out in silence crap.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:33 pm

EMAIL FROM COVINGTON

We are aware of the recent announcement by several New York-Based Firms* that they are increasing their associate salary scale and providing special, one-time bonuses to associates. At this point, our view is that the special, one-time bonuses and the increase in New York salaries does not reflect the prevailing market in Washington or other cities outside New York. Traditionally, associate salaries in New York** have been somewhat higher than in other markets around the country. With the recent increase in associate bonuses and our salary scale to match New York levels (which we announced roughly two years ago), we see this recent move by some New York firms as reinstating the modest differential that we’ve traditionally seen in New York vis-à-vis other markets around the country. To some extent, this may reflect cost-of-living differences,*** and it may also reflect a slight premium for working in highly leveraged firms with quite limited partnership and promotion opportunities. At this stage, we are not planning to increase associate salaries in any market outside of our one New York City office, though of course we will continue to study these issues carefully.

* For purposes of this email and salary comparison in general, the term "New York-Based Firms" shall include all firms not based in Washington DC, including but not limited to Kirkland & Ellis and Sidley Austin. For the avoidance of doubt, WilmerHale shall be considered a New York-Based Firm if they raise salaries and provide bonuses in line with other New York-Based Firms.

** For purposes of this email and salary comparison in general, the term "New York" shall include all cities other than Washington DC, including but not limited to Chicago, Los Angeles, Houston, Boston, and Atlanta.

*** Please do not believe everything you read about the cost-of-living differences between Washington and, e.g., Houston, which actually has a significantly higher cost of living and income-tax structure than Washington.



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