Why do people even do this?

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Why do people even do this?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:47 pm

I'm an associate at a big law firm and besides the office ball and chain/student debt reasons, why on earth do people do this for a living? The money starts out high but never progresses substantially, the people suck for the most part, and the work is honestly quite dull until you make it further up the food chain, but by that point you've wasted half your life doing a bunch of nonsense.

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Roy McAvoy

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Roy McAvoy » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:52 pm

Go read the People who like biglaw thread

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:53 pm

Double post
Last edited by Anonymous User on Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:53 pm

No idea... Im out as soon as I pay off my student loans

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Dec 09, 2017 7:30 pm

I don't have student debt so mostly I'm doing it so I can get a chill inhouse job. They won't hire me without 2-3 years in big law. It's like a med school residency.

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LaLiLuLeLo

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby LaLiLuLeLo » Sat Dec 09, 2017 7:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I don't have student debt so mostly I'm doing it so I can get a chill inhouse job. They won't hire me without 2-3 years in big law. It's like a med school residency.


lol we have it a million times better than residents.

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almondjoy

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby almondjoy » Sat Dec 09, 2017 7:52 pm

LaLiLuLeLo wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I don't have student debt so mostly I'm doing it so I can get a chill inhouse job. They won't hire me without 2-3 years in big law. It's like a med school residency.


lol we have it a million times better than residents.


Don’t residents have set schedules? I know they work a ton but a lack of boundaries is what makes biglaw so terrible imo.

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LaLiLuLeLo

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby LaLiLuLeLo » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:13 pm

almondjoy wrote:
LaLiLuLeLo wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I don't have student debt so mostly I'm doing it so I can get a chill inhouse job. They won't hire me without 2-3 years in big law. It's like a med school residency.


lol we have it a million times better than residents.


Don’t residents have set schedules? I know they work a ton but a lack of boundaries is what makes biglaw so terrible imo.


They make like a third of what a first year makes and while their schedules are set, every resident I know gets screwed and can’t even enjoy holidays because they’re the lowest on the totem pole. Hell, there are even tests they need to take while already working. I’d never want to be a resident.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Loquitur Res » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:37 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I'm an associate at a big law firm and besides the office ball and chain/student debt reasons, why on earth do people do this for a living? The money starts out high but never progresses substantially, the people suck for the most part, and the work is honestly quite dull until you make it further up the food chain, but by that point you've wasted half your life doing a bunch of nonsense.


Really? At Cravath scale firms don't you go from 195k to 215k (base + bonus) from first to second year (after the stub), then to like 260K in the third year? What other job are you going to get 20k raise after your first year and a 45k raise after your second year out of school? I'm not heading to biglaw and not trying to defend it, but this particular criticism seems off base.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby PeanutsNJam » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:40 pm

LaLiLuLeLo wrote:
almondjoy wrote:
LaLiLuLeLo wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I don't have student debt so mostly I'm doing it so I can get a chill inhouse job. They won't hire me without 2-3 years in big law. It's like a med school residency.


lol we have it a million times better than residents.


Don’t residents have set schedules? I know they work a ton but a lack of boundaries is what makes biglaw so terrible imo.


They make like a third of what a first year makes and while their schedules are set, every resident I know gets screwed and can’t even enjoy holidays because they’re the lowest on the totem pole. Hell, there are even tests they need to take while already working. I’d never want to be a resident.


According to wikipedia, residents work 80-100 hours/week, with "residents occasionally logging 136 (out of 168) hours in a week." About 40% of that is paperwork.

Jesus fucking christ that's 4.5 hours of sleep a day for a whole week. And every other waking moment is work.

Their on-call hours and shifts are "set," but they're subject to momentary changes, so not actually.
Last edited by PeanutsNJam on Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby sublime » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:43 pm

I'm a junior in NYC biglaw and there are plenty of valid reasons to do it, depending on a person's priorities and other responsibilities.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby LaLiLuLeLo » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:43 pm

PeanutsNJam wrote:
LaLiLuLeLo wrote:
almondjoy wrote:
LaLiLuLeLo wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I don't have student debt so mostly I'm doing it so I can get a chill inhouse job. They won't hire me without 2-3 years in big law. It's like a med school residency.


lol we have it a million times better than residents.


Don’t residents have set schedules? I know they work a ton but a lack of boundaries is what makes biglaw so terrible imo.


They make like a third of what a first year makes and while their schedules are set, every resident I know gets screwed and can’t even enjoy holidays because they’re the lowest on the totem pole. Hell, there are even tests they need to take while already working. I’d never want to be a resident.


According to wikipedia, residents work 80-100 hours/week, with "residents occasionally logging 136 (out of 168) hours in a week." About 40% of that is paperwork.

Their on-call hours and shifts are "set," but they're subject to momentary changes, so not actually.


Ah that’s right. Being a resident blooooows.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby sparkytrainer » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:53 pm

LaLiLuLeLo wrote:
PeanutsNJam wrote:
LaLiLuLeLo wrote:
almondjoy wrote:
LaLiLuLeLo wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I don't have student debt so mostly I'm doing it so I can get a chill inhouse job. They won't hire me without 2-3 years in big law. It's like a med school residency.


lol we have it a million times better than residents.


Don’t residents have set schedules? I know they work a ton but a lack of boundaries is what makes biglaw so terrible imo.


They make like a third of what a first year makes and while their schedules are set, every resident I know gets screwed and can’t even enjoy holidays because they’re the lowest on the totem pole. Hell, there are even tests they need to take while already working. I’d never want to be a resident.


According to wikipedia, residents work 80-100 hours/week, with "residents occasionally logging 136 (out of 168) hours in a week." About 40% of that is paperwork.

Their on-call hours and shifts are "set," but they're subject to momentary changes, so not actually.


Ah that’s right. Being a resident blooooows.


Close friend just finished his residency. He had 4 24hr shifts a week that often ran over to 27-28 hours each PLUS A 3 HR DRIVE each way for half the residency. His hospital he was a resident at required half the residency time at an underserved community in the middle of nowhere. So not only was he working 100+ hours a week, he was commuting close to 20 hours back and forth for almost a year.

He would have a month on in his normal hospital, then a month at this other place. Between getting paid peanuts and student loans, couldnt afford to even split a tiny apartment in the other community with other residents. Truly his life sucked.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:11 pm

I had a useless degree and was working at a Chick-fil-a, so going to a T6 and getting a job at a V10 in a non-NYC major market seemed like a great alternative.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:33 pm

Unlike the does-anyone-like-biglaw thread, this one goes too far.
There are some good reasons to do this for a living. Most jobs are boring and involve unpleasantness.
If the question is "I don't get how some people could enjoy this job!", then that is a reasonable inquiry. I don't quite understand how someone could genuinely enjoy biglaw corporate practice.
But then after just mentioning some unpleasant/shitty aspects and asking why people even do this for a living is just a waste of time.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby sparty99 » Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:45 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I'm an associate at a big law firm and besides the office ball and chain/student debt reasons, why on earth do people do this for a living? The money starts out high but never progresses substantially, the people suck for the most part, and the work is honestly quite dull until you make it further up the food chain, but by that point you've wasted half your life doing a bunch of nonsense.


Quit your f*cking wining. You make over $160k. Boo-hoo.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby almondjoy » Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:47 pm

sparty99 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I'm an associate at a big law firm and besides the office ball and chain/student debt reasons, why on earth do people do this for a living? The money starts out high but never progresses substantially, the people suck for the most part, and the work is honestly quite dull until you make it further up the food chain, but by that point you've wasted half your life doing a bunch of nonsense.


Quit your f*cking wining. You make over $160k. Boo-hoo.

This comment is so unhelpful.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby TastyMango » Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:53 pm

sparty99 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I'm an associate at a big law firm and besides the office ball and chain/student debt reasons, why on earth do people do this for a living? The money starts out high but never progresses substantially, the people suck for the most part, and the work is honestly quite dull until you make it further up the food chain, but by that point you've wasted half your life doing a bunch of nonsense.


Quit your f*cking wining. You make over $160k. Boo-hoo.


Money means little if you never get to enjoy the benefits of having money.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby UVA2B » Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:53 pm

People trying to compare Biglaw to a medical residency (especially without adding practice group and specialty, respectively) are idiots. They don't deserve comparison. They are two entirely different professions, and the training programs serve two very different purposes.

If I could kill one analogy on TLS, it would be the connection between law and medicine.

OP, people enter this profession for many reasons, and you just might be at that point where you're questioning whether you made the right choice. You're working an office job and you're probably too junior to get the substantive and interesting assignments you thought you'd get, and it might be entirely different than what you imagined when you signed on to a huge amount of debt to go to law school. This is a tough part of the career, because you haven't fully drank the kool aid at your firm, and it's still very possible the Biglaw job was never for you. But for the sake of your future career, the one you'll want when you're done at your firm, all you can do is grit your teeth and bare for a bit. If nothing else, you'll have options if you put your time in, soak up every training opportunity you get, and eventually leverage every professional contact you gain in working for this firm.

A career in our generation is more often based on a series of incremental steps, not a gigantic leap. Don't worry about the leaps, and focus on the steps.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby run26.2 » Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:59 pm

Loquitur Res wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I'm an associate at a big law firm and besides the office ball and chain/student debt reasons, why on earth do people do this for a living? The money starts out high but never progresses substantially, the people suck for the most part, and the work is honestly quite dull until you make it further up the food chain, but by that point you've wasted half your life doing a bunch of nonsense.


Really? At Cravath scale firms don't you go from 195k to 215k (base + bonus) from first to second year (after the stub), then to like 260K in the third year? What other job are you going to get 20k raise after your first year and a 45k raise after your second year out of school? I'm not heading to biglaw and not trying to defend it, but this particular criticism seems off base.

This. After you're in biglaw for 6 years, you have been around 1.5 million. If you've been wise with your money, you're pretty well on your way to financial independence. Of course, if you have massive debt, things are a bit different.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Dec 10, 2017 12:21 am

run26.2 wrote:
Loquitur Res wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I'm an associate at a big law firm and besides the office ball and chain/student debt reasons, why on earth do people do this for a living? The money starts out high but never progresses substantially, the people suck for the most part, and the work is honestly quite dull until you make it further up the food chain, but by that point you've wasted half your life doing a bunch of nonsense.


Really? At Cravath scale firms don't you go from 195k to 215k (base + bonus) from first to second year (after the stub), then to like 260K in the third year? What other job are you going to get 20k raise after your first year and a 45k raise after your second year out of school? I'm not heading to biglaw and not trying to defend it, but this particular criticism seems off base.

This. After you're in biglaw for 6 years, you have been around 1.5 million. If you've been wise with your money, you're pretty well on your way to financial independence. Of course, if you have massive debt, things are a bit different.

[deleted b/c accidental anon post]

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby unicorntamer666 » Sun Dec 10, 2017 12:25 am

run26.2 wrote:
Loquitur Res wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I'm an associate at a big law firm and besides the office ball and chain/student debt reasons, why on earth do people do this for a living? The money starts out high but never progresses substantially, the people suck for the most part, and the work is honestly quite dull until you make it further up the food chain, but by that point you've wasted half your life doing a bunch of nonsense.


Really? At Cravath scale firms don't you go from 195k to 215k (base + bonus) from first to second year (after the stub), then to like 260K in the third year? What other job are you going to get 20k raise after your first year and a 45k raise after your second year out of school? I'm not heading to biglaw and not trying to defend it, but this particular criticism seems off base.

This. After you're in biglaw for 6 years, you have been around 1.5 million. If you've been wise with your money, you're pretty well on your way to financial independence. Of course, if you have massive debt, things are a bit different.


This. Also, because law is fun. You get paid upwards of $1.5 million to sit at a desk playing logic games for a few years.

I'd vastly prefer this to a guaranteed lifetime of wage slavery, which is what virtually all other jobs amount to - especially those that pay like $50K a year.

ETA: It is admittedly definitely not for everyone, and most people who go into it are probably making a mistake. No one should do it without being confident they love the nature of the work, as the sheer hours requirement will be utterly soul crushing if you don't (and can be even if you do). I encourage people considering law school to work as paralegals first to figure out whether the profession is for them.

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Dec 10, 2017 12:41 am

Wtf? What logic games are you playing? Maybe its just corporate that sucks.

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LaLiLuLeLo

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby LaLiLuLeLo » Sun Dec 10, 2017 12:49 am

unicorntamer666 wrote:
run26.2 wrote:
Loquitur Res wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I'm an associate at a big law firm and besides the office ball and chain/student debt reasons, why on earth do people do this for a living? The money starts out high but never progresses substantially, the people suck for the most part, and the work is honestly quite dull until you make it further up the food chain, but by that point you've wasted half your life doing a bunch of nonsense.


Really? At Cravath scale firms don't you go from 195k to 215k (base + bonus) from first to second year (after the stub), then to like 260K in the third year? What other job are you going to get 20k raise after your first year and a 45k raise after your second year out of school? I'm not heading to biglaw and not trying to defend it, but this particular criticism seems off base.

This. After you're in biglaw for 6 years, you have been around 1.5 million. If you've been wise with your money, you're pretty well on your way to financial independence. Of course, if you have massive debt, things are a bit different.


This. Also, because law is fun. You get paid upwards of $1.5 million to sit at a desk playing logic games for a few years.

I'd vastly prefer this to a guaranteed lifetime of wage slavery, which is what virtually all other jobs amount to - especially those that pay like $50K a year.

ETA: It is admittedly definitely not for everyone, and most people who go into it are probably making a mistake. No one should do it without being confident they love the nature of the work, as the sheer hours requirement will be utterly soul crushing if you don't (and can be even if you do). I encourage people considering law school to work as paralegals first to figure out whether the profession is for them.


:D

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Re: Why do people even do this?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:21 am

Anonymous User wrote:Wtf? What logic games are you playing? Maybe its just corporate that sucks.


Pretty sure that guy is a 3L, so no logic games. He's not sitting at a biglaw desk.



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