1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

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1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 31, 2017 10:49 pm

I somewhat recently finished a 1L SA in one of my several target markets, but I was no-offered at the end of the program. I am a slightly below median T14 student who was slightly miscast in that SA, but nonetheless it's a pretty big blow to me to not get an offer to return.

I have ~30 interviews through OCI and contacts in the next few weeks, and I have to craft an answer that doesn't make me a leper to those hiring. How do I properly spin it? My initial inclination is to spin geography when it makes sense and spin practice area when it makes sense, but if people push on why I don't have an offer to return, I'm pretty much stuck. I got almost entirely positive reviews during the summer minus an assignment or two where I made mistakes, and the critique that seemed to stick was that I wasn't sufficiently committed to the firm/market where my SA was. I thought that was far from fair, but I also have zero leverage in making that call.

So considering I have no offers, sub-par grades, and a relative wealth of interviews coming up soon, how do I properly spin the fact that the firm I worked at this summer didn't ask me to return?

gchatbrah

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Re: 1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby gchatbrah » Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:36 pm

Appropriate spin: you heard Covington was looking for young corporate associates, so you decided to take your talents there.

EDIT: need to specify Covington LA -- otherwise no one will believe you.

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Re: 1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby Bach-City » Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:13 am

.
Last edited by Bach-City on Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Nagster5

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Re: 1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby Nagster5 » Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:19 am

I'll just chime in to say not a single interviewer asked me if my 1L firm gave me an offer.

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Mr. Blackacre

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Re: 1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby Mr. Blackacre » Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:24 am

Nagster5 wrote:I'll just chime in to say not a single interviewer asked me if my 1L firm gave me an offer.


I'll also chime in to say that a bunch of firms don't extend offers to return to 1L SAs, and that there's generally less of a stigma against getting 1L no-offered. Wouldn't be surprised if you don't get asked about it either, or if it doesn't hurt you too much if they do ask.

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Wild Card

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Re: 1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby Wild Card » Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:05 am

Why the heck would firms pay 1Ls $35,000 only to no offer them at the end? Yield protection?

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Re: 1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:13 am

Wild Card wrote:Why the heck would firms pay 1Ls $35,000 only to no offer them at the end? Yield protection?


The same reasons they do it to 2Ls who they spend just as much on. I'll also add that I was never asked about whether I got an offer 1L.

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Kinky John

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Re: 1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby Kinky John » Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:17 am

Bach-City wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I somewhat recently finished a 1L SA in one of my several target markets, but I was no-offered at the end of the program. I am a slightly below median T14 student who was slightly miscast in that SA, but nonetheless it's a pretty big blow to me to not get an offer to return.

I have ~30 interviews through OCI and contacts in the next few weeks, and I have to craft an answer that doesn't make me a leper to those hiring. How do I properly spin it? My initial inclination is to spin geography when it makes sense and spin practice area when it makes sense, but if people push on why I don't have an offer to return, I'm pretty much stuck. I got almost entirely positive reviews during the summer minus an assignment or two where I made mistakes, and the critique that seemed to stick was that I wasn't sufficiently committed to the firm/market where my SA was. I thought that was far from fair, but I also have zero leverage in making that call.

So considering I have no offers, sub-par grades, and a relative wealth of interviews coming up soon, how do I properly spin the fact that the firm I worked at this summer didn't ask me to return?


"I really enjoyed my SA and got positive reviews all summer, save a mistake here and there, but was told at the end of the summer that they didn't believe I was committed to Smaller-Market and so weren't giving me an offer. I was certainly disappointed, but the experience was still invaluable in that it taught me X,Y,Z and that I was interested in practice areas A and B, etc etc which will help me as I move towards another law firm."

That's my first response. Other people can give critiques


I wouldn't volunteer that you didn't get an offer.

For the firms you're interviewing with that are not in the SA firm's market, say you would prefer to be in the interviewing firm's market. For firms in the same market as the SA firm, highlight something substantive the interviewing firm has that the SA firm doesn't (e.g. practice area you want).
Last edited by Kinky John on Tue Jan 30, 2018 12:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 01, 2017 7:06 am

OP here. Thank you all for the replies, and they're in line with what I was expecting, which I suppose is a good thing. My plan for interviews at firms that are more in line with my desired practice area would be something like this:

"My time at [firm] was a really great experience and I learned a lot from it, but one of the things I learned is that I really want to get into [practice area], which is something they don't really do much."

And when it's in a different geographic market, something like this:

"I loved the experience I had at [firm] and it's a great legal market, but I always knew I wanted to end up in the [other city] legal market because of [personal reasons]. I learned from my time at [firm], through working with really good attorneys, and I hope to use that experience to improve as a future attorney."

Does that seem to answer the question without volunteering whether I have an offer to return? Obviously I won't use these answers if asked directly about whether I have an offer to return because I don't want to hide the ball on it, but I definitely want to highlight the positive experiences I had without showcasing that the firm felt I wasn't worth bringing back for a second summer.

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Re: 1L SA no-offered, appropriate spin?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 01, 2017 7:49 am

Another 1L SA here. I was asked by one firm out of 30 whether I received an offer to return.



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