GPA cut off mid size firm?

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GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:01 pm

I've interviewed at a mid size firm with various partners, and it went really well. They liked my resume, however I didn't mention my grades because they sucked, like 2.0 sucked. They are asking to see my transcript and a writing sample however they also want me to interview with some more partners. Are my chances dead as soon as they see my grades? I've had less than a year legal experience in an unrelated field, for what it's worth.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:09 pm

Hm would it be possible to send them the writing sample but not send the transcript and act as if you simply forgot? I would guess once they see it, it would change their mind....

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby hangtime813 » Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:43 pm

Very dependent on the firm...some midsized firms don't care about your grades if you have specialized/niche experience or experience in the practice area they want. Other firms care a lot about grades if you are applying as a 3L. Others may only care if you are lateraling to a more prestigious firm.

The term midsized varies a lot as well by pay and size so that can also be a factor.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby rpupkin » Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:54 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hm would it be possible to send them the writing sample but not send the transcript and act as if you simply forgot? I would guess once they see it, it would change their mind....

If the OP's goal is to draw maximum attention to their transcript and grades, then the OP should adopt this approach.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:16 pm

rpupkin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hm would it be possible to send them the writing sample but not send the transcript and act as if you simply forgot? I would guess once they see it, it would change their mind....

If the OP's goal is to draw maximum attention to their transcript and grades, then the OP should adopt this approach.


OP here. Yeah that seems too risky. I feel they'd notice the lack of transcript. My GPA is mainly B's and B-'s and a couple of C's making it a high 2.0.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby rpupkin » Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:34 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
rpupkin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hm would it be possible to send them the writing sample but not send the transcript and act as if you simply forgot? I would guess once they see it, it would change their mind....

If the OP's goal is to draw maximum attention to their transcript and grades, then the OP should adopt this approach.


OP here. Yeah that seems too risky. I feel they'd notice the lack of transcript. My GPA is mainly B's and B-'s and a couple of C's making it a high 2.0.

When you wrote that your GPA was "like 2.0 sucked," I thought you meant a C average, not "almost 3.0." Midlaw firms are full of lawyers with grades likes yours.

Send in your transcript as requested and then forget all about your grades. Good luck.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Pokemon » Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hm would it be possible to send them the writing sample but not send the transcript and act as if you simply forgot? I would guess once they see it, it would change their mind....


If they ask, he can say the dog ate it. But yeah being forgetful is probably not something law firms look for an associate particularly if opportunitistically forgetful.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:52 pm

Yea but let's say hypothetically OP had a 2.0 and he/she sent the transcript. Isn't that an automatic out? Maybe they forget. Happened to me once for an internship - they requested over phone but gave me job w/o asking for it in interview.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby rpupkin » Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:55 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Yea but let's say hypothetically OP had a 2.0 and he/she sent the transcript. Isn't that an automatic out? Maybe they forget. Happened to me once for internship - they requested over phone but gave me job w/o asking for it in interview.

Internships often don't care about transcripts. Law firms need to see them--for one thing, law firms need to confirm that you graduated from law school.

Stop beating this drum and stop posting anonymously for no reason.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:12 pm

.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:12 pm

Fair point. I will stop "beating the drum."

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Jun 29, 2017 3:59 pm

rpupkin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
rpupkin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hm would it be possible to send them the writing sample but not send the transcript and act as if you simply forgot? I would guess once they see it, it would change their mind....

If the OP's goal is to draw maximum attention to their transcript and grades, then the OP should adopt this approach.


OP here. Yeah that seems too risky. I feel they'd notice the lack of transcript. My GPA is mainly B's and B-'s and a couple of C's making it a high 2.0.

When you wrote that your GPA was "like 2.0 sucked," I thought you meant a C average, not "almost 3.0." Midlaw firms are full of lawyers with grades likes yours.

Send in your transcript as requested and then forget all about your grades. Good luck.


OP here. Thanks, I'll hope for the best. I've noticed that many of the associates on the firm graduated with honors, and one of the partners give me the heads up of needing to explain why I didn't pass the bar the first time. So I am thinking if they are concerned about not passing the bar the first time, maybe they have a GPA cut off and wouldn't accept a 2.9...Hopefully I can win them over with my writing sample and interviews so far. Working at this firm would be awesome.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Jun 29, 2017 4:04 pm

Damn they make you explain why you didn't pass the first time? Seriously? like it's not exactly a walk in the park. Talking like they didn't go through it themselves.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Jun 29, 2017 4:44 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Damn they make you explain why you didn't pass the first time? Seriously? like it's not exactly a walk in the park. Talking like they didn't go through it themselves.


If there was a GPA cut off, they probably would've asked for it before interviewing you. Unless it was just an oversight.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby rpupkin » Thu Jun 29, 2017 4:52 pm

Anonymous User wrote:OP here. Thanks, I'll hope for the best. I've noticed that many of the associates on the firm graduated with honors, and one of the partners give me the heads up of needing to explain why I didn't pass the bar the first time. So I am thinking if they are concerned about not passing the bar the first time, maybe they have a GPA cut off and wouldn't accept a 2.9...Hopefully I can win them over with my writing sample and interviews so far. Working at this firm would be awesome.

If the firm had a true GPA cut-off, they likely would have asked for your transcript before having multiple partners interview you. (It would be different if you were screened by a single attorney.) Partners don't like to waste time interviewing folks that the firm would not possibly hire.

Obviously, the firm is concerned that you didn't pass the bar the first time, and your mediocre law school grades won't help matters. But there is nothing you can do to change that. Don't be defensive about your grades or your failed bar exam attempt. And don't make excuses. Focus on your strengths: you're a hard worker, a good writer, and you are really interested in the practice of this law firm. (If the last thing isn't true, do your best to make it true before your next round of interviews.)

I'm not trying to sugarcoat things: your academic record is a minus here. But unless and until the firm dings you for it, put it out of your mind. You have a real chance here. Good luck!

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby sparty99 » Thu Jun 29, 2017 5:23 pm

rpupkin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:OP here. Thanks, I'll hope for the best. I've noticed that many of the associates on the firm graduated with honors, and one of the partners give me the heads up of needing to explain why I didn't pass the bar the first time. So I am thinking if they are concerned about not passing the bar the first time, maybe they have a GPA cut off and wouldn't accept a 2.9...Hopefully I can win them over with my writing sample and interviews so far. Working at this firm would be awesome.

If the firm had a true GPA cut-off, they likely would have asked for your transcript before having multiple partners interview you. (It would be different if you were screened by a single attorney.) Partners don't like to waste time interviewing folks that the firm would not possibly hire.

Obviously, the firm is concerned that you didn't pass the bar the first time, and your mediocre law school grades won't help matters. But there is nothing you can do to change that. Don't be defensive about your grades or your failed bar exam attempt. And don't make excuses. Focus on your strengths: you're a hard worker, a good writer, and you are really interested in the practice of this law firm. (If the last thing isn't true, do your best to make it true before your next round of interviews.)

I'm not trying to sugarcoat things: your academic record is a minus here. But unless and until the firm dings you for it, put it out of your mind. You have a real chance here. Good luck!


I had a bad gpa and it always made me paranoid going into an interview that it would be brought up. They could bring it up an interview, but focus on an upward trend (if you had one) or focus on the fact that you did well in your writing course (if this is true). Otherwise, say your academic performance is not reflective of your skills or what you can contribute to the firm then quickly talk about two or three strengths that you can offer. At this point, you have to have the mindset that they brought you in to interview for a reason. They like what they saw. You even might address the grade situation in the interview then pivot to your skills.

Also, for future reference, don't tell them you failed the bar exam on the first try. If they wonder why you took so long to take it, make an excuse. It looks bad if you failed.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby rpupkin » Thu Jun 29, 2017 5:52 pm

sparty99 wrote:Also, for future reference, don't tell them you failed the bar exam on the first try. If they wonder why you took so long to take it, make an excuse.

No. OP: You certainly shouldn't volunteer or otherwise highlight the fact that you didn't pass the bar exam on the first try, but don't lie if asked about it.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:45 am

OP here. To give an update on the situation, I did gave my grades over (no I wasnt sly and said that my dog ate my transcript or anything). After giving my grades, I've had two more interviews, meeting almost every partner at the firm. I don't know if that's a good sign, but I am going to assume it is. They clearly could've saw my grades and went...naw.

Sucks the process takes so long though...

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby rpupkin » Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:OP here. To give an update on the situation, I did gave my grades over (no I wasnt sly and said that my dog ate my transcript or anything). After giving my grades, I've had two more interviews, meeting almost every partner at the firm. I don't know if that's a good sign, but I am going to assume it is.

It's definitely a good sign. If they were going to ding you based on your grades alone, they would have done so already.

I hope you get an offer!!

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:11 am

OP Here: an update that I did get an offer from the firm that I likely will be taking. I really appreciate all the advice I received here, particularly rpupkin, thanks everyone.

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby UVA2B » Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:13 am

Anonymous User wrote:OP Here: an update that I did get an offer from the firm that I likely will be taking. I really appreciate all the advice I received here, particularly rpupkin, thanks everyone.


Congratulations!

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Re: GPA cut off mid size firm?

Postby lolwat » Thu Jul 20, 2017 12:51 pm

Anonymous User wrote:OP Here: an update that I did get an offer from the firm that I likely will be taking. I really appreciate all the advice I received here, particularly rpupkin, thanks everyone.


Congrats! :)



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