Which DC firms?

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Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:28 pm

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Last edited by Anonymous User on Tue Jun 27, 2017 11:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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UVA2B

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby UVA2B » Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:40 pm

You should probably start by listing the firms that do come to your OCI so people know to recommend others. And is your T50 in the Mid-atlantic region or somewhere else? Beyond that, with your credentials you'll just need to mass mail every firm that does the type of work you're interested in (and you should consider whether regulatory or anti-trust interest you since those are big in DC Biglaw). You should sweep NALP for every firm that does the type of work you want in DC, and apply broadly. You won't be getting firms like Williams and Connolly, Wilmerhale, etc. because those firms are much more grade/prestige sensitive, but beyond that it'll be all about quantity of applications.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:20 pm

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Last edited by Anonymous User on Tue Jun 27, 2017 11:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:30 pm

I know at least Cleary and Covington make offers to strong candidates before OCI (even when they attend the school's OCI) but I am not sure top 25% would be enough even from a T14. Probably worth emailing your app to recruiting though.

grades??

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby grades?? » Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:54 pm

Considering only DC is setting yourself up for failure

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby UVA2B » Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:55 pm

grades?? wrote:Considering only DC is setting yourself up for failure


Except they're not. They already said they're likely to go back to their 1L summer firm and just want to take shots at DC for their own reasons. This isn't a bid smartly or strike out and fail situation.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:03 pm

grades?? wrote:Considering only DC is setting yourself up for failure


I'll just assume you didn't read the initial post and wait until you do.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:05 pm

UVA2B wrote:
grades?? wrote:Considering only DC is setting yourself up for failure


Except they're not. They already said they're likely to go back to their 1L summer firm and just want to take shots at DC for their own reasons. This isn't a bid smartly or strike out and fail situation.


Thanks. Some people can't help giving dramatic advice. Anyway. Any insight into the firms I listed? Including whether they're doing well? I've heard rumors about some firms going under.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby UVA2B » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:11 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
UVA2B wrote:
grades?? wrote:Considering only DC is setting yourself up for failure


Except they're not. They already said they're likely to go back to their 1L summer firm and just want to take shots at DC for their own reasons. This isn't a bid smartly or strike out and fail situation.


Thanks. Some people can't help giving dramatic advice. Anyway. Any insight into the firms I listed? Including whether they're doing well? I've heard rumors about some firms going under.


I thought those firms were the ones coming to your OCI? Anyway, Cleary, McDermott, Norton, and Wilkie would probably be decent targets for a mixture of larger class size/less grade sensitive. Finnegan only makes sense with a STEM background. I've heard some suspect things about K&L Gates, but I don't think it's folding anytime soon and it's entirely anecdotal to the point of being dismissable. Covington and Crowell are probably out of your range, but I guess you could shoot off an email and pray. I would also consider applying to Hogan Lovells because they have a big SA class.

I understand firm life and culture is important to you. And while that's understandable, when you're in your current position, casting a wide net and seeing what you get will at least let you see inside the firms when interviewing and will be better than self-selecting out of certain firms from the outset.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:19 pm

UVA2B wrote:I thought those firms were the ones coming to your OCI? Anyway, Cleary, McDermott, Norton, and Wilkie would probably be decent targets for a mixture of larger class size/less grade sensitive.

Cleary is grade sensitive and has a small DC class (about 25 SAs)

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby UVA2B » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
UVA2B wrote:I thought those firms were the ones coming to your OCI? Anyway, Cleary, McDermott, Norton, and Wilkie would probably be decent targets for a mixture of larger class size/less grade sensitive.

Cleary is grade sensitive and has a small DC class (about 25 SAs)


Huh, for some reason I thought Cleary's DC SA class was bigger than that. I knew they were grade sensitive. Consider Cleary retracted.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby unlicensedpotato » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:24 pm

UVA2B wrote:
I understand firm life and culture is important to you. And while that's understandable, when you're in your current position, casting a wide net and seeing what you get will at least let you see inside the firms when interviewing and will be better than self-selecting out of certain firms from the outset.


Just apply and interview at the firms. Reach out to alums and connections. Mass mail all of them whether they're coming to OCI or not. Go to DC for a few days and let the firms know and see if you can get screeners or meet someone for coffee. You're going to have at least a somewhat difficult time getting offers with top 25% at a T50. No reason to start winnowing before you know where have offers.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:31 pm

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Last edited by Anonymous User on Tue Jun 27, 2017 11:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby UVA2B » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:34 pm

Anonymous User wrote:OP here. Yes, some of them put that they were looking for science backgrounds, etc. Hogan is also coming but they said Top 10% which I am not.


While occasionally those Top 10% things for OCI are pretty clear-cut GPA cutoffs, that's sometimes more informative of a want vice a need. But we're talking about mass mailing I thought?

Also, have you considered trying for 2L diversity scholarships like the one at Latham?

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:48 pm

UVA2B wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:OP here. Yes, some of them put that they were looking for science backgrounds, etc. Hogan is also coming but they said Top 10% which I am not.


While occasionally those Top 10% things for OCI are pretty clear-cut GPA cutoffs, that's sometimes more informative of a want vice a need. But we're talking about mass mailing I thought?

Also, have you considered trying for 2L diversity scholarships like the one at Latham?


Sorry if I wasn't clear. I was asking about dc firms in general, both the ones coming to OCI and ones who aren't. I completely forgot about Latham, thanks for the reminder!

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Mr. Blackacre » Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:01 pm

Anonymous User wrote:want to be somewhere that's friendly, laid back

UVA2B wrote:Also, have you considered trying for 2L diversity scholarships like the one at Latham?

:lol:

/thread

Of all the firms you listed, McDermott and Wilkie are probably the ones that fit closest. As someone else mentioned, Covington/Crowell/Cleary are probably out of the equation as too grade conscious. I would never, ever, ever consider working at K&L. They have a terrible reputation, the D.C. office especially. I would also not do Norton because there's been persistent rumors about their financial situation, and that would worry me a little.

Anonymous User wrote:Cleary is grade sensitive and has a small DC class (about 25 SAs)

That would make it one of the largest summer classes in the city, FYI. The only firms with larger classes are Hogan, W&C, Wilmer, A&P, maybe a couple more? D.C. summer classes are usually very small.

Eversheds/Eptein/A&O/King and Spalding/Vinson Elkins are going to be small offices with not a lot of summers to start with, so it'll be pretty tough to get in, but worth a shot. Willkie and McDermott have decent summer class size for DC (10ish) and a good reputation office culture-wise.

Honestly though, if you really want to get into DC I would just blanket apply everywhere. Use NALP to figure out which firms have D.C. offices and how many summers they each took this summer, and just send out a lot of cover letters. As others have mentioned, it is very difficult to break into D.C. (especially from T50) and people usually don't have the luxury of picking firms based on fit.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:29 pm

Mr. Blackacre wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:want to be somewhere that's friendly, laid back

UVA2B wrote:Also, have you considered trying for 2L diversity scholarships like the one at Latham?

:lol:

/thread

Of all the firms you listed, McDermott and Wilkie are probably the ones that fit closest. As someone else mentioned, Covington/Crowell/Cleary are probably out of the equation as too grade conscious. I would never, ever, ever consider working at K&L. They have a terrible reputation, the D.C. office especially. I would also not do Norton because there's been persistent rumors about their financial situation, and that would worry me a little.

Anonymous User wrote:Cleary is grade sensitive and has a small DC class (about 25 SAs)

That would make it one of the largest summer classes in the city, FYI. The only firms with larger classes are Hogan, W&C, Wilmer, A&P, maybe a couple more? D.C. summer classes are usually very small.

Eversheds/Eptein/A&O/King and Spalding/Vinson Elkins are going to be small offices with not a lot of summers to start with, so it'll be pretty tough to get in, but worth a shot. Willkie and McDermott have decent summer class size for DC (10ish) and a good reputation office culture-wise.

Honestly though, if you really want to get into DC I would just blanket apply everywhere. Use NALP to figure out which firms have D.C. offices and how many summers they each took this summer, and just send out a lot of cover letters. As others have mentioned, it is very difficult to break into D.C. (especially from T50) and people usually don't have the luxury of picking firms based on fit.


Thank you! It is definitely harder to hear about firms' reputations when you don't live in the area.

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:32 pm

This isn't going to be the type of answer you're looking for, but most DC firms can't be generalized like this. As a summer, most firms will be super laid-back, and as an associate, it's really going to depend on your practice group and partners (and senior associates). I have friends who work at the same firm and have wildly different experiences because they work in different areas for different people. At most, people might tell you where there's likely very little chance at being a laid back associate (e.g., Kirkland, Kellogg, etc.) but most of the firms you listed don't really fit that criteria in my experience.

If you're fairly certain you're going back to your 1L firm after graduation, a better question might be which DC firms have the most fun summer program. So you have an amazing summer, get paid $30k ($35k now?), and go back to your 1L firm.

--person who went to law school in DC, worked at a DC firm, and still has many friends working at DC firms

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Re: Which DC firms?

Postby UVA2B » Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:37 pm

Mr. Blackacre wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:want to be somewhere that's friendly, laid back

UVA2B wrote:Also, have you considered trying for 2L diversity scholarships like the one at Latham?

:lol:

/thread


:lol:

Touche.



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