Reach Firms

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Reach Firms

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:03 pm

Finishing up bid list, but still don't really know what the hell I'm doing. Is anything off the table for a 3.65 at NYU? What should I be aiming for? All these giant firms honestly look exactly the same.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby Slytherpuff » Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:10 pm

At 3.65 you should have a shot literally anywhere, depending on how well you interview.

Are you just targeting NYC? Do you know what practice areas you're interested in? Do you have anything in particular you're looking for at the firm (pro bono, offices in X cities, more diversity, etc.)? Did you attend any of the law firm receptions in the spring and get good/bad vibes from attorneys? I would try to tailor your list a little more to your interests and try to figure out what distinguishes the firms, because they really can look all the same. Just don't worry about crossing firms off the list for being too selective since your GPA will give you a foot in the door anywhere.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:15 pm

Slytherpuff wrote:At 3.65 you should have a shot literally anywhere, depending on how well you interview.

Are you just targeting NYC? Do you know what practice areas you're interested in? Do you have anything in particular you're looking for at the firm (pro bono, offices in X cities, more diversity, etc.)? Did you attend any of the law firm receptions in the spring and get good/bad vibes from attorneys? I would try to tailor your list a little more to your interests and try to figure out what distinguishes the firms, because they really can look all the same. Just don't worry about crossing firms off the list for being too selective since your GPA will give you a foot in the door anywhere.


I think I want to do M&A but I haven't done it yet, so who knows. The more I think about it, and based on my summer thus far, the more I think working in a high end litigation group could be a great match... but I mean I feel like it's pretty hard to know for sure, so I was considering bidding for both corporate and lit firms. I unfortunately didn't make it out to many of the receptions and the ones I did all seemed pretty similar to be honest. I am looking at NYC pretty exclusively now. Basically I just want to find a firm that is as less terrible as possible for big law but still has top end work and great career options down the road. I guess that is a pretty universal aspiration though.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby Slytherpuff » Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:31 pm

I think bidding for both corporate and lit firms sound like a good idea, and especially try to prioritize firms that are strong in both areas so that you can try each out during the summer. As far as finding a "less terrible" firm, I found it helpful to read through all the Vault reviews on each firm (NYU gives you free access to the premium content) and Chambers Associate to hear what associates have to say about working there. The NALP Directory is a great resource too.

Also, shoot some emails to rising 3Ls (do you have mentors from any student groups last year?) and try to get old bid lists so that you can figure out how high you have to bid a firm in order to get a screener interview. Comparing the bid list with the person's actual list of screeners can help you when constructing your own bid list.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby hangold » Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:46 pm

Congrats on your grades! In terms of NY biglaw, the only firm that's off the table for you is WLRK.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby vivala » Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:02 pm

I was around there (at NYU) and didn't get a CB at Cravath. But it was my very last interview of all of EIW so it could've just been exhaustion rather than grades that did me in.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:05 pm

hangold wrote:Congrats on your grades! In terms of NY biglaw, the only firm that's off the table for you is WLRK.


People say this, but when you look at the current WLRK associates, out of the 10 NYU associates listed on the website (excluding LLMs), only 4 were on LR, and only 5 were magna cum laude. I don't know all the factors at play, but bottom line is that 3.65 is probably not "off the table." But maybe I'm just in denial because my gpa is about the same and I have pipe dreams of WLRK.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
hangold wrote:Congrats on your grades! In terms of NY biglaw, the only firm that's off the table for you is WLRK.


People say this, but when you look at the current WLRK associates, out of the 10 NYU associates listed on the website (excluding LLMs), only 4 were on LR, and only 5 were magna cum laude. I don't know all the factors at play, but bottom line is that 3.65 is probably not "off the table." But maybe I'm just in denial because my gpa is about the same and I have pipe dreams of WLRK.


For what it's worth OCS said over a 3.6 is "fine" for WLRK, and they usually don't extend offers to people with below that. Not sure if that means once every 10 years they hire a 3.65, or if it is a common occurrence. Not sure how believable OCS is in general, or whether they just want good turn out for interviews.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby beepboopbeep » Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:34 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
hangold wrote:Congrats on your grades! In terms of NY biglaw, the only firm that's off the table for you is WLRK.


People say this, but when you look at the current WLRK associates, out of the 10 NYU associates listed on the website (excluding LLMs), only 4 were on LR, and only 5 were magna cum laude. I don't know all the factors at play, but bottom line is that 3.65 is probably not "off the table." But maybe I'm just in denial because my gpa is about the same and I have pipe dreams of WLRK.


Just as a general rule / thing to think about when looking at law firm bios, grades at OCI != grades at graduation

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:48 pm

beepboopbeep wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
hangold wrote:Congrats on your grades! In terms of NY biglaw, the only firm that's off the table for you is WLRK.


People say this, but when you look at the current WLRK associates, out of the 10 NYU associates listed on the website (excluding LLMs), only 4 were on LR, and only 5 were magna cum laude. I don't know all the factors at play, but bottom line is that 3.65 is probably not "off the table." But maybe I'm just in denial because my gpa is about the same and I have pipe dreams of WLRK.


Just as a general rule / thing to think about when looking at law firm bios, grades at OCI != grades at graduation


Fair enough. It's definitely possible that those 5 non-magna associates all had 3.8s after 1L and just slacked off during 2/3L. I'm just guessing, based on the fact that the majority didn't do LR (and so most likely couldn't grade on) and half didn't end up in the top 10%, that it's a stretch to write off WLRK with a 3.65. But point taken.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby wiz » Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:54 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
hangold wrote:Congrats on your grades! In terms of NY biglaw, the only firm that's off the table for you is WLRK.


People say this, but when you look at the current WLRK associates, out of the 10 NYU associates listed on the website (excluding LLMs), only 4 were on LR, and only 5 were magna cum laude. I don't know all the factors at play, but bottom line is that 3.65 is probably not "off the table." But maybe I'm just in denial because my gpa is about the same and I have pipe dreams of WLRK.


For what it's worth OCS said over a 3.6 is "fine" for WLRK, and they usually don't extend offers to people with below that. Not sure if that means once every 10 years they hire a 3.65, or if it is a common occurrence. Not sure how believable OCS is in general, or whether they just want good turn out for interviews.

Historically, I think WLRK has been more in the 3.8 range than 3.6, but it's technically not impossible (comes down to whether you want to say 80% leaning off the table or completely fell off the table, and do you have other factors going for you like diversity or a finance background?). That would be your reach firm with every other NY biglaw firm as a target or better.

There also just aren't a ton of data points with WLRK as there are with CSM/S&C/DPW/STB.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby TheoO » Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:49 am

From what I have seen re: WLRK, it's that they want high grades + some kind of strong pre law background. A lot of the people who had it from my school seemed to have had some financial experience prior to law school, whether it was consulting or financial analyst at some major bank. A friend of mine who had around 3.8 but didn't get offered was explicitly told by a partner that they are not as concerned with grades (so long as they are strong) as they are with having the right background + grades. But take that with a grain of salt, since it was one partner.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jun 24, 2017 4:49 pm

I was an associate at wlrk and I can tell you grades are asolutely the most important factor with your ability to think creatively and on your feet a close second.

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Re: Reach Firms

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:42 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I was an associate at wlrk and I can tell you grades are asolutely the most important factor with your ability to think creatively and on your feet a close second.

3.65 at NYU is definitely within range for an offer at Wachtell. Whether you get an offer will depend on interview and what else you have going for you.



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