ED Michigan USAO

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Anon_jd

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ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anon_jd » Mon Apr 03, 2017 11:50 pm

Anyone have any experience with this office? I'm a lateral with experience as a former state prosecutor in Maryland (4 years) with an additional three years of law firm experience (litigation focused). My wife and I are considering a move to Detroit (she's a Detroit native and would be returning for a job opportunity).

Thanks in advance.

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:33 am

Anon_jd wrote:Anyone have any experience with this office? I'm a lateral with experience as a former state prosecutor in Maryland (4 years) with an additional three years of law firm experience (litigation focused). My wife and I are considering a move to Detroit (she's a Detroit native and would be returning for a job opportunity).

Thanks in advance.


They just recently hired a whole bunch of new people and won't be hiring again for quite some time.

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:58 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:Anyone have any experience with this office? I'm a lateral with experience as a former state prosecutor in Maryland (4 years) with an additional three years of law firm experience (litigation focused). My wife and I are considering a move to Detroit (she's a Detroit native and would be returning for a job opportunity).

Thanks in advance.


They just recently hired a whole bunch of new people and won't be hiring again for quite some time.


This being said, it's worth reaching out as they may have need, who knows. Does anyone from your school work there (law or UG)? worth reaching out, or your wife's school?

Anon_jd

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anon_jd » Tue Apr 04, 2017 10:04 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:Anyone have any experience with this office? I'm a lateral with experience as a former state prosecutor in Maryland (4 years) with an additional three years of law firm experience (litigation focused). My wife and I are considering a move to Detroit (she's a Detroit native and would be returning for a job opportunity).

Thanks in advance.


They just recently hired a whole bunch of new people and won't be hiring again for quite some time.


Do you know how many? And "quite some time" like months or years?

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 04, 2017 11:15 am

Anon_jd wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:Anyone have any experience with this office? I'm a lateral with experience as a former state prosecutor in Maryland (4 years) with an additional three years of law firm experience (litigation focused). My wife and I are considering a move to Detroit (she's a Detroit native and would be returning for a job opportunity).

Thanks in advance.


They just recently hired a whole bunch of new people and won't be hiring again for quite some time.


Do you know how many? And "quite some time" like months or years?


I'm the annon that posted this (the second comment was from a different annon). I don't know the exact number, but my best guess is that it will be more than months, less than years (plural), before they hire again. Closer to a year might be about right though.

In regards to the other suggestion of reaching out, it can never hurt, but I can't imagine it will do much right now. They are in the process of replacing Barb and have a good amount of reshuffling to do once the new guy gets in, coupled with getting all the recent hires set up. Additionally, while state prosecutors experience is not bad, you will have a very tough time landing an AUSA gig if you haven't had a federal clerkship.

Best advice for you would be to start looking into clerkship prospects for the EDMI. With your experience, the salary will likely be more than you'd make as an AUSA, and it will help you get your foot into the door to the federal district and USAO.

Anon_jd

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anon_jd » Tue Apr 04, 2017 11:41 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:Anyone have any experience with this office? I'm a lateral with experience as a former state prosecutor in Maryland (4 years) with an additional three years of law firm experience (litigation focused). My wife and I are considering a move to Detroit (she's a Detroit native and would be returning for a job opportunity).

Thanks in advance.


They just recently hired a whole bunch of new people and won't be hiring again for quite some time.


Do you know how many? And "quite some time" like months or years?


I'm the annon that posted this (the second comment was from a different annon). I don't know the exact number, but my best guess is that it will be more than months, less than years (plural), before they hire again. Closer to a year might be about right though.

In regards to the other suggestion of reaching out, it can never hurt, but I can't imagine it will do much right now. They are in the process of replacing Barb and have a good amount of reshuffling to do once the new guy gets in, coupled with getting all the recent hires set up. Additionally, while state prosecutors experience is not bad, you will have a very tough time landing an AUSA gig if you haven't had a federal clerkship.

Best advice for you would be to start looking into clerkship prospects for the EDMI. With your experience, the salary will likely be more than you'd make as an AUSA, and it will help you get your foot into the door to the federal district and USAO.


Thanks for the input as well. I have considered the clerkship route but not as much. I personally know two folks that I worked with as state prosecutors who transitioned to AUSA gigs in Baltimore and Los Angeles -- so I'm holding out to see if I can be the third :D . You just never know. Speaking of salary -- was would it be for a federal clerk in Michigan or a AUSA in EDMI?

And thank you to everyone replying -- this has been very informative.

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:03 pm

Anon_jd wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:Anyone have any experience with this office? I'm a lateral with experience as a former state prosecutor in Maryland (4 years) with an additional three years of law firm experience (litigation focused). My wife and I are considering a move to Detroit (she's a Detroit native and would be returning for a job opportunity).

Thanks in advance.


They just recently hired a whole bunch of new people and won't be hiring again for quite some time.


Do you know how many? And "quite some time" like months or years?


I'm the annon that posted this (the second comment was from a different annon). I don't know the exact number, but my best guess is that it will be more than months, less than years (plural), before they hire again. Closer to a year might be about right though.

In regards to the other suggestion of reaching out, it can never hurt, but I can't imagine it will do much right now. They are in the process of replacing Barb and have a good amount of reshuffling to do once the new guy gets in, coupled with getting all the recent hires set up. Additionally, while state prosecutors experience is not bad, you will have a very tough time landing an AUSA gig if you haven't had a federal clerkship.

Best advice for you would be to start looking into clerkship prospects for the EDMI. With your experience, the salary will likely be more than you'd make as an AUSA, and it will help you get your foot into the door to the federal district and USAO.


Thanks for the input as well. I have considered the clerkship route but not as much. I personally know two folks that I worked with as state prosecutors who transitioned to AUSA gigs in Baltimore and Los Angeles -- so I'm holding out to see if I can be the third :D . You just never know. Speaking of salary -- was would it be for a federal clerk in Michigan or a AUSA in EDMI?

And thank you to everyone replying -- this has been very informative.


Most likely $93k but possibly $110k depending on what everyone else in that chamber is at. There can only be one JSP14 per chamber and that is usually the career clerk. If there isn't already a 14, you'd get $110k. If there is, you'd get $93k.

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XxSpyKEx

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby XxSpyKEx » Wed Apr 05, 2017 3:45 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:Anyone have any experience with this office? I'm a lateral with experience as a former state prosecutor in Maryland (4 years) with an additional three years of law firm experience (litigation focused). My wife and I are considering a move to Detroit (she's a Detroit native and would be returning for a job opportunity).

Thanks in advance.


They just recently hired a whole bunch of new people and won't be hiring again for quite some time.


Do you know how many? And "quite some time" like months or years?


I'm the annon that posted this (the second comment was from a different annon). I don't know the exact number, but my best guess is that it will be more than months, less than years (plural), before they hire again. Closer to a year might be about right though.

In regards to the other suggestion of reaching out, it can never hurt, but I can't imagine it will do much right now. They are in the process of replacing Barb and have a good amount of reshuffling to do once the new guy gets in, coupled with getting all the recent hires set up. Additionally, while state prosecutors experience is not bad, you will have a very tough time landing an AUSA gig if you haven't had a federal clerkship.

Best advice for you would be to start looking into clerkship prospects for the EDMI. With your experience, the salary will likely be more than you'd make as an AUSA, and it will help you get your foot into the door to the federal district and USAO.


Thanks for the input as well. I have considered the clerkship route but not as much. I personally know two folks that I worked with as state prosecutors who transitioned to AUSA gigs in Baltimore and Los Angeles -- so I'm holding out to see if I can be the third :D . You just never know. Speaking of salary -- was would it be for a federal clerk in Michigan or a AUSA in EDMI?

And thank you to everyone replying -- this has been very informative.


Most likely $93k but possibly $110k depending on what everyone else in that chamber is at. There can only be one JSP14 per chamber and that is usually the career clerk. If there isn't already a 14, you'd get $110k. If there is, you'd get $93k.


$93k is likely more than he'd earn as an AUSA in EDMI with 7 years of experience as a practicing attorney? Really? I know there are salary differences at different offices, but the equivalent of GS-13, step 1 for an attorney with 7 years of experience seems low to me.

JakeTappers

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby JakeTappers » Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:50 am

XxSpyKEx wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anon_jd wrote:Anyone have any experience with this office? I'm a lateral with experience as a former state prosecutor in Maryland (4 years) with an additional three years of law firm experience (litigation focused). My wife and I are considering a move to Detroit (she's a Detroit native and would be returning for a job opportunity).

Thanks in advance.


They just recently hired a whole bunch of new people and won't be hiring again for quite some time.


Do you know how many? And "quite some time" like months or years?


I'm the annon that posted this (the second comment was from a different annon). I don't know the exact number, but my best guess is that it will be more than months, less than years (plural), before they hire again. Closer to a year might be about right though.

In regards to the other suggestion of reaching out, it can never hurt, but I can't imagine it will do much right now. They are in the process of replacing Barb and have a good amount of reshuffling to do once the new guy gets in, coupled with getting all the recent hires set up. Additionally, while state prosecutors experience is not bad, you will have a very tough time landing an AUSA gig if you haven't had a federal clerkship.

Best advice for you would be to start looking into clerkship prospects for the EDMI. With your experience, the salary will likely be more than you'd make as an AUSA, and it will help you get your foot into the door to the federal district and USAO.


Thanks for the input as well. I have considered the clerkship route but not as much. I personally know two folks that I worked with as state prosecutors who transitioned to AUSA gigs in Baltimore and Los Angeles -- so I'm holding out to see if I can be the third :D . You just never know. Speaking of salary -- was would it be for a federal clerk in Michigan or a AUSA in EDMI?

And thank you to everyone replying -- this has been very informative.


Most likely $93k but possibly $110k depending on what everyone else in that chamber is at. There can only be one JSP14 per chamber and that is usually the career clerk. If there isn't already a 14, you'd get $110k. If there is, you'd get $93k.


$93k is likely more than he'd earn as an AUSA in EDMI with 7 years of experience as a practicing attorney? Really? I know there are salary differences at different offices, but the equivalent of GS-13, step 1 for an attorney with 7 years of experience seems low to me.


I think it's possible. The AD scale has huge variances in terms of low end to high end and from speaking to 10+ prosecutors about it, there seems to be quite a bit of fluctuation in reality as well. Likely a close call.

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 06, 2017 2:03 pm

JakeTappers wrote:
XxSpyKEx wrote:$93k is likely more than he'd earn as an AUSA in EDMI with 7 years of experience as a practicing attorney? Really? I know there are salary differences at different offices, but the equivalent of GS-13, step 1 for an attorney with 7 years of experience seems low to me.


I think it's possible. The AD scale has huge variances in terms of low end to high end and from speaking to 10+ prosecutors about it, there seems to be quite a bit of fluctuation in reality as well. Likely a close call.


Looks like the minimum for an AUSA in Detroit with seven years of experience, assuming that a person doesn't receive an Outstanding performance rating, is around $87k ($69k base + 26% locality adjustment). In my experience, though, hardly anyone makes the minimum, and it isn't too hard to earn an Outstanding rating if your supervisor doesn't hate you. If an AUSA in Detroit with an Outstanding rating has seven years of experience, his minimum is more than $100k ($82k base + 26% locality adjustment). So I don't know if it's *likely* that $93k is more than he would make as an AUSA, but you're right; it's possible.

https://www.justice.gov/usao/career-cen ... lan-charts

JakeTappers

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby JakeTappers » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:05 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
JakeTappers wrote:
XxSpyKEx wrote:$93k is likely more than he'd earn as an AUSA in EDMI with 7 years of experience as a practicing attorney? Really? I know there are salary differences at different offices, but the equivalent of GS-13, step 1 for an attorney with 7 years of experience seems low to me.


I think it's possible. The AD scale has huge variances in terms of low end to high end and from speaking to 10+ prosecutors about it, there seems to be quite a bit of fluctuation in reality as well. Likely a close call.


Looks like the minimum for an AUSA in Detroit with seven years of experience, assuming that a person doesn't receive an Outstanding performance rating, is around $87k ($69k base + 26% locality adjustment). In my experience, though, hardly anyone makes the minimum, and it isn't too hard to earn an Outstanding rating if your supervisor doesn't hate you. If an AUSA in Detroit with an Outstanding rating has seven years of experience, his minimum is more than $100k ($82k base + 26% locality adjustment). So I don't know if it's *likely* that $93k is more than he would make as an AUSA, but you're right; it's possible.

https://www.justice.gov/usao/career-cen ... lan-charts


That's good to hear -- I admittedly am still learning how this all works (as someone who has a singular goal of AUSA in the next year or so). How is the payscale determined to start, though? I understand that with an outstanding performance after year 1 (or whenever reviews are given, I seriously know nothing about reviews or how pay is actually determined) but when you are first on-board, is it just the minimum? Thanks!

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:08 pm

I think there's some flexibility for recruiting - you can start at higher than minimum. But I think it also frequently depends on the office and how the USA chooses to distribute funds (and of course budgets).

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:56 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I think there's some flexibility for recruiting - you can start at higher than minimum. But I think it also frequently depends on the office and how the USA chooses to distribute funds (and of course budgets).

TITCR. They'll just make you a salary offer that, at least in my case, is at some arbitrary point slightly above the minimum. And performance reviews, at least in my office, occur every year around February. Your performance is assessed against certain performance goals that fall under five broad categories. If you receive an Outstanding in at least three of those categories, you're eligible to receive an overall rating of Outstanding. I started in December of one year, and my supervisor gave me a Successful rating two months later. She explained that this outcome was practically certain for AUSAs who start so close to the review period because it's almost impossible to tick off enough accomplishments in such a small amount of time.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Fri Apr 07, 2017 7:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: ED Michigan USAO

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:15 am

Not disputing any of the above, but just wanted to add that you should not bank on becoming an AUSA. There are hundreds of state prosecutors in that area alone that would kill to become an AUSA. They already have the ties there and just as much, if not more, trial experience, i.e. Michigan grads that want in at AUSA. Unless you are politically connected there or have some outstanding resume, I think this is far fetched. Not trying to be rude or crush your dreams, but you should have a plan B. Hope it works out for you.



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