Have a backup offer before switching practice group? Forum

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Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Feb 23, 2017 2:51 pm

I work for someone insane and mean (daily insults, rudeness, lashing out). This partner controls my practice group and there is simply no other alternative to avoid this person unless I quit or switch practice group. The only way to switch practice group is to go talk to the managing partner, who seems nice. But my boss will probably fight it and try to get me fired. One of my coworkers just got approved for another group for the same reason but it wasnt without a fight. However this coworker has 6 yrs of exp.

Im a junior. I am way more dispensable. I have some potential interviews coming up. Should I wait to have a backup offer first or go talk to the managing partner now? Do associates usually get fired if they arent successful in transferring? (Because my boss will find out and hate me from now on). I have very little morale at the moment and have been applying elsewhere.

RaceJudicata

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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by RaceJudicata » Thu Feb 23, 2017 2:57 pm

I'd probably wait until you have another offer/fall back plan. Not so much because the boss will hate you or try and get you fired, but because the other associate recently transferred. Firm probably won't let these requests to transfer become a pattern out of a single group.

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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:04 pm

RaceJudicata wrote:I'd probably wait until you have another offer/fall back plan. Not so much because the boss will hate you or try and get you fired, but because the other associate recently transferred. Firm probably won't let these requests to transfer become a pattern out of a single group.
Op here. This partner is universally known to be a pain in the ass and there is already a pattern. Everyone working for this partner is new (under 1 yr) because 5 or 6 associates left before I came onboard. But management likes this partner because this person has a healthy book of business. So I wouldnt be the first or last. Does this change your advice?
Last edited by Anonymous User on Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Anonymous User
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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:05 pm

Waiting until another offer is in hand definitely seems like the safest play.

Npret

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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Npret » Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:10 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Waiting until another offer is in hand definitely seems like the safest play.
Yes but make sure its a job you will take ifyoudont get transferred. I'm thinking as a junior your chances of transferring are fairly low, unless another group needs someone.

You should probably just find another job you think might be better.

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Anonymous User
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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:24 pm

Npret wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Waiting until another offer is in hand definitely seems like the safest play.
Yes but make sure its a job you will take ifyoudont get transferred. I'm thinking as a junior your chances of transferring are fairly low, unless another group needs someone.

You should probably just find another job you think might be better.
:cry: what i feared most. I think i will probably get fired before I find another job. It is emotionally/psychologically taxing and im simply not billing enough at this rate.

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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:41 pm

Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?

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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:55 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?
You should be looking for new jobs right now. Literally, spend tonight fixing your resume and drafting a transaction/litigation sheet and start asking people for recommendations for recruiters and start looking tomorrow. Your situation is really toxic and you need to get out as soon as possible. Good thing is that if you are already at a firm in a major city, this process can end up being pretty quick. I wouldn't waste another second trying to do work for that person, fuck them, get out.

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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:01 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?
I also work for someone who lashes out periodically for no ostensible reason (other than bad day). Morale is very low and, having accepted a lateral offer recently, I am close to giving notice and leaving. Our group has a severe turnover issue like yours. You need to get out.

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Anonymous User
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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 5:53 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?
I also work for someone who lashes out periodically for no ostensible reason (other than bad day). Morale is very low and, having accepted a lateral offer recently, I am close to giving notice and leaving. Our group has a severe turnover issue like yours. You need to get out.
Im having a hard time lateraling out. Struck out after 2 interviews. Every interviewer is skeptical that I am trying to leave after 6 months. My only alternative as of now is try to switch practice group but that means I risk getting fired by my boss.

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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 6:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?
I also work for someone who lashes out periodically for no ostensible reason (other than bad day). Morale is very low and, having accepted a lateral offer recently, I am close to giving notice and leaving. Our group has a severe turnover issue like yours. You need to get out.
Im having a hard time lateraling out. Struck out after 2 interviews. Every interviewer is skeptical that I am trying to leave after 6 months. My only alternative as of now is try to switch practice group but that means I risk getting fired by my boss.
What practice group are you in now?

Anonymous User
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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 6:26 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?
I also work for someone who lashes out periodically for no ostensible reason (other than bad day). Morale is very low and, having accepted a lateral offer recently, I am close to giving notice and leaving. Our group has a severe turnover issue like yours. You need to get out.
Im having a hard time lateraling out. Struck out after 2 interviews. Every interviewer is skeptical that I am trying to leave after 6 months. My only alternative as of now is try to switch practice group but that means I risk getting fired by my boss.
What practice group are you in now?
Run of the mill general liability.

Anonymous User
Posts: 428122
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 6:46 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?
You should be looking for new jobs right now. Literally, spend tonight fixing your resume and drafting a transaction/litigation sheet and start asking people for recommendations for recruiters and start looking tomorrow. Your situation is really toxic and you need to get out as soon as possible. Good thing is that if you are already at a firm in a major city, this process can end up being pretty quick. I wouldn't waste another second trying to do work for that person, fuck them, get out.
I cant really "coast" while trying to look for another job. I havent been successful at getting offers because I am a junior and leaving well before the 1 year mark. I dont think employers really care or want to believe that my work environment is really toxic.

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Anonymous User
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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 6:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?
You should be looking for new jobs right now. Literally, spend tonight fixing your resume and drafting a transaction/litigation sheet and start asking people for recommendations for recruiters and start looking tomorrow. Your situation is really toxic and you need to get out as soon as possible. Good thing is that if you are already at a firm in a major city, this process can end up being pretty quick. I wouldn't waste another second trying to do work for that person, fuck them, get out.
I cant really "coast" while trying to look for another job. I havent been successful at getting offers because I am a junior and leaving well before the 1 year mark. I dont think employers really care or want to believe that my work environment is really toxic.

Are you comfortable at all going to a mentor, HR (if you have one), or (this is really playing russian roulette) the managing partner and talking about your work environment? I don't blame you at all if you don't.

The big thing is keep applying. Also does this partner follow through with threats? If he's a pissy guy/gal than this might be some of the abuse you unfortunately have to take for awhile.

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Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 7:53 pm

The managing partner announced that it is firm policy to allow associates to switch practice groups. So I can talk to him but my boss is extremely vindictive and cunning. He is known to have taken vengeful acts. He might form a story that my billables and work quality suck and I should be fired.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:17 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?
You should be looking for new jobs right now. Literally, spend tonight fixing your resume and drafting a transaction/litigation sheet and start asking people for recommendations for recruiters and start looking tomorrow. Your situation is really toxic and you need to get out as soon as possible. Good thing is that if you are already at a firm in a major city, this process can end up being pretty quick. I wouldn't waste another second trying to do work for that person, fuck them, get out.
I cant really "coast" while trying to look for another job. I havent been successful at getting offers because I am a junior and leaving well before the 1 year mark. I dont think employers really care or want to believe that my work environment is really toxic.
Wait hold your horses - you're not going into these interviews telling these firms you're trying to leave because the "work environment is really toxic" are you?

Doesn't matter how much you hate your firm or how truly awful they are. You never badmouth your current employer to an interviewer. Sadly OP, you'll need to lie and spin your desire to switch firms in a positive light: I'd love to get more exposure in ____ and at my current group I keep doing ____ or such and such practice group has no immediate openings so I'm looking to lateral out.

Anonymous User
Posts: 428122
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Have a backup offer before switching practice group?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:23 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Op here.

My boss lost my workproduct and accused me for never having done it. Threatened to fire me for padding hours on work I did not do. I got caught off guard and could not answer what the document he was talking about. It turns out it was some work I had done a month ago. I brought over the work product and forwarded him the emails exchanges containing the assignment and my responses.

This guy never read my workproduct and responds saying even if I did not pad my hours the workproduct is shitty and unusable. How could he know that without habing read it? Pretty sure he is just cleaning the trails in case something happens.

I really need to leave dont I?
You should be looking for new jobs right now. Literally, spend tonight fixing your resume and drafting a transaction/litigation sheet and start asking people for recommendations for recruiters and start looking tomorrow. Your situation is really toxic and you need to get out as soon as possible. Good thing is that if you are already at a firm in a major city, this process can end up being pretty quick. I wouldn't waste another second trying to do work for that person, fuck them, get out.
I cant really "coast" while trying to look for another job. I havent been successful at getting offers because I am a junior and leaving well before the 1 year mark. I dont think employers really care or want to believe that my work environment is really toxic.
Wait hold your horses - you're not going into these interviews telling these firms you're trying to leave because the "work environment is really toxic" are you?

Doesn't matter how much you hate your firm or how truly awful they are. You never badmouth your current employer to an interviewer. Sadly OP, you'll need to lie and spin your desire to switch firms in a positive light: I'd love to get more exposure in ____ and at my current group I keep doing ____ or such and such practice group has no immediate openings so I'm looking to lateral out.
Yeah of course. I only apply to positions I am interested in and I make that my point. I wouldnt even bring up how crappy my boss is even if/when I talk to the managaing partner to change my practice group.

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