Being am SA while pregnant?

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run26.2

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby run26.2 » Thu Nov 17, 2016 4:24 pm

MarkinKansasCity wrote:I realize this is completely non-responsive, but holy shit at this profession. I don't mean this as criticism OP, but God biglaw is fucked if people are literally considering giving up their firstborn for a job.

This is only the first of 10,000 times OP (and others similarly situated) will have to decide between career and kid. I do it more days than I like to admit. It's the terrible reality for many people in biglaw (and other professions).

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kalvano

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby kalvano » Thu Nov 17, 2016 5:52 pm

run26.2 wrote:
MarkinKansasCity wrote:I realize this is completely non-responsive, but holy shit at this profession. I don't mean this as criticism OP, but God biglaw is fucked if people are literally considering giving up their firstborn for a job.

This is only the first of 10,000 times OP (and others similarly situated) will have to decide between career and kid. I do it more days than I like to admit. It's the terrible reality for many people in biglaw (and other professions).


I think you're missing some glaring differences in 9,999 of those choices and this 1 choice.

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MKC

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby MKC » Thu Nov 17, 2016 5:59 pm

kalvano wrote:
run26.2 wrote:
MarkinKansasCity wrote:I realize this is completely non-responsive, but holy shit at this profession. I don't mean this as criticism OP, but God biglaw is fucked if people are literally considering giving up their firstborn for a job.

This is only the first of 10,000 times OP (and others similarly situated) will have to decide between career and kid. I do it more days than I like to admit. It's the terrible reality for many people in biglaw (and other professions).


I think you're missing some glaring differences in 9,999 of those choices and this 1 choice.


Depending on the first choice, you might not have to make the other 9,999 choices.
Last edited by MKC on Sat Jan 27, 2018 4:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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zot1

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby zot1 » Thu Nov 17, 2016 6:34 pm

MarkinKansasCity wrote:
kalvano wrote:
run26.2 wrote:
MarkinKansasCity wrote:I realize this is completely non-responsive, but holy shit at this profession. I don't mean this as criticism OP, but God biglaw is fucked if people are literally considering giving up their firstborn for a job.

This is only the first of 10,000 times OP (and others similarly situated) will have to decide between career and kid. I do it more days than I like to admit. It's the terrible reality for many people in biglaw (and other professions).


I think you're missing some glaring differences in 9,999 of those choices and this 1 choice.


Depending on the first choice, you might not have to make the other 9,999 choices.


Hero.

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Voyager » Thu Nov 17, 2016 6:37 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hi all,
I found out I was pregnant this morning. Extremely unexpected as I am on birth control. I am engaged and I think under most circumstances we would continue the pregnancy. However, my approximate due date is right at the end of the summer associate program I have been offered and accepted at a V100. It is a very small program on the west coast and I will only be one of four summers. This is a firm I could see myself at long term, and although they have a 100% offer rate, I am a bit concerned about being 8/9 months pregnant during the program. Are there any big law associates out there that worked through their pregnancy? Would this effect my chances of getting a full time offer? This is my first pregnancy and I don't really know if working during my last trimester is even feasible. Would appreciate any insight. I know that this summer will make or break my career and my partner and I have decided to terminate if doing the program in my final trimester is insane.


There are lots of reasonable reasons to make major life decisions including whether to keep a pregnancy

An offer from a piece of crap sweat shop law firm is NOT one of them.

Also, you can SUE THE POOP OUT OF THEM if they don't give you an offer.

You may decide to not keep the baby for any number of reasons... fine.

But please don't make one of them biglaw. F those guys. They treat everyone like shit, will own you anyway and are NOT GOING TO NO OFFER YOU based on you being pregnant.

If they do, go RIGHT to HR and threaten to sue.

EDIT: Just read rest of thread. Congrats to OP for reaching a decision NOT based on what a law firm thought.

run26.2

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby run26.2 » Thu Nov 17, 2016 7:01 pm

kalvano wrote:
run26.2 wrote:
MarkinKansasCity wrote:I realize this is completely non-responsive, but holy shit at this profession. I don't mean this as criticism OP, but God biglaw is fucked if people are literally considering giving up their firstborn for a job.

This is only the first of 10,000 times OP (and others similarly situated) will have to decide between career and kid. I do it more days than I like to admit. It's the terrible reality for many people in biglaw (and other professions).


I think you're missing some glaring differences in 9,999 of those choices and this 1 choice.

I realize the difference. But since the decision appears to have been made, I thought it was worth noting that it isn't like you make a choice to have a kid and then go do biglaw like you would normally. Hopefully that is self-evident, but in case not...

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 17, 2016 7:33 pm

OP here. I would really like to keep the discussion on point and hear from woman who worked up until their due dates. In other news, regardless of my choice, the whole calling me an awful person/would be murderer because I considered terminating for like six hours due to possible career concerns is so inappropriate and messed up it's unreal. Like another person mentioned, women are not just baby vessels. They are real people with their own agency who may or may not want to be sick for three months straight and push another human out of their body for all sorts of reasons, including career. They are entitled to consider whether or not a particular pregnancy jives with their life goals and if the timing is right for them. So if anyone wants to comment with judgment, especially any dude who wants to comment with judgment who will never have to make this sort of difficult decision, you can kindly fuck off.

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 17, 2016 8:23 pm

Anonymous User wrote:OP here. I would really like to keep the discussion on point and hear from woman who worked up until their due dates. In other news, regardless of my choice, the whole calling me an awful person/would be murderer because I considered terminating for like six hours due to possible career concerns is so inappropriate and messed up it's unreal. Like another person mentioned, women are not just baby vessels. They are real people with their own agency who may or may not want to be sick for three months straight and push another human out of their body for all sorts of reasons, including career. They are entitled to consider whether or not a particular pregnancy jives with their life goals and if the timing is right for them. So if anyone wants to comment with judgment, especially any dude who wants to comment with judgment who will never have to make this sort of difficult decision, you can kindly fuck off.


Tell 'em.

I don't have anything to offer really besides congratulations and good luck!

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 17, 2016 8:41 pm

I worked (granted not as a SA) until my due date with only one problem day, but it is a little TMI to share details on a forum (PM if you want more info). There were absolutely no problems/judgment from anyone. Mostly just a lot of excitement and promises to bring the baby back to visit.

I gave birth during the summer before 3L. Husband and I never wanted kids, planned to terminate, couldn't live with the decision. Have to say, no regrets. Baby girl is awesome.

On to the bad stuff (that you didn't ask about but I'll share anyways). My husband travels for work about half the time. Living on his salary we can't afford full time child care (which is all that is available for infants in my area at least). Add in an hour commute to school and my options for 3L basically went to shit. No clinics, no public service volunteer clinics, and very limited class selection. Wouldn't be surviving right now if it weren't for the fact my good friend is able to watch baby girl on the cheap two days a week. However, this is very circumstance specific and may not apply to you at all.

run26.2

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby run26.2 » Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:15 pm

I think people are generally stating that it's not that big of a deal. You should be able to work almost all the way up til the due date. If not, the firm will likely be accommodating.

If I were in your shoes, I'd think about reaching out to them to let them know and talking about alternatives, e.g., seeing if you can start early, so you will be less likely to deliver while you're doing your SA. Also, since it's your first, there's a good chance you'll be past the due date, in case the overwhelming concern is that you don't go into labor while you're working.

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:57 pm

run26.2 wrote:I think people are generally stating that it's not that big of a deal. You should be able to work almost all the way up til the due date. If not, the firm will likely be accommodating.

If I were in your shoes, I'd think about reaching out to them to let them know and talking about alternatives, e.g., seeing if you can start early, so you will be less likely to deliver while you're doing your SA. Also, since it's your first, there's a good chance you'll be past the due date, in case the overwhelming concern is that you don't go into labor while you're working.


This is not always the case. Every first baby on my side and my husband's side came two weeks early, so we planned on our baby being early as well. She came on her due date. There is absolutely no way to know whether the baby will be early, late, or on time.

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby patentlitigatrix » Thu Nov 17, 2016 11:17 pm

Anonymous User wrote:OP here. I would really like to keep the discussion on point and hear from woman who worked up until their due dates. In other news, regardless of my choice, the whole calling me an awful person/would be murderer because I considered terminating for like six hours due to possible career concerns is so inappropriate and messed up it's unreal. Like another person mentioned, women are not just baby vessels. They are real people with their own agency who may or may not want to be sick for three months straight and push another human out of their body for all sorts of reasons, including career. They are entitled to consider whether or not a particular pregnancy jives with their life goals and if the timing is right for them. So if anyone wants to comment with judgment, especially any dude who wants to comment with judgment who will never have to make this sort of difficult decision, you can kindly fuck off.


Feel free to PM me with any specific questions you have! The baby I was carrying during my SA was my second bio kid.

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby LizLemler » Fri Nov 18, 2016 1:07 am

Anonymous User wrote:OP here. I would really like to keep the discussion on point and hear from woman who worked up until their due dates. In other news, regardless of my choice, the whole calling me an awful person/would be murderer because I considered terminating for like six hours due to possible career concerns is so inappropriate and messed up it's unreal. Like another person mentioned, women are not just baby vessels. They are real people with their own agency who may or may not want to be sick for three months straight and push another human out of their body for all sorts of reasons, including career. They are entitled to consider whether or not a particular pregnancy jives with their life goals and if the timing is right for them. So if anyone wants to comment with judgment, especially any dude who wants to comment with judgment who will never have to make this sort of difficult decision, you can kindly fuck off.


OP -- you are incredible. Please check out Corporette. A number of female attorneys post regularly and many of them have children. It's a wonderful community.

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landshoes

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby landshoes » Fri Nov 18, 2016 11:57 am

patentlitigatrix wrote:
araceli wrote:I had good reviews from the attorneys I worked with and as far as I know had no trouble getting an offer. Everyone was happy for me and encouraging and it really didn't seem like it would have been a problem if I had had to leave a week or two early if the baby came early. I was in a city separate from my husband/where I went to law school so I just made sure to line up a doula, OB, hospital to deliver at, and other support options in case the baby came while I was still working.

I missed one day of work that summer to go back for a prenatal appointment with my own doctor. That was not a problem; I consulted with the summer program on when it would be least-disruptive to schedule it and no one batted an eye. Other people missed a day to attend a wedding or because they were sick or something so it was completely not a big deal.

Here is what you need:
Dresses and tops from Isabella Oliver
A suit jacket one size up from your current size (do not bother with maternity suits, they all suck)
Maternity spanx and maternity nylons
a bellaband to hold up your suit pants
maternity skirts
a really great massage therapist and a personal trainer or prenatal yoga instructor to keep you in good shape

You really couldn't have timed this better. Go for it, kids are amazing and I actually love biglaw too.


I agree with basically all of this, but bolded parts that particularly resonated. I was about the same level of pregnant for my SA, but I was showing like crazy from the start.

I am convinced that aside from luck, one of the big reasons that my pregnancies were easy even though my babies were HUGE was that I remained in good physical shape and ate a healthy diet/avoided eating based on cravings. I couldn't do much during my third trimesters except swim and do some minimal resistance training, but swimming laps is excellent exercise and safe. If you don't already do it, I would highly recommend trying to get into it.


Exercise is good advice but having a difficult pregnancy is not the fault of the woman "eating based on cravings" or whatever. Health problems happen to a lot of people who do everything you did.

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby patentlitigatrix » Fri Nov 18, 2016 12:06 pm

landshoes wrote:
patentlitigatrix wrote:
araceli wrote:I had good reviews from the attorneys I worked with and as far as I know had no trouble getting an offer. Everyone was happy for me and encouraging and it really didn't seem like it would have been a problem if I had had to leave a week or two early if the baby came early. I was in a city separate from my husband/where I went to law school so I just made sure to line up a doula, OB, hospital to deliver at, and other support options in case the baby came while I was still working.

I missed one day of work that summer to go back for a prenatal appointment with my own doctor. That was not a problem; I consulted with the summer program on when it would be least-disruptive to schedule it and no one batted an eye. Other people missed a day to attend a wedding or because they were sick or something so it was completely not a big deal.

Here is what you need:
Dresses and tops from Isabella Oliver
A suit jacket one size up from your current size (do not bother with maternity suits, they all suck)
Maternity spanx and maternity nylons
a bellaband to hold up your suit pants
maternity skirts
a really great massage therapist and a personal trainer or prenatal yoga instructor to keep you in good shape

You really couldn't have timed this better. Go for it, kids are amazing and I actually love biglaw too.


I agree with basically all of this, but bolded parts that particularly resonated. I was about the same level of pregnant for my SA, but I was showing like crazy from the start.

I am convinced that aside from luck, one of the big reasons that my pregnancies were easy even though my babies were HUGE was that I remained in good physical shape and ate a healthy diet/avoided eating based on cravings. I couldn't do much during my third trimesters except swim and do some minimal resistance training, but swimming laps is excellent exercise and safe. If you don't already do it, I would highly recommend trying to get into it.


Exercise is good advice but having a difficult pregnancy is not the fault of the woman "eating based on cravings" or whatever. Health problems happen to a lot of people who do everything you did.


Never said it was.

Edit to qualify that: A lot of people feel crappy if they eat badly and don't exercise when not pregnant. All I was saying is that I maintained healthy habits and I do believe it helped me feel better throughout my pregnancies-less tired, more alert, little to no aches/pains, etc. There are of course women who have serious medical issues beyond their control.

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landshoes

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby landshoes » Fri Nov 18, 2016 12:16 pm

dixiecupdrinking wrote:
landshoes wrote:If you're considering terminating, you should terminate. It's better to have a kid when you're 100%, for both you and the kid.

ETA: I don't mean this in a guilt-tripping way. I just think that if this isn't the right time for you because you'll be stressed and unhappy, then it's not the right time. None of us can guarantee your employer will or won't act differently towards you, and so if terminating is an option for you, I think it's best to take it.

My feeling is that you should have a child when you can feel happy and secure about bringing that child into the world. This doesn't sound like that kind of situation to me, so I would choose another time.

I think that followed literally this advice would cause literally everyone to have abortions. No one is ever 100% ready.


Someone's got to move the Overton window away from "omg baby killer how dare u even consider it." Seriously, though:

I think a lot of people are 100% committed to having a child, which is different from being 100% ready. And I do think that children deserve a completely committed parent. It is not fair to bring a child into the world without a real and honest look at your own level of commitment towards parenting. That means understanding the ways in which having a child might negatively impact your life, and being willing to accept those risks in order to have a child. A child might be perfectly healthy. A child might need daily care for the rest of their life. A pregnancy might be uneventful. A pregnancy might lead to long-term disability or death for the mother or the child. You don't really get to pick, and there are no guarantees. Wrecking an SA is one of the least bad possible negative outcomes. If that relatively mild possibility is enough to make committing to a child seem impossible, perhaps it's not the right time.

OP seems to have made her decision, so congrats, OP. Pregnancy is relatively unpredictable, but you'll likely be fine. The biggest thing will be work-appropriate clothing. A lot of people do dress + blazer + leggings + ballet flats.

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby elendinel » Fri Nov 18, 2016 7:19 pm

landshoes wrote:
patentlitigatrix wrote:I agree with basically all of this, but bolded parts that particularly resonated. I was about the same level of pregnant for my SA, but I was showing like crazy from the start.

I am convinced that aside from luck, one of the big reasons that my pregnancies were easy even though my babies were HUGE was that I remained in good physical shape and ate a healthy diet/avoided eating based on cravings. I couldn't do much during my third trimesters except swim and do some minimal resistance training, but swimming laps is excellent exercise and safe. If you don't already do it, I would highly recommend trying to get into it.


Exercise is good advice but having a difficult pregnancy is not the fault of the woman "eating based on cravings" or whatever. Health problems happen to a lot of people who do everything you did.


I think the point was purely that good health makes it easier to feel better during the pregnancy. Which frankly is true (on average, good in generally means good/improved out). I don't think the implication was literally that all health problems can be solved by eating healthy and exercising (the poster said "luck" before all else, after all).

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Nov 19, 2016 9:05 pm

If it's helpful, two years ago we had a summer associate at my firm who was pregnant, and left the summer program about a week early to give birth. She got an offer, and everyone I'm aware of at the firm was very supportive of her-- especially the women attorneys. I work at a V15 and hope that other top firms would be similarly supportive.

Also, I am a junior associate who is currently pregnant. I plan to work right up until my due date this spring, and, again, have received nothing but congratulations and support from my colleagues. I am very hopeful you will have the same experience. I know firms have different cultures, but thought it might be helpful for you to hear from someone who is having a positive experience being pregnant as a junior person in big law. I am certain that having a baby and being a junior associate will be challenging, but I really feel like my colleagues want to help me find ways to succeed. Hopefully their attitude will be similar to what you encounter. Good luck and congratulations!

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Nov 19, 2016 9:13 pm

Also, I highly recommend renting your maternity clothes from Le Tote. They have great options for pregnant ladies who need business appropriate clothes, and that way you don't have to spend a ton of money on clothes you do t especially want/need in the long term.

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Clyde Frog

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Clyde Frog » Sat Nov 19, 2016 9:24 pm

landshoes wrote:If you're considering terminating, you should terminate. It's better to have a kid when you're 100%, for both you and the kid.

ETA: I don't mean this in a guilt-tripping way. I just think that if this isn't the right time for you because you'll be stressed and unhappy, then it's not the right time. None of us can guarantee your employer will or won't act differently towards you, and so if terminating is an option for you, I think it's best to take it.

My feeling is that you should have a child when you can feel happy and secure about bringing that child into the world. This doesn't sound like that kind of situation to me, so I would choose another time.


Do you have kids?

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Miss Trial » Sat Nov 19, 2016 11:05 pm

I really think many of the responses here are underestimating just how great a pregnancy (or young children) can impact a woman at a job - any job - but especially a legal job.

I have kids, and while am only a 1L, I have spoken with several women who were (visibly) pregnant during OCI, or during SA, and they say it did impact them. One woman I know who was 7-8 months during OCI said she only got 1 call back out of about 20. She seems like a really good candidate - quick witted, professional - and her experience was very different from nearly everyone else in her class.

Yes, it is illegal to discriminate based on an employee being pregnant or having children. But it happens all the time and it is very difficult to prove. I think being pregnant will affect your SA and it will continue to affect you if you decide to become a parent in virtually everything you will do in your career. It's 2016, but the burden still weighs heavily on women to be the primary caretakers of children (and aging parents) and those things will impact you, on top of the additional barriers you will face simply for being female (even without the kids).

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Re: Being am SA while pregnant?

Postby Clyde Frog » Sun Nov 20, 2016 3:11 am

Miss Trial wrote:I really think many of the responses here are underestimating just how great a pregnancy (or young children) can impact a woman at a job - any job - but especially a legal job.

I have kids, and while am only a 1L, I have spoken with several women who were (visibly) pregnant during OCI, or during SA, and they say it did impact them. One woman I know who was 7-8 months during OCI said she only got 1 call back out of about 20. She seems like a really good candidate - quick witted, professional - and her experience was very different from nearly everyone else in her class.

Yes, it is illegal to discriminate based on an employee being pregnant or having children. But it happens all the time and it is very difficult to prove. I think being pregnant will affect your SA and it will continue to affect you if you decide to become a parent in virtually everything you will do in your career. It's 2016, but the burden still weighs heavily on women to be the primary caretakers of children (and aging parents) and those things will impact you, on top of the additional barriers you will face simply for being female (even without the kids).


OP already said she's having the kid.



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