Hiring Freezes??

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 14, 2016 9:56 am

Can people with offers please check in with their HRs and report back?

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 14, 2016 10:09 am

Word I hear from at least one DOJ finalist is that they are going to attempt to give an offer but it wont be final until the new administration and with the rhetoric, probably not actually get a job.

Also, rumor is the CRD is gonna accept even less people now because word has come down Trump wants it cut in half at least.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 14, 2016 10:50 am

Anonymous User wrote:Also, rumor is the CRD is gonna accept even less people now because word has come down Trump wants it cut in half at least.


I mean....just scary. Speechless. I refuse to sit back and accept this.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 14, 2016 10:55 am

Anonymous User wrote:Word I hear from at least one DOJ finalist is that they are going to attempt to give an offer but it wont be final until the new administration and with the rhetoric, probably not actually get a job.

Also, rumor is the CRD is gonna accept even less people now because word has come down Trump wants it cut in half at least.


Fuck. I'm trying to get in touch with my HR. I'll report back. This has to be the case in literally every agency, independent or otherwise, so SOME ONE has to have information.

Even if it's just "yeah retroactive is definitely not happening because xyz law prevents that." I mean. SOMETHING.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 14, 2016 11:05 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Word I hear from at least one DOJ finalist is that they are going to attempt to give an offer but it wont be final until the new administration and with the rhetoric, probably not actually get a job.

Also, rumor is the CRD is gonna accept even less people now because word has come down Trump wants it cut in half at least.


Fuck. I'm trying to get in touch with my HR. I'll report back. This has to be the case in literally every agency, independent or otherwise, so SOME ONE has to have information.

Even if it's just "yeah retroactive is definitely not happening because xyz law prevents that." I mean. SOMETHING.


Probably not actually because we have seen Trump literally has no idea what he is doing. He is trying to go home to Trump tower every night after "work" in the White House. He literally has no conception of what is required of him now. So I would actually doubt there is much information that has been confirmed with his now bat-shit insane staff (looking at you Bannon).

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby jbagelboy » Mon Nov 14, 2016 11:34 am

Why would you want to work for the trump administration? Honestly curious. Art III is one thing and probably safe and surely it varies by department, but a political branch could be implicating by association.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Mon Nov 14, 2016 11:52 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Word I hear from at least one DOJ finalist is that they are going to attempt to give an offer but it wont be final until the new administration and with the rhetoric, probably not actually get a job.

Also, rumor is the CRD is gonna accept even less people now because word has come down Trump wants it cut in half at least.


Fuck. I'm trying to get in touch with my HR. I'll report back. This has to be the case in literally every agency, independent or otherwise, so SOME ONE has to have information.

Even if it's just "yeah retroactive is definitely not happening because xyz law prevents that." I mean. SOMETHING.


Probably not actually because we have seen Trump literally has no idea what he is doing. He is trying to go home to Trump tower every night after "work" in the White House. He literally has no conception of what is required of him now. So I would actually doubt there is much information that has been confirmed with his now bat-shit insane staff (looking at you Bannon).

Yeah no one has information because it literally doesn't exist yet. If Trump doesn't actually know what he's gonna do then HR sure as shit doesn't either.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby ConfusedL1 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 12:13 pm

dixiecupdrinking wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Word I hear from at least one DOJ finalist is that they are going to attempt to give an offer but it wont be final until the new administration and with the rhetoric, probably not actually get a job.

Also, rumor is the CRD is gonna accept even less people now because word has come down Trump wants it cut in half at least.


Fuck. I'm trying to get in touch with my HR. I'll report back. This has to be the case in literally every agency, independent or otherwise, so SOME ONE has to have information.

Even if it's just "yeah retroactive is definitely not happening because xyz law prevents that." I mean. SOMETHING.


Probably not actually because we have seen Trump literally has no idea what he is doing. He is trying to go home to Trump tower every night after "work" in the White House. He literally has no conception of what is required of him now. So I would actually doubt there is much information that has been confirmed with his now bat-shit insane staff (looking at you Bannon).

Yeah no one has information because it literally doesn't exist yet. If Trump doesn't actually know what he's gonna do then HR sure as shit doesn't either.


I dunno. I think it's possible some HR reps could at least give more insight than the internet on this.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby globetrotter659 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 12:33 pm

Honors Program hiring is all about whether funding has been appropriated. Even during the hiring freeze created by the sequester, agencies were still hiring honors attorneys (albeit smaller classes and some agencies did suspend their programs). I wouldn't expect much of a change for this year's class because the money is there. The real issue is what happens once your two year probationary period is up to convert to permanent staff. Again it depends on the agency since some have automatic conversions while others require you to apply to open positions.

It's going to be a very uncertain four years in government. If you don't want that uncertainty in your life, I suggest that you look for employment elsewhere.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Nov 14, 2016 12:47 pm

globetrotter659 wrote:Honors Program hiring is all about whether funding has been appropriated. Even during the hiring freeze created by the sequester, agencies were still hiring honors attorneys (albeit smaller classes and some agencies did suspend their programs). I wouldn't expect much of a change for this year's class because the money is there. The real issue is what happens once your two year probationary period is up to convert to permanent staff. Again it depends on the agency since some have automatic conversions while others require you to apply to open positions.

It's going to be a very uncertain four years in government. If you don't want that uncertainty in your life, I suggest that you look for employment elsewhere.


That's somewhat encouraging.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby globetrotter659 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 1:01 pm

I need to rephrase my answer. The money should be there. Right now we're operating on a CR and who knows what the next Congress does. Agencies right now are making hiring decisions assuming the CR stays in place. It is very likely that non-defense and national security related agencies will face a budget climate like they faced under the sequester. Your HR contacts don't really know anything. I suggest you start following the Congressional appropriations process. Also the smart question to ask in your interview is how the agency's honors program operated during the sequester.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Nightingale » Mon Nov 14, 2016 1:54 pm

Have independent (self-funded) agencies historically been insulated from these types of hiring freezes?

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby andythefir » Mon Nov 14, 2016 2:46 pm

globetrotter659 wrote:I need to rephrase my answer. The money should be there. Right now we're operating on a CR and who knows what the next Congress does. Agencies right now are making hiring decisions assuming the CR stays in place. It is very likely that non-defense and national security related agencies will face a budget climate like they faced under the sequester. Your HR contacts don't really know anything. I suggest you start following the Congressional appropriations process. Also the smart question to ask in your interview is how the agency's honors program operated during the sequester.


According to the career bureaucrats I've spoken with, combined with my experience as a prosecutor, people who are either (1) post-offer pending background check or (2) in the DOJ pipeline should be fine. Post offer pre background check should have no problem because the money for their position comes from the last CR, so the new hiring freeze will only become relevant after the CR that ends in December. I suppose the new CR in December could have cuts, but trump's hiring freeze will only become relevant after that CR ends. I agree that coming out of the probationary year could be a problem, though.

As for the DOJ, none of trump's policies make any sense combined with cutting DOJ funding. More importantly, if trump makes any of the immigration changes re deporting immigrants charged with criminal offenses, they will need to WAY more AUSAs. Trump's proposed framework means no more pleas, which means a gigantic increase in the number of trials. Immigration seems to be his only schtick he's stuck with, so it would make no sense to let cases get away from the DOJ because they're understaffed. Not to mention a brain drain, especially in border jurisdictions, is certain.

All that said, none of us have any idea about what he will actually do. I'm hopeful that the hiring freeze as a tool to clean up corruption (that's his justification for it) will be one of the many commitments that goes nowhere.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 17, 2016 5:19 pm

Bump. Anyone heard anything on this? I talked to an independent agency, and they didn't give me a straight answer. I'm reaching out to the person who hired me for more information. I think everyone doing government honors programs should be asking this question.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:38 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Bump. Anyone heard anything on this? I talked to an independent agency, and they didn't give me a straight answer. I'm reaching out to the person who hired me for more information. I think everyone doing government honors programs should be asking this question.


I've been contacting a LOT of HRs for positions and getting the same "we're planning to be fine but can't promise." Right now I think the safest bet is to try like hell to get the permanent offer letter BEFORE election day.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby zot1 » Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:45 pm

No one will give you a straight answer because the truth is no one is sure what will happen. However, HR will be careful for obvious reasons.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby andythefir » Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:46 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I've been contacting a LOT of HRs for positions and getting the same "we're planning to be fine but can't promise." Right now I think the safest bet is to try like hell to get the permanent offer letter BEFORE election day.


Any offer you're going to get from the government, especially the federal government, is going to say "we're offering you the job subject to 1 passing a background check and 2 funding." So even an offer isn't foolproof.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Nov 18, 2016 8:48 am

andythefir wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I've been contacting a LOT of HRs for positions and getting the same "we're planning to be fine but can't promise." Right now I think the safest bet is to try like hell to get the permanent offer letter BEFORE election day.


Any offer you're going to get from the government, especially the federal government, is going to say "we're offering you the job subject to 1 passing a background check and 2 funding." So even an offer isn't foolproof.



I can confirm this very soon for law jobs, but this has not been my previous experience. The final offer assumes that the background check is complete. That's one of the main differences between the "tentative" and "formal" letters that poster seemed to be referring to

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Nov 18, 2016 9:55 am

Anonymous User wrote:
andythefir wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I've been contacting a LOT of HRs for positions and getting the same "we're planning to be fine but can't promise." Right now I think the safest bet is to try like hell to get the permanent offer letter BEFORE election day.


Any offer you're going to get from the government, especially the federal government, is going to say "we're offering you the job subject to 1 passing a background check and 2 funding." So even an offer isn't foolproof.



I can confirm this very soon for law jobs, but this has not been my previous experience. The final offer assumes that the background check is complete. That's one of the main differences between the "tentative" and "formal" letters that poster seemed to be referring to

That wasn't my experience. I just got an offer, no tentative/formal distinction. Then I got an offer letter in December. My background check started after I got the offer letter. I never actually was told when it finished - I got a call in the spring saying "we can't conclude your background check without a start date, when do you want to start?" But they never told me the check was actually done.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby andythefir » Fri Nov 18, 2016 11:16 am

Anonymous User wrote: That wasn't my experience. I just got an offer, no tentative/formal distinction. Then I got an offer letter in December. My background check started after I got the offer letter. I never actually was told when it finished - I got a call in the spring saying "we can't conclude your background check without a start date, when do you want to start?" But they never told me the check was actually done.


My understanding is that most background check jobs go advertise>interview>tentative offer explicitly saying job is contingent on funding and check>background check>start date.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Nov 18, 2016 11:58 am

I'm sure that's correct. Just wasn't my experience.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby star fox » Fri Nov 18, 2016 8:37 pm

jbagelboy wrote:Why would you want to work for the trump administration? Honestly curious. Art III is one thing and probably safe and surely it varies by department, but a political branch could be implicating by association.

It's a bit of a stretch to say everyone who works for the federal government is working for the Trump Administration. Nobody is going to be implicated.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Nov 18, 2016 8:43 pm

star fox wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:Why would you want to work for the trump administration? Honestly curious. Art III is one thing and probably safe and surely it varies by department, but a political branch could be implicating by association.

It's a bit of a stretch to say everyone who works for the federal government is working for the Trump Administration. Nobody is going to be implicated.


Disagree. DOJ certainly will be now under Sessions. The things he's gonna make DOJ do will cross constitutional lines. Remember this is a guy who doesn't believe the voting rights act is good legislation. It is my pure speculation anyone not on board of the Sessions train will be purged very quickly from DOJ.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby star fox » Fri Nov 18, 2016 8:51 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
star fox wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:Why would you want to work for the trump administration? Honestly curious. Art III is one thing and probably safe and surely it varies by department, but a political branch could be implicating by association.

It's a bit of a stretch to say everyone who works for the federal government is working for the Trump Administration. Nobody is going to be implicated.


Disagree. DOJ certainly will be now under Sessions. The things he's gonna make DOJ do will cross constitutional lines. Remember this is a guy who doesn't believe the voting rights act is good legislation. It is my pure speculation anyone not on board of the Sessions train will be purged very quickly from DOJ.

There's a lot of bureaucracy in-between getting hired at the DOJ and working directly for Jeff Sessions.

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Re: Hiring Freezes??

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Nov 18, 2016 8:54 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
star fox wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:Why would you want to work for the trump administration? Honestly curious. Art III is one thing and probably safe and surely it varies by department, but a political branch could be implicating by association.

It's a bit of a stretch to say everyone who works for the federal government is working for the Trump Administration. Nobody is going to be implicated.


Disagree. DOJ certainly will be now under Sessions. The things he's gonna make DOJ do will cross constitutional lines. Remember this is a guy who doesn't believe the voting rights act is good legislation. It is my pure speculation anyone not on board of the Sessions train will be purged very quickly from DOJ.

Eh, there's an awful lot of grunt work involved in working for DOJ that isn't much affected day to day by what politicians in DC argue about. I understand entirely if someone decides that they don't want to work under that administration and so turns down/quits from a DOJ job, but I don't think the vast majority of line attorneys and bureaucrats are going to get purged. It's actually pretty hard to fire non-political appointees and most people aren't political employees. (DOJ is really big.) Again, if your work turns into stuff you can't get behind and you quit that's one thing. I just think purge isn't really the right word.

(Or what star fox said, but wordier.)



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