DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle: Application Status Tracker in the OP - Please update!

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DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle: Application Status Tracker in the OP - Please update!

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 25, 2016 7:58 pm

Its time.

Last year's thread: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=252389&hilit=Honors+2015

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

1. Generate a single User ID on Sheet 1. Include whatever background/personal information you feel comfortable with.

2. Using the same User ID you created on Sheet 1, complete the information on Sheet 2 for each different component you applied to.

This is helpful because different components are not necessarily on the same timeline.

Application tracking spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0

PLEASE INCLUDE YOUR INFO.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:27 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 25, 2016 9:52 pm

Tagging.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 25, 2016 11:30 pm

Actively lurking and taking notes for the '18 entry cycle since I'll be clerking next year. I'm assuming that Lord Emperor Trump won't dissolve DOJ on 01/20/2017, or freeze entry-level hiring, etc. Good luck, y'all!

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 25, 2016 11:46 pm

Is there any info on what type of stats are required for this? I know this is super competitive, but would be great to know what the ballpark is.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2016 12:06 am

Current DOJ Honors Attorney (2013 grad, 2015 honors attorney) lurking around and will answer what questions I can as they pop up.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2016 12:19 am

Checking in. Applied last year but withdrew before interview notices came out (accepted a clerkship offer). Looking at crim and any sections that does some criminal work (tax, ENRD).

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:06 am

Anonymous User wrote:Current DOJ Honors Attorney (2013 grad, 2015 honors attorney) lurking around and will answer what questions I can as they pop up.


I'm doing a non-federal clerkship prior to applying. Civil docket, trial heavy. Gunning for DOJ Civil Commercial or Federal Programs. General advice?

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby TransferHopeful17 » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:01 am

Anonymous User wrote:Current DOJ Honors Attorney (2013 grad, 2015 honors attorney) lurking around and will answer what questions I can as they pop up.


On a note related to the earlier question asked of you, how much of a bump do people get for clerking? And does this vary by component? I am really interested in clerking, particularly for the exposure to litigation, but I am also a little anxious to start practicing.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:07 am

Depending on the component, clerking is a pretty decent bump. I actually don't know any DOJ honors people who haven't clerked (I'm sure there are some as I don't know tons, but yeah, all the ones I know clerked).

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby deuceindc » Tue Jul 26, 2016 3:16 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Current DOJ Honors Attorney (2013 grad, 2015 honors attorney) lurking around and will answer what questions I can as they pop up.


If you don't mind, which division and component are you in? Did you clerk at the district level, appellate level, or a year at both?

Is it true that apps don't get seriously considered by a division unless the applicant has ranked them #1? I've heard that it's true for uber-competitive divisions like Civil Rights, but I'm curious whether it applies across the board. Also, if you know, how much does division-specific experience matter for Antitrust and Tax?

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 26, 2016 7:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Current DOJ Honors Attorney (2013 grad, 2015 honors attorney) lurking around and will answer what questions I can as they pop up.


I'm doing a non-federal clerkship prior to applying. Civil docket, trial heavy. Gunning for DOJ Civil Commercial or Federal Programs. General advice?


OP here. My understanding is that Fed Programs is one of the more competitive parts of CivDiv. Which isn't advice, really, but seems like information you might want. In terms of CommLit, be sure to do some solid research on what the different parts of that branch do. National Courts is worlds away from OFL. Be ready to talk about what parts of CommLit interest you, and why.

TransferHopeful17 wrote:On a note related to the earlier question asked of you, how much of a bump do people get for clerking? And does this vary by component? I am really interested in clerking, particularly for the exposure to litigation, but I am also a little anxious to start practicing.


As at least one of you all already noted, based on my graduation year and start date, I clerked prior to doing DOJ honors. In fact, a significant portion of the honors attorneys I've met clerked first. Clerkships can only ever help your application to the honors program, particularly federal clerkships. Some components require a clerkship - usually the USAOs do - while others just count them as a plus factor (like some of the "non-litigating" parts of DOJ).

As a side-note, since you seemed on the fence about it: if you have the opportunity to do a federal clerkship, unless you know you want to do transactional, I recommend doing it. I cannot imagine a job where I would have received better mentorship or could've learned as much as I did in such a short period of time.

deuceindc wrote:If you don't mind, which division and component are you in? Did you clerk at the district level, appellate level, or a year at both?

Is it true that apps don't get seriously considered by a division unless the applicant has ranked them #1? I've heard that it's true for uber-competitive divisions like Civil Rights, but I'm curious whether it applies across the board. Also, if you know, how much does division-specific experience matter for Antitrust and Tax?


So, I can't answer all of those questions about my stats without outing myself. That said, if you want, I can PM you with more specific info.

As to your ranking question, it really depends on the component. Some of the USAOs don't require that you rank them first. I hear that CrimDiv likes to be ranked first but, interestingly, AFMLS doesn't need either CrimDiv or AFMLS to be ranked first so long as you express genuine interest. I've heard, either first-hand from people with a say or through the government attorney grapevine, that CRT, App., Fed. Programs, and NSD prefer to be ranked first, too.

Tax definitely seems to prefer a demonstrated interest/experience in tax law. I am under the impression that ATR does, too, though I'm not sure how hard and fast that preference is.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby deuceindc » Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:16 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
So, I can't answer all of those questions about my stats without outing myself. That said, if you want, I can PM you with more specific info.


That'd be great, thanks!

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby TransferHopeful17 » Wed Jul 27, 2016 11:21 am

Anonymous User wrote:As a side-note, since you seemed on the fence about it: if you have the opportunity to do a federal clerkship, unless you know you want to do transactional, I recommend doing it. I cannot imagine a job where I would have received better mentorship or could've learned as much as I did in such a short period of time.


Thanks for taking the time to answer questions--much appreciated!

Do you think clerking with a magistrate judge would be similarly valuable? This is likely the more realistic scenario for me, and I would take most any opportunity if it meant I would come away from the experience with some valuable litigation experience/exposure.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jul 27, 2016 6:51 pm

TransferHopeful17 wrote:Do you think clerking with a magistrate judge would be similarly valuable? This is likely the more realistic scenario for me, and I would take most any opportunity if it meant I would come away from the experience with some valuable litigation experience/exposure.


OP here. It varies from magistrate judge to magistrate judge, and from district to district, but from a purely educational standpoint, there is plenty to learn from magistrate judges. In fact, the nuts and bolts of discovery - which really drives litigation - are best learned from magistrate judges. Beyond that, how much else you handle - summary judgments, criminal matters, etc. - depends on your magistrate judge. In terms of outcomes, it varies wildly. I've seen people parlay it into difficult to get positions (including some at DOJ) and others take that knowledge with them to small law.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby TransferHopeful17 » Thu Jul 28, 2016 11:13 am

Thanks, very helpful info and confirmed what I suspected. Sounds like a good opportunity to learn, at the very least.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Jul 28, 2016 11:27 am

I am a 2014 law school grad and a 2015 honors hire into civil div, commercial litigation branch. I'll lurk this thread in case I can weigh in on some people's questions.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby DOJapplicant » Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:32 am

DOJ attorneys, thank you for providing some insights into this application process. I am curious if you, or anyone else on this thread, can provide any guidance for an application to the Criminal Division. Specifically, is it more difficult to land a "Regular Trial Attorney" position or a spot within the "Asset Forfeiture Program"? And related to that, is it possible to be considered for both positions in your application? Thanks!

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:46 am

DOJapplicant wrote:DOJ attorneys, thank you for providing some insights into this application process. I am curious if you, or anyone else on this thread, can provide any guidance for an application to the Criminal Division. Specifically, is it more difficult to land a "Regular Trial Attorney" position or a spot within the "Asset Forfeiture Program"? And related to that, is it possible to be considered for both positions in your application? Thanks!

You will apply to the Criminal Division as one of your three components, and then I believe you would likely rank the trial attorney and asset forfeiture positions, so would be considered for both (I didn't apply to crim, but that's how it works for other components that list openings in different divisions - hopefully someone else can confirm for crim). And it is likely to be somewhat easier to get an asset forfeiture spot, since it's not a permanent position, and also, frankly, asset forfeiture is often seen as a more administrative-y thing to do. (No disrespect for asset forfeiture people who have tons of skills I don't, but I don't think it's seen the same as being a trial attorney.)

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:48 am

Anonymous User wrote:I am a 2014 law school grad and a 2015 honors hire into civil div, commercial litigation branch. I'll lurk this thread in case I can weigh in on some people's questions.


That's what I'm interested in doing primarily. What are your top tips on applying, other than look good on paper?

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jul 29, 2016 11:01 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I am a 2014 law school grad and a 2015 honors hire into civil div, commercial litigation branch. I'll lurk this thread in case I can weigh in on some people's questions.


That's what I'm interested in doing primarily. What are your top tips on applying, other than look good on paper?

Besides the obvious, I think you need to take special care to articulate (1) why you are pursuing public service through DOJ, and (2) why you are interested in the commercial lit side of DOJ in particular. Also, depending on how competitive your application in, realize that your rankings can signal whether a certain component is likely to be turned down in favor of one of your higher choices. It's possible to get multiple offers, but the components definitely consider your rankings in considering yield rate and whether to extend an offer that is likely to be turned down.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:34 pm

DOJapplicant wrote:DOJ attorneys, thank you for providing some insights into this application process. I am curious if you, or anyone else on this thread, can provide any guidance for an application to the Criminal Division. Specifically, is it more difficult to land a "Regular Trial Attorney" position or a spot within the "Asset Forfeiture Program"? And related to that, is it possible to be considered for both positions in your application? Thanks!


You can apply for both. You'll rank CrimDiv as one of your top three components, and then you'll rank Trial Attorney and AFMLS within that component. I can't speak to which is more difficult to land with any certainty, but I strongly suspect based on personal anecdotes that it's the trial attorney slots, just because more people apply for it.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:53 pm

Checking in. Gonna be on a bar trip for almost the entire application period so it should be interesting.

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 30, 2016 12:07 pm

I'm very interested in the Criminal Division. Is it as competitive as Civil and Civil Rights, or less so? Which Criminal sections are considered most competitive/prestigious?

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 01, 2016 9:39 pm

For ATR, does anyone know what the allocation of the DC slots (17) is to civil versus criminal litigating sections?

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Re: DOJ Honors 2016-2017 Cycle

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 01, 2016 11:58 pm

Any insight on the US Trustee component?




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