UChicago OCI 2016

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Jul 21, 2016 11:24 pm

It's about the firm, not the market for me.

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Eldon Tyrell

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Eldon Tyrell » Thu Jul 21, 2016 11:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:It's about the firm, not the market for me.


Lol. I'm gonna guess you already know spreading your bids between five markets is a very risky and ill advised strategy. So what are the things you want to hear from us? Your grades are pretty good, but not good enough to do something like this. Did you grade on to law review?

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby bill_swerski » Thu Jul 21, 2016 11:40 pm

Anonymous User wrote:It's about the firm, not the market for me.


Care to elaborate on this?

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Jul 21, 2016 11:58 pm

I am focusing on firms with certain practice areas I hope to work in.

Would reducing to 3 markets be less risky? There's really only 2 markets really at play in my bid list. I don't plan on letting every firm know I am interviewing in 3 markets.

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Eldon Tyrell

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Eldon Tyrell » Fri Jul 22, 2016 12:00 am

Anonymous User wrote:I am focusing on firms with certain practice areas I hope to work in.

Would reducing to 3 markets be less risky? There's really only 2 markets really at play in my bid list. I don't plan on letting every firm know I am interviewing in 3 markets.


Uh, what?

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby bill_swerski » Fri Jul 22, 2016 12:23 am

While it is good to focus on firms with practice areas that you are interested in, I think bidding more than 3 markets is a bit much (and I'd say going beyond 2 is risky). The reality is that you can only work at one firm at a time. That being said, you should figure out which market has the most firms that fit your practice area interests and bid there. Your grades are good enough that almost every firm is in play. Also, I wouldn't plan on bidding multiple markets and then not being upfront with interviewers about it.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby landshoes » Fri Jul 22, 2016 2:27 am

Eldon Tyrell wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I am focusing on firms with certain practice areas I hope to work in.

Would reducing to 3 markets be less risky? There's really only 2 markets really at play in my bid list. I don't plan on letting every firm know I am interviewing in 3 markets.


Uh, what?


If you are going to help, can you try to help without this kind of stuff? We are new at this, just like you were last year.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby 2014 » Fri Jul 22, 2016 9:39 am

3 markets is feasible it just depends what 3. You could probably do Cali, Texas, Chi/NY for example and certainly could do any 3 markets that doesn't include Chi/NY. Whether that's well advised is a different question but it may make sense for some.

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Eldon Tyrell

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Eldon Tyrell » Fri Jul 22, 2016 10:20 am

landshoes wrote:
Eldon Tyrell wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I am focusing on firms with certain practice areas I hope to work in.

Would reducing to 3 markets be less risky? There's really only 2 markets really at play in my bid list. I don't plan on letting every firm know I am interviewing in 3 markets.


Uh, what?


If you are going to help, can you try to help without this kind of stuff? We are new at this, just like you were last year.


Nope. I've been way too nice to you people so far. And I didn't do OCI last year.

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landshoes

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby landshoes » Fri Jul 22, 2016 11:15 am

Eldon Tyrell wrote:
landshoes wrote:
Eldon Tyrell wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I am focusing on firms with certain practice areas I hope to work in.

Would reducing to 3 markets be less risky? There's really only 2 markets really at play in my bid list. I don't plan on letting every firm know I am interviewing in 3 markets.


Uh, what?


If you are going to help, can you try to help without this kind of stuff? We are new at this, just like you were last year.


Nope. I've been way too nice to you people so far. And I didn't do OCI last year.


... well, I guess that I am sorry that you won't be with us anymore. I am sure you will be missed.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby bill_swerski » Fri Jul 22, 2016 1:26 pm

Play nice folks.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby WheninLaw » Fri Jul 22, 2016 1:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Grades: ~179.5
URM/Female: No
Work Exp: 3+ years
Preferred Market: DC/Chicago/NYC
Practice Area: Lit

Number Firm Office (if specified)
1 Kirkland Chicago
2 Covington DC
3 WilmerHale DC
4 Sidley Chicago
5 Jenner & Block Chicago
6 Boies Schiller DC
7 Latham Chicago
8 Skadden Chicago
9 Mayer Brown Chicago
10 Ropes and Gray Chicago
11 Cravath NYC
12 Clearly Gottlieb DC
13 Williams and Connolly DC
14 Sullivan Cromwell NYC
15 Davis Polk NYC
16 Arnold and Porter DC
17 Gibson Dunn DC
18 O'Melveny LA
19 Irell Manella LA
20 Paul Hastings Chicago
21 Susman Godfrey Houston
22 Winston Strawn Chicago
23 Simpson Thatcher NYC
24 Munger Tolls LA
25 Crowell Moring DC
26 Steptoe Johnson DC
27 Morrison Foster LA
28 K & L Gates Chicago
29 Greenberg Traurig Chicago
30 Wachtell NYC
31 Debevoise NYC
32 Barack Ferrazzano Kirschbaum & Nagelberg LLP Chicago
33 Fenwick & West SF
34 Baker McKenzie Chicago
35 McDermott Chicago
36 Katten Muchin Chicago
37 DLA Piper Chicago
38 Schiff Hardin Chicago
39 Dentons Chicago
40 Foley and Lardner Chicago


I'm less militant than most about doing infinite markets, but you need the stats to back it up. If you didn't make LR, I would probably pair this down. Also, this list does not indicate you are focusing on a specific practice group, at all.

Immediate thoughts: You don't have the grades for most of the DC firms. Susman isn't happening unless you're from Houston. Barack Ferrazzano likely not happening. Wachtell and Munger not happening. Tons of these firms (Schiff, MOFO, etc) need to be moved up.

This is a very dangerous bidlist. I would heavily revise.

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Eldon Tyrell

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Eldon Tyrell » Fri Jul 22, 2016 1:57 pm

Yeah I guess I should have made more clear that I don't think every single person should do two and only two markets. But the multiple markets plus the crazy preftige firms is pretty high risk.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby WheninLaw » Fri Jul 22, 2016 3:19 pm

Eldon Tyrell wrote:Yeah I guess I should have made more clear that I don't think every single person should do two and only two markets. But the multiple markets plus the crazy preftige firms is pretty high risk.


Yeah, I think the "specific practice area" the poster was going for is "prestigious litigation." Maybe white collar. That's something you go for with a 181, not a 179.5.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby bill_swerski » Fri Jul 22, 2016 3:48 pm

Pardon my NY-centrism but a 179.5 should be able to get into at least one of the big law firms in NY with sterling litigation practices. But yeah DC is going to be a stretch considering how grade conscious they are (and Chicago is a tough market as well, considering that many 180+ students gun for that)

You should honestly figure out where you want to live/practice and then go from there. But applying all over the country to every good litigation firm is going to backfire, given that firms (for whatever reason) actually care about law students committing to a market.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Eldon Tyrell » Fri Jul 22, 2016 4:01 pm

Without divulging any confidences, we spoke over PM and I think anon has a better idea of how to structure his bid list and target markets. Hopefully he (assuming he?) comes back with a revision. But a 179.5 is still a damn good spot to be in.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 23, 2016 3:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Grades: ~179.5
URM/Female: No
Work Exp: 3+ years
Preferred Market: DC/Chicago/NYC
Practice Area: Lit

Number Firm Office (if specified)
1 Kirkland Chicago
2 Covington DC
3 WilmerHale DC
4 Sidley Chicago
5 Jenner & Block Chicago
6 Boies Schiller DC
7 Latham Chicago
8 Skadden Chicago
9 Mayer Brown Chicago
10 Ropes and Gray Chicago
11 Cravath NYC
12 Clearly Gottlieb DC
13 Williams and Connolly DC
14 Sullivan Cromwell NYC
15 Davis Polk NYC
16 Arnold and Porter DC
17 Gibson Dunn DC
18 O'Melveny LA
19 Irell Manella LA
20 Paul Hastings Chicago
21 Susman Godfrey Houston
22 Winston Strawn Chicago
23 Simpson Thatcher NYC
24 Munger Tolls LA
25 Crowell Moring DC
26 Steptoe Johnson DC
27 Morrison Foster LA
28 K & L Gates Chicago
29 Greenberg Traurig Chicago
30 Wachtell NYC
31 Debevoise NYC
32 Barack Ferrazzano Kirschbaum & Nagelberg LLP Chicago
33 Fenwick & West SF
34 Baker McKenzie Chicago
35 McDermott Chicago
36 Katten Muchin Chicago
37 DLA Piper Chicago
38 Schiff Hardin Chicago
39 Dentons Chicago
40 Foley and Lardner Chicago


Thanks for the help everyone. Narrowed it down to DC/Chicago, with less than 5 bids on other cities. More safeties.

1 Kirkland Chicago
2 Covington DC
3 Sidley Chicago
4 Jenner & Block Chicago
5 Boies Schiller DC
6 Williams and Connolly DC
7 WilmerHale DC
8 Ropes and Gray DC
9 Skadden Chicago
10 Mayer Brown Chicago
11 Clearly Gottlieb DC
12 Arnold and Porter DC
13 Gibson Dunn DC
14 Jones Day Chicago
15 O'Melveny DC
16 Latham DC
17 McDermott Chicago
18 Paul Hastings DC
19 Susman Godfrey Houston
20 Simpson Thatcher DC
21 Winston Strawn Chicago
22 Crowell Moring DC
23 Steptoe Johnson DC
24 K & L Gates Chicago
25 Greenberg Traurig Chicago
26 Barack Ferrazzano Kirschbaum & Nagelberg LLP Chicago
27 Baker McKenzie Chicago
28 McDermott Chicago
29 Katten Muchin Chicago
30 DLA Piper Chicago
31 Schiff Hardin Chicago
32 Dentons Chicago
33 Foley and Lardner Chicago
34 Irell Manella LA
35 Munger Tolls LA
36 Morrison Foster LA
37 Allen & Overy DC
38 Harris Wiltshire & Grannis DC
39 White & Case DC
40 Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft LLP DC
41 Perkins Coie DC
42 Husch Blackwell LLP Chicago
43 King & Spalding LLP DC
44 Pillsbury Winthrop Shaw Pittman LLP DC
45 Cooley LLP DC
46 Fried Frank DC
47 Baker Botts DC
48 Wilson Sonsini DC

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby bill_swerski » Sat Jul 23, 2016 5:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Grades: ~179.5
URM/Female: No
Work Exp: 3+ years
Preferred Market: DC/Chicago/NYC
Practice Area: Lit

Number Firm Office (if specified)
1 Kirkland Chicago
2 Covington DC
3 WilmerHale DC
4 Sidley Chicago
5 Jenner & Block Chicago
6 Boies Schiller DC
7 Latham Chicago
8 Skadden Chicago
9 Mayer Brown Chicago
10 Ropes and Gray Chicago
11 Cravath NYC
12 Clearly Gottlieb DC
13 Williams and Connolly DC
14 Sullivan Cromwell NYC
15 Davis Polk NYC
16 Arnold and Porter DC
17 Gibson Dunn DC
18 O'Melveny LA
19 Irell Manella LA
20 Paul Hastings Chicago
21 Susman Godfrey Houston
22 Winston Strawn Chicago
23 Simpson Thatcher NYC
24 Munger Tolls LA
25 Crowell Moring DC
26 Steptoe Johnson DC
27 Morrison Foster LA
28 K & L Gates Chicago
29 Greenberg Traurig Chicago
30 Wachtell NYC
31 Debevoise NYC
32 Barack Ferrazzano Kirschbaum & Nagelberg LLP Chicago
33 Fenwick & West SF
34 Baker McKenzie Chicago
35 McDermott Chicago
36 Katten Muchin Chicago
37 DLA Piper Chicago
38 Schiff Hardin Chicago
39 Dentons Chicago
40 Foley and Lardner Chicago


Thanks for the help everyone. Narrowed it down to DC/Chicago, with less than 5 bids on other cities. More safeties.

1 Kirkland Chicago
2 Covington DC
3 Sidley Chicago
4 Jenner & Block Chicago
5 Boies Schiller DC
6 Williams and Connolly DC
7 WilmerHale DC
8 Ropes and Gray DC
9 Skadden Chicago
10 Mayer Brown Chicago
11 Clearly Gottlieb DC
12 Arnold and Porter DC
13 Gibson Dunn DC
14 Jones Day Chicago
15 O'Melveny DC
16 Latham DC
17 McDermott Chicago
18 Paul Hastings DC
19 Susman Godfrey Houston
20 Simpson Thatcher DC
21 Winston Strawn Chicago
22 Crowell Moring DC
23 Steptoe Johnson DC
24 K & L Gates Chicago
25 Greenberg Traurig Chicago
26 Barack Ferrazzano Kirschbaum & Nagelberg LLP Chicago
27 Baker McKenzie Chicago
28 McDermott Chicago
29 Katten Muchin Chicago
30 DLA Piper Chicago
31 Schiff Hardin Chicago
32 Dentons Chicago
33 Foley and Lardner Chicago
34 Irell Manella LA
35 Munger Tolls LA
36 Morrison Foster LA
37 Allen & Overy DC
38 Harris Wiltshire & Grannis DC
39 White & Case DC
40 Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft LLP DC
41 Perkins Coie DC
42 Husch Blackwell LLP Chicago
43 King & Spalding LLP DC
44 Pillsbury Winthrop Shaw Pittman LLP DC
45 Cooley LLP DC
46 Fried Frank DC
47 Baker Botts DC
48 Wilson Sonsini DC


I still think it might be risky since you technically are bidding 5 markets but that is really up to you. Generally I think you are fine though with getting something in at least Chicago with a 179.5 (assuming ok interviewing and ties/reason to work in Chicago).

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Eldon Tyrell

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Eldon Tyrell » Sat Jul 23, 2016 5:43 pm

That's still a very high risk bid list. You're not going to get any Chicago firms after number 10. So you're essentially backing up DC and the ridiculously selective firms people have already told you not to bid with four or five of the most competitive Chicago firms.

This is a recipe for very few callbacks and very few offers. I wouldn't do this if those were my grades. But I guess only you can evaluate how much a super preftigious firm is worth to you when weighed against the much much better chance of getting offers at less preftigious firms. You're sacrificing the latter for the former too much IMO right now. You should be crushing it in at least Chicago but interviewing with only four or five firms gets you into statistically small sample variations I wouldn't want to fuck with.

Luckily U Chicago is amazing with firm placement. You might still be totally fine if you're a really good interviewer and resume snow angel.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 23, 2016 6:17 pm

Anon at 179.5 might also want to seriously evaluate her or his interviewing skills. If she or he knows beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are a phenomenal interviewer (and you simply cannot know this without concrete evidence or professional interview feedback), this looks less scary (just less, mind you) than if OP is uncertain. I did a LOT of pre-OCI interviewing and received a number of offers sitting just under 179, and I can say that if grades are the Queen or King of spades that get you in the door, interviewing skills are the Ace or Deuce that either clinches it or shuts you out. I have no business having the offers I have with my grades.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby bill_swerski » Sat Jul 23, 2016 8:21 pm

Yeah I think generally people underestimate just how crucial interviewing skills are.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 24, 2016 2:02 am

Grades: 177.6 (No LR or journal)
URM/Female: No
Work Exp: 1 year
Preferred Market: Chicago/NYC
Practice Area: Corporate/Transactional

1. Baker & McKenzie Chicago
2. Sidley Austin Chicago
3. Kirkland & Ellis Chicago
4. Latham Chicago
5. Jones Day Chicago
6. Skadden New York
7. Skadden Chicago
8. Sullivan Cromwell New York
9. Davis Polk New York
10. Simpson Thacher New York
11. Ropes & Gray Chicago
12. Debevoise & Plimpton New York
13. Mayer Brown Chicago
14. Cleary New York
15. Paul Weiss New York
16. Winston & Strawn Chicago
17. McDermott Chicago
18. Cooley New York
19. Schiff Hardin Chicago
20. Katten Muchin Chicago
21. White & Case New York
22. Vedder Price Chicago
23. Perkins Coie Chicago
24. Mofo New York
25. K&L Gates Chicago
26. DLA Piper Chicago
...

Mainly focusing on Chicago and NYC. Given my lower GPA, is it even worth it bidding on firms like Sullcrom, Davis Polk, or Skadden?

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby bearsfan23 » Sun Jul 24, 2016 4:04 am

Anonymous User wrote:Grades: 177.6 (No LR or journal)
URM/Female: No
Work Exp: 1 year
Preferred Market: Chicago/NYC
Practice Area: Corporate/Transactional

1. Baker & McKenzie Chicago
2. Sidley Austin Chicago
3. Kirkland & Ellis Chicago
4. Latham Chicago
5. Jones Day Chicago
6. Skadden New York
7. Skadden Chicago
8. Sullivan Cromwell New York
9. Davis Polk New York
10. Simpson Thacher New York
11. Ropes & Gray Chicago
12. Debevoise & Plimpton New York
13. Mayer Brown Chicago
14. Cleary New York
15. Paul Weiss New York
16. Winston & Strawn Chicago
17. McDermott Chicago
18. Cooley New York
19. Schiff Hardin Chicago
20. Katten Muchin Chicago
21. White & Case New York
22. Vedder Price Chicago
23. Perkins Coie Chicago
24. Mofo New York
25. K&L Gates Chicago
26. DLA Piper Chicago
...

Mainly focusing on Chicago and NYC. Given my lower GPA, is it even worth it bidding on firms like Sullcrom, Davis Polk, or Skadden?


IMO I'd drop Sullcrom and replace them with White & Case. Not sure about Skadden, but I'd keep Davis Polk (they usually will hire down to median). I'd also flip Winston & Katten with Ropes & Mayer Brown (Winston & Katten are good target firms for your GPA you don't want to miss out on). Lastly, consider adding Shearman NYC somewhere in your top 15 (perhaps replace Debevoise)

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Eldon Tyrell

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby Eldon Tyrell » Sun Jul 24, 2016 11:04 am

Definitely add Shearman; definitely move up Katten. Move McDermott way up. They have a good transactional practice and it's way more getable for you than Kirkland or Sidley. Those are frankly long shots. I think you have a better shot at the NYC V10 than S/K&E/maybe Latham.

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Re: UChicago OCI 2016

Postby pennepacker » Sun Jul 24, 2016 12:23 pm

Grades: ~179.5
URM/Female: No
Work exp: 3 yrs.
Preferred market: CHI >>> MPLS
Practice area: lit

First parentheses = # of slots at OCI; second = GPA 25/75th. All offices are Chicago unless otherwise noted. Thanks for any and all feedback; specifically wondering if I am missing any solid lit firms, as well as other firms I could bid low but maybe still snag a spot.

1. Perkins Coie (34) (176-178)
2. Jenner (63) (178-180)
3. Sidley (84) (178-180)
4. Kirkland (84) (178-180)
5. Jones day (42) (177-179)
6. Mayer brown (73) (178-179.75)
7. Ropes and Gray (10) (178-180)
8. Katten (42) (176-179)
9. Latham (69) (178-180)
10. Winston (63) (177-179)
11. McDermott (63) (178-179)
12. Skadden (84) (178-180)
13. Paul Hastings (21) (177.7-179.4)
14. Barack Ferrazzano (32) (179.725-180.81)
15. Baker McKenzie (31) (173-176)
16. Foley (21) (177-179)
17. McGuireWoods (21) (177)
18. Dorsey (MN)
19. Faegre (MN)
20. Fredrikson (MN)
21. Lindquist (MN)
22. Maslon (MN)
23. Suggestions for other bids?



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