2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

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screwtapeletters
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2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby screwtapeletters » Sat Jun 27, 2015 8:32 pm

Well-established connections in the target market,
Niche-focused (not IP), resume tailored accordingly,
Multilingual,
Recently "converted" my greencard into US citizenship.

But a 2.9x.... I seriously thought about dropping out. I'm assuming this puts me around bottom 10-30%.

Working right now at a place that deals with the field I want to go into.

I know even with the connections that I'll most likely strikeout at OCI.

Just wanted to know what TLS thinks. I'm taking relatively easy-A classes next semester to boost the shitty gpa up.

Asian-American male.

Graduating with about 90k in debt (scholarship + family support)
Last edited by screwtapeletters on Wed Nov 30, 2016 1:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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chuckbass
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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby chuckbass » Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:08 pm

Well, are you biglaw or bust?

You can always go through OCI and drop out if you strike out, and get most of the tuition back.

Otherwise if not, you're not graduating with a lot of debt, so if you'd still like to be a lawyer I'd stick with it.

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ManoftheHour
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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby ManoftheHour » Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:47 pm

screwtapeletters wrote:Just wanted to know what TLS thinks. I'm taking relatively easy-A classes next semester to boost the shitty gpa up.

Not to highjack the thread or anything, but does anyone know if getting a higher GPA through 2 and 3L year actually matter? I only ask because I know a guy one year up from me with the exact same 1L rank (and even the exact same 1L job) who moved into the top 10% after just one semester in 2L year. Was wondering if that actually matters. My 1st semester 2L courses are stacked with easy A courses.

Anyway, if you aren't Biglaw or bust and you really want to be a lawyer, I'd say stay.

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chuckbass
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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby chuckbass » Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:48 pm

ManoftheHour wrote:
screwtapeletters wrote:Just wanted to know what TLS thinks. I'm taking relatively easy-A classes next semester to boost the shitty gpa up.

Not to highjack the thread or anything, but does anyone know if getting a higher GPA through 2 and 3L year actually matter? I only ask because I know a guy one year up from me with the exact same 1L rank (and even the exact same 1L job) who moved into the top 10% after just one semester in 2L year. Was wondering if that actually matters. My 1st semester 2L courses are stacked with easy A courses.

Anyway, if you aren't Biglaw or bust and you really want to be a lawyer, I'd say stay.

I mean, it won't help if you don't get biglaw, but I'm sure it helps for other jobs in general to have a higher GPA, or in your case if you'd then be looking at clerkships. Also for OP, moving above a 3.0 will help certainly.

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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 29, 2015 12:45 am

It can be done. I know from personal experience. Non-urm here. I had a 2.1 my first semester, brought it up to a cumalative 2.5 my second semester, graduated with a 3.2 from a t20 school. I got a market-paying job for my 2L summer at 25-attorney firm. I went through 3L OCI and got a gig at 150-attorney firm with big-law salary (160k) after I graduated. Last year, I lateraled over as a second year to a V50 firm in another market. It's all about the hustle. It was a lot of work to get both gigs, but it makes you appreciate the opportunity even more.

For what it is worth, I took a greater gamble than you. I graduated with 135k debt and I had a 2.5 cum gpa after my 1L year. Fortunately it paid off. But only you know yourself and how risk averse you are.

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Kratos
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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby Kratos » Mon Jun 29, 2015 10:06 am

Anonymous User wrote:It can be done. I know from personal experience. Non-urm here. I had a 2.1 my first semester, brought it up to a cumalative 2.5 my second semester, graduated with a 3.2 from a t20 school. I got a market-paying job for my 2L summer at 25-attorney firm. I went through 3L OCI and got a gig at 150-attorney firm with big-law salary (160k) after I graduated. Last year, I lateraled over as a second year to a V50 firm in another market. It's all about the hustle. It was a lot of work to get both gigs, but it makes you appreciate the opportunity even more.

For what it is worth, I took a greater gamble than you. I graduated with 135k debt and I had a 2.5 cum gpa after my 1L year. Fortunately it paid off. But only you know yourself and how risk averse you are.

how'd you pull off the bolded?

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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 29, 2015 10:09 am

Just to add some more anecdotal evidence: I am a non-URM male and was median or a little below after my first year at a t20. Completely struck out at 2L OCI and ended up "summering" for a 25 lawyer firm in the same city as my LS (no expectation of permanent job offer). I had a very good 2L year grades-wise and managed to work my way into the top 15% (continued to get good grades my 3L year as well). Scored a clerkship during my 3L year (and ended up clerking for another year in a more prestigious jurisdiction). Ultimately ended up in the main office of a V10. Landing both the clerkships and the biglaw job required a lot of hustling. But working my way into the top of my class certainly helped to open some doors as well. Obviously helped that I was set on a practice area where clerking is considered a big plus.

timmyd
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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby timmyd » Mon Jun 29, 2015 10:37 am

To the above poster, may I ask, do you believe your big law gig was only possible because of the second clerkship? I ask because I am kind of a similar situation. Top 6% at a TTT, top 10-15% at UT. Federal clerkship for next year in a district thats not my target market. Have nothing lined up for after the clerkship.

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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 29, 2015 11:38 am

Kratos wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:It can be done. I know from personal experience. Non-urm here. I had a 2.1 my first semester, brought it up to a cumalative 2.5 my second semester, graduated with a 3.2 from a t20 school. I got a market-paying job for my 2L summer at 25-attorney firm. I went through 3L OCI and got a gig at 150-attorney firm with big-law salary (160k) after I graduated. Last year, I lateraled over as a second year to a V50 firm in another market. It's all about the hustle. It was a lot of work to get both gigs, but it makes you appreciate the opportunity even more.

For what it is worth, I took a greater gamble than you. I graduated with 135k debt and I had a 2.5 cum gpa after my 1L year. Fortunately it paid off. But only you know yourself and how risk averse you are.

how'd you pull off the bolded?


2L OCI. I forgot to mention that I had a 1L gig (20-attorney firm) that I got before grades came out. So that likely helped get the 2L gig.

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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 29, 2015 12:12 pm

Wow, great job on the hustle guys, it's quite inspiring.

I received a really bad grade in one of my classes 1L year. How did you guys address bad grades when going through interviewing?

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Re: 2.9x at BC/BU/Fordham/ND

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 29, 2015 2:23 pm

timmyd wrote:To the above poster, may I ask, do you believe your big law gig was only possible because of the second clerkship? I ask because I am kind of a similar situation. Top 6% at a TTT, top 10-15% at UT. Federal clerkship for next year in a district thats not my target market. Have nothing lined up for after the clerkship.


I'm the "above poster." It's hard to say. I had my second clerkship lined up before I even started my first clerkship, so I never tried to get a job with just my first clerkship as my main selling point. My second clerkship definitely helped as it was in a much better jurisdiction for the type of work that I do (essentially the premier jurisdiction for that type of work). I maybe could have gotten biglaw with just my first clerkship but definitely not with as good a firm. My second clerkship basically made it a slam dunk.


Anonymous User wrote:Wow, great job on the hustle guys, it's quite inspiring.

I received a really bad grade in one of my classes 1L year. How did you guys address bad grades when going through interviewing?


Well getting some really good grades in highly relevant classes helped as an initial matter. So the best thing you can do is, of course, get good other grades and let your transcript do the talking for you.

If I wasn't asked about my grades I didn't say a word about my average 1L grades (which is the same as bad grades at a t20). You should not either. There is absolutely nothing to be gained by an unprompted discussion of some negative aspect of your application packet in your interview. I get the urge to try to "explain," but if you're not asked just don't say anything. Firms get that 1L's just slip up sometimes and if they don't ask they probably like your other grades and think that no explanation is necessary.

If I was asked I just owned it and answered succinctly and honestly. I usually said something to the effect that I was not initially fully prepared for the rigor of law school and the time commitment required of a successful law student. I would then say that I have since matured, gained some perspective, and made adjustments in order to be successful--as is demonstrated by the significant increase in my grades. I would then talk about how I also got to choose my own classes for my 2L year and really enjoyed X class, which is also perhaps why I did so well. This can then segue into a discussion on that class/practice area to get you off the topic of shitty 1L grades. You explanation should be short and not sound like an excuse. Most of the time, bad 1L grades are caused by a lack of maturity. Just briefly own up to it (artfully, of course, as I did above) and move the conversation along. Interviewers will not be impressed by your sob story about how you were sick or had a bad day, etc. Just my experience/two cents.




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