Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

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Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun May 03, 2015 1:49 pm

I currently work as a first year at a Texas based firm (think something along the lines of Kelly Hart, Winstead, Munsch Hardt, Carrington Coleman, Gardere, Strasburger) in a transactional practice group. I have the opportunity to interview with a NY based V20 in the same city. How would this look to future employers if I were to switch firms while in my first year? The deals, clients, and work would be significantly more sophisticated and would also come with a decent pay bump. Any thoughts are appreciated.

BeenDidThat
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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby BeenDidThat » Sun May 03, 2015 2:09 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I currently work as a first year at a Texas based firm (think something along the lines of Kelly Hart, Winstead, Munsch Hardt, Carrington Coleman, Gardere, Strasburger) in a transactional practice group. I have the opportunity to interview with a NY based V20 in the same city. How would this look to future employers if I were to switch firms while in my first year? The deals, clients, and work would be significantly more sophisticated and would also come with a decent pay bump. Any thoughts are appreciated.


Jumping early can be a red flag, but probably wouldn't be in this circumstance because there's an obvious (and good) explanation: it's a job with a more highly respected firm.


That said, "sophistication" of the deals shouldn't be your only consideration. It would blow to transfer out from a place where you make good money and are treated well only to find out you've signed up to work under a workaholic screamer.

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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun May 03, 2015 2:16 pm

Op here:

That's definitely a consideration and I would try to evaluate that as much as I can prior to accepting an offer if I were to receive one. My particular group has some issues that give me cause for concern that I won't delve into. I am generally happy there, but I feel like this could be an excellent opportunity for my career.

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kalvano
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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby kalvano » Sun May 03, 2015 7:09 pm

I had the same general question - switching firms in the first year. My situation was a bit different, but I talked to my supervising partner at the firm I was currently working at, and he told me, essentially, that I should take the opportunity and that if he were to see it on a resume, it would be totally understandable.

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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon May 04, 2015 3:46 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I currently work as a first year at a Texas based firm (think something along the lines of Kelly Hart, Winstead, Munsch Hardt, Carrington Coleman, Gardere, Strasburger) in a transactional practice group. I have the opportunity to interview with a NY based V20 in the same city. How would this look to future employers if I were to switch firms while in my first year? The deals, clients, and work would be significantly more sophisticated and would also come with a decent pay bump. Any thoughts are appreciated.

Figuring you're in Dallas based on the listed firms--and it certainly dertainly depends on the destination firm/practice group. If it's Weil's PEMA group in Dallas, they do great work but all I've heard is that it sucks to work there. I do know they have been doing lots of recruiting since a chunk of folks went to Sidley.

It's definitely a big (and justifiable/explainable) step-up (and one I would do if I were in your shoes), but I would recommend finding an associate that may be an alumni of your school (or one you can relate to) and see if they'll shoot straight with you before you make a decision. If you're talking about a different V20 firm (like GDC or Sidley or JD, or some of the Houston V20), the analysis is still the same, but the reputations vary on QOL, and certainly depends on how you "fit" at the firm.

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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon May 04, 2015 9:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I currently work as a first year at a Texas based firm (think something along the lines of Kelly Hart, Winstead, Munsch Hardt, Carrington Coleman, Gardere, Strasburger) in a transactional practice group. I have the opportunity to interview with a NY based V20 in the same city. How would this look to future employers if I were to switch firms while in my first year? The deals, clients, and work would be significantly more sophisticated and would also come with a decent pay bump. Any thoughts are appreciated.

Figuring you're in Dallas based on the listed firms--and it certainly dertainly depends on the destination firm/practice group. If it's Weil's PEMA group in Dallas, they do great work but all I've heard is that it sucks to work there. I do know they have been doing lots of recruiting since a chunk of folks went to Sidley.

It's definitely a big (and justifiable/explainable) step-up (and one I would do if I were in your shoes), but I would recommend finding an associate that may be an alumni of your school (or one you can relate to) and see if they'll shoot straight with you before you make a decision. If you're talking about a different V20 firm (like GDC or Sidley or JD, or some of the Houston V20), the analysis is still the same, but the reputations vary on QOL, and certainly depends on how you "fit" at the firm.


What specifically have you heard about Weil's PEMA group? I'll be summering there this year and would like to know what I'm in for hah.

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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon May 04, 2015 9:41 pm

Making a switch after just a year or two is fine, so long as it doesn't become a pattern. Many people need an early course-correction, for some reason or other. And its fine to seek that out, and it wouldn't be held against you. You just want to make sure that wherever you shift to is a place you are comfortable sticking with for a few years (i.e. you can't go and flip after another 1 or 2 years). That way, when you do look for another position a few years down the road, the employer knows that your early quick switch was extenuating and a one-time thing.

A common example is where a big firm pidgeon-holes you into an area you don't want to be in, or where you are truly not getting more substantive experience as time goes on (even by biglaw standards). No one would fault you for leaving early to break into the practice group you truly desire or for seeking out a real step up in responsibility and experience.

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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon May 04, 2015 11:00 pm

It's fine to make the switch, but as others have said, make sure to scope out the firm as much as possible beforehand. I've heard bad things about JD Dallas and Weil.

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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue May 05, 2015 9:51 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I currently work as a first year at a Texas based firm (think something along the lines of Kelly Hart, Winstead, Munsch Hardt, Carrington Coleman, Gardere, Strasburger) in a transactional practice group. I have the opportunity to interview with a NY based V20 in the same city. How would this look to future employers if I were to switch firms while in my first year? The deals, clients, and work would be significantly more sophisticated and would also come with a decent pay bump. Any thoughts are appreciated.

Figuring you're in Dallas based on the listed firms--and it certainly dertainly depends on the destination firm/practice group. If it's Weil's PEMA group in Dallas, they do great work but all I've heard is that it sucks to work there. I do know they have been doing lots of recruiting since a chunk of folks went to Sidley.

It's definitely a big (and justifiable/explainable) step-up (and one I would do if I were in your shoes), but I would recommend finding an associate that may be an alumni of your school (or one you can relate to) and see if they'll shoot straight with you before you make a decision. If you're talking about a different V20 firm (like GDC or Sidley or JD, or some of the Houston V20), the analysis is still the same, but the reputations vary on QOL, and certainly depends on how you "fit" at the firm.


What specifically have you heard about Weil's PEMA group? I'll be summering there this year and would like to know what I'm in for hah.

Same quoted anon--just have some friends/acquaintances who work/have worked there, as well as some that were very excited to leave to Sidley. Heard they had a tough time filling some of those slots-- and were doing lots of recruiting of 3Ls. But some people certainly thrive there. A couple partners are real hard-asses and tough to work for, but every firm has a few of those.

Just find a cool associate who you can go to if you're in over your head on something during the summer. You'll be fine. They have good offer rates, and of the Dallas transactional firms, they do some of the most high-end work. If you go there, I'm sure you'll have good lateral options if you ever get tired of it.

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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue May 05, 2015 12:41 pm

I think some people may be underestimating the comp difference between OP's current firm and a firm with NY lockstep. Of course you want to look into the firm to try and find out if it's a good environment, but I would probably take the money and run. If you're there 3 years that's easily six figures more. I'm just a 3L though.

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Re: Regional Texas firm to V20 as a 1st year?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue May 05, 2015 1:50 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I think some people may be underestimating the comp difference between OP's current firm and a firm with NY lockstep. Of course you want to look into the firm to try and find out if it's a good environment, but I would probably take the money and run. If you're there 3 years that's easily six figures more. I'm just a 3L though.


Comp would be about 20k difference in first year plus larger bonus (2.5k to 5k compared to 15k). total compensation difference for three years would likely be 100k. And it goes up exponentially the longer I stay. Current firm associate comp would top out at about 185 plus 30k bonus.




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