SA Salary Question

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Anonymous User
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SA Salary Question

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:06 pm

Got some information about my SA program recently (V10). Pay is $6,666.67 paid semi-monthly. Program runs for 10 weeks, with first pay date on June 15th. Last day of the program is July 31st. Seems like pay would be about $27K for the summer, which is about $3K lower than I expected. What math am I doing wrong?

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DELG
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby DELG » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:09 pm

yeah shouldn't it be almost 31k for 10 weeks?

Anonymous User
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:11 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Got some information about my SA program recently (V10). Pay is $6,666.67 paid semi-monthly. Program runs for 10 weeks, with first pay date on June 15th. Last day of the program is July 31st. Seems like pay would be about $27K for the summer, which is about $3K lower than I expected. What math am I doing wrong?


June 15-June 27: 6,666,67
June 28-July 11: 6,666.67
July 12-July 25: 6,666.67
July 26-July 31 (August 1): 6666.67/2

Anonymous User
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:14 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Got some information about my SA program recently (V10). Pay is $6,666.67 paid semi-monthly. Program runs for 10 weeks, with first pay date on June 15th. Last day of the program is July 31st. Seems like pay would be about $27K for the summer, which is about $3K lower than I expected. What math am I doing wrong?


June 15-June 27: 6,666,67
June 28-July 11: 6,666.67
July 12-July 25: 6,666.67
July 26-July 31 (August 1): 6666.67/2


Should've made this clear in my first post, but the start date is May 26th. Program runs through July 31st, making 10 weeks, but it only seems like 4 paychecks of $6,666.67 each.

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rinkrat19
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby rinkrat19 » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Got some information about my SA program recently (V10). Pay is $6,666.67 paid semi-monthly. Program runs for 10 weeks, with first pay date on June 15th. Last day of the program is July 31st. Seems like pay would be about $27K for the summer, which is about $3K lower than I expected. What math am I doing wrong?


June 15-June 27: 6,666,67
June 28-July 11: 6,666.67
July 12-July 25: 6,666.67
July 26-July 31 (August 1): 6666.67/2


Should've made this clear in my first post, but the start date is May 26th. Program runs through July 31st, making 10 weeks, but it only seems like 4 paychecks of $6,666.67 each.
If it works like every workplace I've ever been in, you aren't accounting for the partial work week in May.
May 26-May 31 (4 days prorated pay = $2667)
June 1-June 15 ($6667)
June 16-June 30 ($6667)
July 1-July 15 ($6667)
July 16-July 31 ($6667)

Anonymous User
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:21 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Got some information about my SA program recently (V10). Pay is $6,666.67 paid semi-monthly. Program runs for 10 weeks, with first pay date on June 15th. Last day of the program is July 31st. Seems like pay would be about $27K for the summer, which is about $3K lower than I expected. What math am I doing wrong?


June 15-June 27: 6,666,67
June 28-July 11: 6,666.67
July 12-July 25: 6,666.67
July 26-July 31 (August 1): 6666.67/2


Should've made this clear in my first post, but the start date is May 26th. Program runs through July 31st, making 10 weeks, but it only seems like 4 paychecks of $6,666.67 each.
If it works like every workplace I've ever been in, you aren't accounting for the partial work week in May.
May 26-May 31 (4 days prorated pay = $2667)
June 1-June 15 ($6667)
June 16-June 30 ($6667)
July 1-July 15 ($6667)
July 16-July 31 ($6667)


Thanks for the help. So if I'm reading your post correctly, the partial work week in May will just be added in to another check?

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rinkrat19
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby rinkrat19 » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:If it works like every workplace I've ever been in, you aren't accounting for the partial work week in May.
May 26-May 31 (4 days prorated pay = $2667)
June 1-June 15 ($6667)
June 16-June 30 ($6667)
July 1-July 15 ($6667)
July 16-July 31 ($6667)


Thanks for the help. So if I'm reading your post correctly, the partial work week in May will just be added in to another check?

I imagine it depends on whether they slot you into their regular payroll schedule (in which case your first paycheck would probably be just the $2700 one, and you'd likely be getting paid for days worked on a half-month delay) or if they work something special out for the SAs (in which case I have no idea).

In any case, you're getting paid $30,000 to be completely useless and get taken out to lunch a lot. Recognize how lucky you are and spend less time worrying about the exact amounts of your paychecks.

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JohannDeMann
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby JohannDeMann » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:33 pm

youll get paid for one partial pay period in may, 2 pay periods in june and 2 in july. youre gonna receive 30.7k anyway you slice it. chill.

TTTooKewl
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby TTTooKewl » Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:11 pm

Don't see how OP will get 30.7k anyway he/she slices it. At least one way you slice it, he/she won't.

4 pay periods over June and July = $6667 x 4 = $26,668.

Add in prorate for May: 6/31 = 19.3%; .193 * $6667*2 = $2573. $26668 + $2573 = $29241

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UnfrozenCaveman
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby UnfrozenCaveman » Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:31 pm


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Yardbird
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby Yardbird » Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:23 pm

UnfrozenCaveman wrote:How many days in a week?
thanks for this, I needed a good laugh!

Winter is Coming
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby Winter is Coming » Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:32 pm

That's awesome.

TTTooKewl
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby TTTooKewl » Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:35 pm

I never said anything about going exactly 7 times, like I said, if I go every other day, that is 4 DAYS A WEEK. How hard is that to comprehend?

Week 1 - Sunday, Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday
Week 2 - Monday, Wednesday, Friday, Sunday.

8 DAYS IN 2 WEEKS
You double counted Sunday - that is 2 weeks plus 1 day.


Guy just schooled his classmates

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JohannDeMann
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby JohannDeMann » Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:40 pm

TTTooKewl wrote:Don't see how OP will get 30.7k anyway he/she slices it. At least one way you slice it, he/she won't.

4 pay periods over June and July = $6667 x 4 = $26,668.

Add in prorate for May: 6/31 = 19.3%; .193 * $6667*2 = $2573. $26668 + $2573 = $29241


your paycheck doesn't change month to month based on number of days. you are prorating in a really weird/arbitrary way here. 10/52 = x/160k; solve for X.

TTTooKewl
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby TTTooKewl » Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:50 pm

JohannDeMann wrote:
TTTooKewl wrote:Don't see how OP will get 30.7k anyway he/she slices it. At least one way you slice it, he/she won't.

4 pay periods over June and July = $6667 x 4 = $26,668.

Add in prorate for May: 6/31 = 19.3%; .193 * $6667*2 = $2573. $26668 + $2573 = $29241


your paycheck doesn't change month to month based on number of days. you are prorating in a really weird/arbitrary way here. 10/52 = x/160k; solve for X.


I admit I don't know how the firm would prorate. But it doesn't make sense to prorate by week. OP isn't being paid weekly or bi-weekly. OP is being paid by the month, with two pay checks per month. Unless what the firm means by "semi-monthly" is every two weeks -- in which case, OP would be making $6667 every 2 weeks, which would total more than 30.7k.

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AreJay711
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby AreJay711 » Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:02 pm

JohannDeMann wrote:
TTTooKewl wrote:Don't see how OP will get 30.7k anyway he/she slices it. At least one way you slice it, he/she won't.

4 pay periods over June and July = $6667 x 4 = $26,668.

Add in prorate for May: 6/31 = 19.3%; .193 * $6667*2 = $2573. $26668 + $2573 = $29241


your paycheck doesn't change month to month based on number of days. you are prorating in a really weird/arbitrary way here. 10/52 = x/160k; solve for X.


Well, there are a few ways they could prorate it, all of which are arbitrary. TTTooKewl assumes they will prorate him for the part of the month he worked. I bet it will be just half of the typical semi-monthly pay, which would come out to $30,001.50 at the end.

There aren't exactly 4 weeks in a month, which is what is fucking it up.

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JohannDeMann
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby JohannDeMann » Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:15 pm

Yeah I see now what it's coming down to - the 3 day memorial day weekend before he starts. If that's included in the SA, my number will be right, if not included in the SA, his number will be right. But either way you slice 10 weeks: 10/52 weeks or 70/365 days equals $30.7k. But you're getting 4.6 pay periods (10/52 = x/24) of 6667 per pay period which also equals 30.7k. So in all 3 of the above: 30.7k, which is what I meant anyway you slice it. I guess if they advertise a 10 week SA and pay you for 9.5 weeks, by prorating down to the day, then you get less.

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Yardbird
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby Yardbird » Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:17 pm

TTTooKewl wrote:
JohannDeMann wrote:
TTTooKewl wrote:Don't see how OP will get 30.7k anyway he/she slices it. At least one way you slice it, he/she won't.

4 pay periods over June and July = $6667 x 4 = $26,668.

Add in prorate for May: 6/31 = 19.3%; .193 * $6667*2 = $2573. $26668 + $2573 = $29241


your paycheck doesn't change month to month based on number of days. you are prorating in a really weird/arbitrary way here. 10/52 = x/160k; solve for X.


I admit I don't know how the firm would prorate. But it doesn't make sense to prorate by week. OP isn't being paid weekly or bi-weekly. OP is being paid by the month, with two pay checks per month. Unless what the firm means by "semi-monthly" is every two weeks -- in which case, OP would be making $6667 every 2 weeks, which would total more than 30.7k.
You're being paid monthly, but your salary is a weekly salary. For accounting purposes you are being paid at the same time as normal attorneys. Your weekly salary should be $160,000/52 (or whatever the 1st year rate is - this might be adjusted slightly...some firms round up and some round down). Multiply that weekly number by the number of weeks you are working (might not actually be 10 on the dot).

So if you're working "10" weeks, starting May 26 with your first paycheck on June 15th and your last day and last paycheck being July 31, your paychecks should be as follows (note that May 26 through July 31 is not 10 weeks, but actually 9 weeks and 4 days).

May 26-June 15 (paid June 15): 6666.67 + (3080)*(# of weeks worked in May, can be fractional); if 4/5ths a week in May, this will be 9,130.67
June 16-30 (paid June 30): 6666.67
July 1-15 (paid July 15): 6666.67
July 16-31 (paid July 31): 6666.67

This is a total of $29,130.68. This is short $1,053.32 from straight multiplying 9.8*3,080, but that can likely be accounted by using sort of pro-ration. Also, this would be fixed entirely if the firm pays for the previous weeks but not the current week when paying for 15 days. This would mean you will have an additional paycheck on August 15 which would capture any amount not paid in the first 4 paychecks.

-----
Another example: 12 week program starting May 11, first paycheck on May 29:

May 11-29 (paid May 29): 6666.67 + 3080*1.00 = 9,746.67
June 1-15 (paid June 15): 6666.67
June 16-30 (paid June 30): 6666.67
July 1-15 (paid July 15): 6666.67
July 16-31 (paid July 31): 6666.67

Total = $36,413. Still short $547, but that can likely be accounted by using sort of pro-ration. Also, this would be fixed entirely if the firm pays for the previous weeks but not the current week when paying for 15 days. This would mean you will have an additional paycheck on August 15 which would capture any amount not paid in the first 5 paychecks.

------
The error and difference between the monthly paychecks and the weekly amounts totaled up is because dividing $160 by 52 and totaling up 10 weeks is more accurate than dividing by 12 months and totaling two months and a few weeks. The division by 12 months does not account for the fact that some months are longer and shorter than others, and later adding up values on the number of weeks worked will not yield the same value as if you had divided by weeks in the first place. For the same reason, the # of days worked will provide the most accurate salary projection ($3080/7=daily salary). Using 365.25 would also change things, but would only provide completely accurate numbers if valuing over a 4 year period.

If you don't believe me, divide 365 by 52 and multiply the resulting value by 10 (the equivalent of a 10 week summer). (Hint, the answer is 70.192).
Then take 365, divide by 12, and multiply by (2+X*12/365), where X is the number of days worked in the non-full month. The numbers will not be the same. (Hint, for 4 days worked in May, this would be 64.833; a difference of 5.359 from the weekly answer).

The difference between the two methods becomes smaller as the time worked grows larger until you reach a full year, where the values will be equal.
Last edited by Yardbird on Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Betharl
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby Betharl » Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:42 pm

UnfrozenCaveman wrote:How many days in a week?


This is hilarious! I wonder if that guy was trolling. He had to be, right?

deng
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby deng » Sat Apr 18, 2015 3:18 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
In any case, you're getting paid $30,000 to be completely useless and get taken out to lunch a lot. Recognize how lucky you are and spend less time worrying about the exact amounts of your paychecks.


Just want to point out how absurd this comment is.

I'm all for humility and perspective but that doesn't extend to not worrying about money you are contractually entitled to.

Maybe OP wants to plan her finances for next year. Maybe she's trying to figure out if she can put some extra funds away for loan repayments. Maybe OP just wants to know if she can buy some absurd and pointless object that is none of our business.

Regardless, no one should turn a blind eye to their finances just because you think they should prostrate themselves before their big law employers.

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DELG
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby DELG » Mon Apr 20, 2015 9:39 am

I actually found an instance, combing through billing memos on a bankruptcy docket, where a Weil summer was billed for 1.5x his summer salary on one case. So maybe not as useless as you assume.

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Desert Fox
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby Desert Fox » Mon Apr 20, 2015 9:40 am

DELG wrote:I actually found an instance, combing through billing memos on a bankruptcy docket, where a Weil summer was billed for 1.5x his summer salary on one case. So maybe not as useless as you assume.


That is extremely rare. I doubt a single thing I did was actually billed. And I only entered about 15 hours for one client (which was prob written off).

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Desert Fox
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Re: SA Salary Question

Postby Desert Fox » Mon Apr 20, 2015 9:41 am

deng wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
In any case, you're getting paid $30,000 to be completely useless and get taken out to lunch a lot. Recognize how lucky you are and spend less time worrying about the exact amounts of your paychecks.


Just want to point out how absurd this comment is.

I'm all for humility and perspective but that doesn't extend to not worrying about money you are contractually entitled to.

Maybe OP wants to plan her finances for next year. Maybe she's trying to figure out if she can put some extra funds away for loan repayments. Maybe OP just wants to know if she can buy some absurd and pointless object that is none of our business.

Regardless, no one should turn a blind eye to their finances just because you think they should prostrate themselves before their big law employers.


It's not contractually obligated actually.




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