is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

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is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:01 am

Title pretty much.

I'll be going to a V50 there, but it is a small satellite office.

Can I expect the same $ as NY?

Obviously I mean down the road, starting salary is obviously $160k+bonus, not exactly sure but I assume bonus would be 10k too to start
But really just wondering about progression

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 16, 2014 4:06 pm

Bump surely someone here practices out west :?

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby OneMoreLawHopeful » Tue Dec 16, 2014 6:04 pm

I'm a biglaw associate in SF/SV, but this is a difficult question to answer based just upon "a v50 firm" because that implicates a large number of firms which may have many different policies. For example, K&L Gates is v50, but notoriously opaque about what they pay anyone in any market.

Generally, the higher up the vault list, they all pay market in SF/SV (e.g. Skadden, Simpson,Weil, Latham, etc.).

But when you get closer to 50, there are exceptions (as an example, Alston & Bird starts their SV associates at $160k, but then makes no promises of lockstep beyond that).

Since you are anonymous anyway, why not just name the firm and someone who works in SF/SV may be able to chime in with specific info.

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:21 pm

OneMoreLawHopeful wrote:I'm a biglaw associate in SF/SV, but this is a difficult question to answer based just upon "a v50 firm" because that implicates a large number of firms which may have many different policies. For example, K&L Gates is v50, but notoriously opaque about what they pay anyone in any market.

Generally, the higher up the vault list, they all pay market in SF/SV (e.g. Skadden, Simpson,Weil, Latham, etc.).

But when you get closer to 50, there are exceptions (as an example, Alston & Bird starts their SV associates at $160k, but then makes no promises of lockstep beyond that).

Since you are anonymous anyway, why not just name the firm and someone who works in SF/SV may be able to chime in with specific info.


Thanks for the reply!

Many of the offices are so small in the Silicon Valley that I'm hesitant to really go farther... but would it help to say, one of: Ropes, Baker Botts, McDermott? I may have been slightly off on the V50, more like approx. V50. But I get the sense that these are roughly comparable...

Also, since I will be an SA, and will likely have some sort of opportunity to interview during 3L, if where I am going does pay significantly less than others...well that would be pretty good reason for me to at least interview with someone else if I knew that they pay better. Not that pay is the only consideration, but being under a lot of debt, it's definitely one of the more important considerations along with the work in my particular practice area

And this info is basically impossible to find online, so appreciate any info! Thanks!!

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby 20160810 » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:22 pm

Since you've already accepted an SA position it seems like the credited approach here would be to just ask one of the senior associates that you get along with this summer. I'm sure they'll tell you the lay of the land.

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby fats provolone » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:28 pm

attorneys at ropes, baker botts, and mcdermott furiously scrutinizing their summer classes to figure out who might be asking about salary scales on tls

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:29 pm

SBL wrote:Since you've already accepted an SA position it seems like the credited approach here would be to just ask one of the senior associates that you get along with this summer. I'm sure they'll tell you the lay of the land.


Thing is I am considering putting in clerkship applications, as well as submitting my resume to Loyola and my school's OCI, and all of this needs to be decided well before my SA.

Not that I am unhappy with where I accepted, I actually liked the office a lot and chose it over other places. But at the same time, I never really had the opportunity to talk about salary growth. If the firm I'm at pays like $100k less at year 7 than another firm I could realistically interview with, I'd really like to know that. And honestly other than TLS, I have no idea how to find this out before I get out there. Not many people from my school end up in the Bay Area.

I think some people around here kinda forget how big of a deal $ can be when everyone in NYC makes the exact same amount

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby 20160810 » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:40 pm

You should probably put in clerkship applications anyhow since it's not like the firm won't let you defer if you want to clerk and stay, so I don't see how that effects things, and the deadline for 3LOLOCI is usually late enough that people can get in after their SA gigs end. I think you're working on a needlessly self-imposed timeframe here. I also think it's probably silly to assume you'll last 7 years in biglaw, even with the new suicide fences on the Golden Gate Bridge.

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:52 pm

SBL wrote:You should probably put in clerkship applications anyhow since it's not like the firm won't let you defer if you want to clerk and stay, so I don't see how that effects things, and the deadline for 3LOLOCI is usually late enough that people can get in after their SA gigs end. I think you're working on a needlessly self-imposed timeframe here. I also think it's probably silly to assume you'll last 7 years in biglaw, even with the new suicide fences on the Golden Gate Bridge.


yea, you're not wrong about the artificial deadline but finals procrastinating and all... lol

OCI deadline is right after Spring finals, but Loyola and SF IP fair deadlines are both before finals. A ways away but it's not I'm going to have any different resources after winter break than I do now.

And my clerkship app would be pretty much a hail marry anyways so if there's nothing to "trade up" to I don't think it would really be worth it.

And my point about $100k at 7 years is well, that's gonna mean like $50k behind at 5, and $25k at 3 years, or whatever. If salary is significantly more compressed at some firms than it is at others, it would make more sense to start out somewhere with more upside.

3L OCI is also like the last opportunity it seems to interview with tons of employers who have generic entry level openings, whereas any lateral down the road is either going to be impossible or for a very specific skillset..

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby 20160810 » Tue Dec 16, 2014 8:44 pm

Not for nothing but if you're going to identify yourself as a transfer from Loyola who's doing IP you might as well just name the firm.

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:40 pm

SBL wrote:Not for nothing but if you're going to identify yourself as a transfer from Loyola who's doing IP you might as well just name the firm.


Loyola Patent Fair bro

It's like OCI, except where OCI has a small handful of IP firms, Loyola has like 100 or something



Idk why people want me to out myself so bad when most summer classes in the bay area are under 10 people..
But I mean really, I guess what I'm gathering, is that in the bay area it just varies a lot firm to firm?
Last edited by Anonymous User on Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Desert Fox » Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:43 pm

Matt?

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby TTTooKewl » Wed Dec 17, 2014 1:30 am

Have you looked on Vault? Pretty much every firm has salary listed, and by city too, and to my knowledge it's accurate. Some firms only list one year or three years, which is an indication that there is no lockstep past the listed salary levels.

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Dec 17, 2014 7:39 am

Anonymous User wrote:
OneMoreLawHopeful wrote:I'm a biglaw associate in SF/SV, but this is a difficult question to answer based just upon "a v50 firm" because that implicates a large number of firms which may have many different policies. For example, K&L Gates is v50, but notoriously opaque about what they pay anyone in any market.

Generally, the higher up the vault list, they all pay market in SF/SV (e.g. Skadden, Simpson,Weil, Latham, etc.).

But when you get closer to 50, there are exceptions (as an example, Alston & Bird starts their SV associates at $160k, but then makes no promises of lockstep beyond that).

Since you are anonymous anyway, why not just name the firm and someone who works in SF/SV may be able to chime in with specific info.


Thanks for the reply!

Many of the offices are so small in the Silicon Valley that I'm hesitant to really go farther... but would it help to say, one of: Ropes, Baker Botts, McDermott? I may have been slightly off on the V50, more like approx. V50. But I get the sense that these are roughly comparable...

Also, since I will be an SA, and will likely have some sort of opportunity to interview during 3L, if where I am going does pay significantly less than others...well that would be pretty good reason for me to at least interview with someone else if I knew that they pay better. Not that pay is the only consideration, but being under a lot of debt, it's definitely one of the more important considerations along with the work in my particular practice area

And this info is basically impossible to find online, so appreciate any info! Thanks!!


I work in the Ropes SF office and Ropes' compensation policies are the same firm-wide across offices so those in the SF and SV offices will get paid on the same scale/standards of the Boston/NYC offices of Ropes. Not really sure I would consider Baker Botts and McDermott to be comparable to Ropes though in terms of the type of firms/practices they have though.

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:41 am

Anonymous User wrote:I work in the Ropes SF office and Ropes' compensation policies are the same firm-wide across offices so those in the SF and SV offices will get paid on the same scale/standards of the Boston/NYC offices of Ropes. Not really sure I would consider Baker Botts and McDermott to be comparable to Ropes though in terms of the type of firms/practices they have though.


Good to know, thanks. If you don't mind sharing, is that the same scale as most of the NY firms? "cravath scale" or whatever, or is it lower? Ropes like the other firms only has the first year salary (all $160k) on Vault. Maybe I'm off base but, for my narrow practice group, they seemed comparable firms in terms of all being small offices of large firms, all are foreign transplant firms, etc. Thanks!!

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Dec 20, 2014 1:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I work in the Ropes SF office and Ropes' compensation policies are the same firm-wide across offices so those in the SF and SV offices will get paid on the same scale/standards of the Boston/NYC offices of Ropes. Not really sure I would consider Baker Botts and McDermott to be comparable to Ropes though in terms of the type of firms/practices they have though.


Good to know, thanks. If you don't mind sharing, is that the same scale as most of the NY firms? "cravath scale" or whatever, or is it lower? Ropes like the other firms only has the first year salary (all $160k) on Vault. Maybe I'm off base but, for my narrow practice group, they seemed comparable firms in terms of all being small offices of large firms, all are foreign transplant firms, etc. Thanks!!


Base salary is the same scale at Ropes as the general NY scale. Bonuses are only public for the first two class years and then individualized with a target level of 1900 hours. You'll generally get market bonus (DPW Scale this year) at 1900 and then adjusted up and down depending on being under or over 1900 hours.

My main point is that most of the offices of East coast firms will be on the same salary/bonus scale as the general New York biglaw market. Baker and McDermott don't really compete in the same hiring environment since they're not based on the East Coast. For whatever it's worth, firms base their compensation policies based on what other firms they think of as their peers/competitors.

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Re: is SF/Silicon Valley salary the same as NYC? Midlevel/Senior

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:51 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I work in the Ropes SF office and Ropes' compensation policies are the same firm-wide across offices so those in the SF and SV offices will get paid on the same scale/standards of the Boston/NYC offices of Ropes. Not really sure I would consider Baker Botts and McDermott to be comparable to Ropes though in terms of the type of firms/practices they have though.


Good to know, thanks. If you don't mind sharing, is that the same scale as most of the NY firms? "cravath scale" or whatever, or is it lower? Ropes like the other firms only has the first year salary (all $160k) on Vault. Maybe I'm off base but, for my narrow practice group, they seemed comparable firms in terms of all being small offices of large firms, all are foreign transplant firms, etc. Thanks!!


Base salary is the same scale at Ropes as the general NY scale. Bonuses are only public for the first two class years and then individualized with a target level of 1900 hours. You'll generally get market bonus (DPW Scale this year) at 1900 and then adjusted up and down depending on being under or over 1900 hours.

My main point is that most of the offices of East coast firms will be on the same salary/bonus scale as the general New York biglaw market. Baker and McDermott don't really compete in the same hiring environment since they're not based on the East Coast. For whatever it's worth, firms base their compensation policies based on what other firms they think of as their peers/competitors.


Thank you for this brother




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