OCI Recruitment Ques. Forum

[Anonymous User]

Long story short. I just joined our brand new satellite office in my state’s largest metro. We are a prestigious in-state firm with +60 attorneys (but less than 10 in this satellite office). The digs and views are over-the-top impressive.

Surprisingly, this weekend I was tasked to oversee our OCI recruitment. Not super time consuming since our OCI is limited to the main LS in our market (tier 2)…my state has around a dozen law schools but no T14s. However T14s students are hired regularly by BL and others in this metro (nearly top 10).

My responsibility is to screen and recommend a dozen applicants for callbacks. It is unclear if I will play a part during the callback, other than I recommended the candidates. Hopefully a partner will be with me during the screening.

Certain obvious questions will arise during the screening. First, SA pay. The home firm pays $120K. SAs work 10 weeks. Considering that our satellite is smaller/newer I am leaning toward recommending $90K, but with the option for SAs to go 12 weeks (which works out to the same money as 10 weeks @ $120). Then there is the question of interviewing just 2Ls or looking at 3Ls too. I suppose if a 3L applies (time permitting), what the heck, why not, other than the concern regarding why s/he did not get picked up during 2L (economy is the default, I suppose…this market has not been robust for a few years).

Once an offer is made our (home office) practice is that the candidate has two weeks to accept or decline, I was considering a one week period.... little patience for indecisive people. Especially since we’re only hiring 3 SAs.

Granted there is more to it (picking who’s to be screened, etc.) but on the topic of Questions, Pay, SA length, 3L possibility, does anyone have anything else to recommend?

[rad lulz]

Y'all don't follow NALP guidelines re time to accept offer?

[Anonymous User]

No. I was just looking at that while trying to get a handle on this task of mine. I believe theirs is 28 days.

[de5igual]

I don't see why you wouldn't just follow the protocol from the main office. Why are you purposely trying to make things more difficult here just 'cuz?

[goldeneye]

Is there a real justification to pay 30k less just because you're a smaller office? Is it a smaller city with cheaper cost of living?

[Anonymous User]

I don't see why you wouldn't just follow the protocol from the main office. Why are you purposely trying to make things more difficult here just 'cuz?

Funny that you wrote that. I just received a note from the partner, mainly about something that we're working on... at the bottom of the message it said best to stay with the 10 days! I got the message....TEN days it is.

I should add that when the firm asked me about the SA, it took me a nanosecond to accept.

[A. Nony Mouse]

Once an offer is made our (home office) practice is that the candidate has two weeks to accept or decline, I was considering a one week period.... little patience for indecisive people. Especially since we’re only hiring 3 SAs.

It seems kind of unfair to call people indecisive for not wanting to respond more quickly - you don't know what other irons they have in the fire and what other considerations they have for deciding. Does it really make any difference on the firm's end to give them more time to decide, such that you need to know the answer one week sooner?

(Obviously if the firm's policy is 10 days, it's 10 days, but that doesn't make it a great policy, no matter how long it took you to accept.)

[Anonymous User]

Is there a real justification to pay 30k less just because you're a smaller office? Is it a smaller city with cheaper cost of living?

Actually no. It is probably as (or more) expensive. My thinking is that this office is just starting out. Just thinking about the nut.

I am for people earning more money. More pay = happier for everyone.

[09042014]

Uncle Tom

[rad lulz]

.

[Anonymous User]

(Obviously if the firm's policy is 10 days, it's 10 days, but that doesn't make it a great policy, no matter how long it took you to accept.)

Unfortunately we’re not a giant firm that offers 40 SAs and if a couple bail out, it’s not such a big deal.

[jkpolk]

Is there a real justification to pay 30k less just because you're a smaller office? Is it a smaller city with cheaper cost of living?

Actually no. It is probably as (or more) expensive. My thinking is that this office is just starting out. Just thinking about the nut.

If the office is just starting out you should pay more hth

[Anonymous User]

Is there a real justification to pay 30k less just because you're a smaller office? Is it a smaller city with cheaper cost of living?

Actually no. It is probably as (or more) expensive. My thinking is that this office is just starting out. Just thinking about the nut.

If the office is just starting out you should pay more hth

I’ll pass that along. Seriously, if I recommend $90, that gives them the opportunity to come back as heroes with a bigger number. Trust me on this.

[A. Nony Mouse]

(Obviously if the firm's policy is 10 days, it's 10 days, but that doesn't make it a great policy, no matter how long it took you to accept.)

Unfortunately we’re not a giant firm that offers 40 SAs and if a couple bail out, it’s not such a big deal.

Okay, but then I'm confused. First, your concerns about filling a class aren't anything to do with applicants being indecisive. Second, the length of time you give them to answer doesn't seem to have much to do with the yield you get - if someone's going to reject you, they'll reject you within 1 week as easily as 2, and if someone is going to bail after accepting your offer (which seems to be a bigger risk for what you're referring to), they'll do so whether they give you an answer after one week or 2.

[2014]

I'm guessing the firm's perspective is that with only three spots they can probably only afford to have 3 maybe 4 outstanding offers at a given time. If you give them the full 28 days to mull it over you run the risk of some or all of them dragging it out and turning them down which means options 5 through 8 or whatever are pretty likely to have found something else. Probably a concern at all firms but the bigger ones have big enough classes that they can have way more outstanding offers and just have the summer size be a moving target.


OP out of curiosity are all of the dozen going to come from this one school's OCI or do you have a dozen to disperse between OCI and mass mails? Curious how you will allocate them if the latter.

[bk1]

I don't see you why you wouldn't just pay SAs prorated 1st year associate pay, whatever that happens to be for your office.

[A. Nony Mouse]

I'm guessing the firm's perspective is that with only three spots they can probably only afford to have 3 maybe 4 outstanding offers at a given time. If you give them the full 28 days to mull it over you run the risk of some or all of them dragging it out and turning them down which means options 5 through 8 or whatever are pretty likely to have found something else. Probably a concern at all firms but the bigger ones have big enough classes that they can have way more outstanding offers and just have the summer size be a moving target.


OP out of curiosity are all of the dozen going to come from this one school's OCI or do you have a dozen to disperse between OCI and mass mails? Curious how you will allocate them if the latter.

Yeah, I guess that makes sense - though I was originally responding to 1 week v. 2, not the full 28 days. I also have a hard time thinking firms can't fill a class, given the current state of hiring. Still, it seems unfair to expect applicants to accept on the spot, which was the vibe I was getting. Someone who doesn't accept on the spot isn't indecisive or acting selfishly, even if it makes sense for the firm to want to know as soon as possible.

[Anonymous User]

OP Responding.

If the firm had said, follow our hiring template. Not a problem. I have no ax to grind with pay, length of SA or SA 10 day acceptance timetable. Nor do I have a problem with only going to one school (a couple others are not far up the road). My primary concern is offering callbacks to the ten best possible candidates. Still not sure about 3L interviewing. I mentioned it once and the response was neutral at best.

As far as my reasoning for $90, I probably was swayed by two attorneys who came over and applied for a position asking for around $70. I did not interview them, nor did I see their resumes, just heard about it. So I figured $90 was actually (kind of) generous. Maybe the firm will direct me to do as an above poster suggested, pay SA’s on the scale of first year associates ($120). Simple is best.

Good news is, my recommendations aren’t due until later this week. In the end they will probably closely mirror the main office’s policy. No matter what is decided I think interviewing applicants should be interesting.

(FWIW: No matter what, cannot get my arms around 28 days).

[El Pollito]

I don't see why you wouldn't just follow the protocol from the main office. Why are you purposely trying to make things more difficult here just 'cuz?

Funny that you wrote that. I just received a note from the partner, mainly about something that we're working on... at the bottom of the message it said best to stay with the 10 days! I got the message....TEN days it is.

I should add that when the firm asked me about the SA, it took me a nanosecond to accept.

That just makes you seem desperate.

[dead head]

This really sounds like the guy who was transferred to a new office in the largest city in his state, where he was given a bunch of incentives to move (including a 10% raise). So dude gets a raise for moving to this new office in more expensive city where higher-paying biglaw offices exist, and decides that it makes sense to cut SA salaries by 25% because it's a new office. Alrighty then.

Good luck competing against your home office, let alone BL in your new office's city. I'm sure you'll look like a genius for recommending the partners lowball offerrees, at least until you can't get anyone you really like to accept your offers (let alone within 10 days).

[TTRansfer]

This all sounds incredibly TTT.

[NotMyRealName09]

Low balling offers does sound dumb. You're trying to RECRUIT candidates, and low ball offers will only be accepted by low ball candidates.

[mrjohnsterman]

Well you are either talking about Houston, Miami or Columbus I assume as those are only states with anywhere near a dozen law schools that don't have t14.

Houston and Miami market pay are at or above 120k so I wouldn't go below that or those you offer will probably take better paying firms. I don't know anything about Columbus but NALP should help you out

[Anonymous User]

Sounds like you're in Florida. I would agree with the above posts about the $$ offer. Just prorate 1st year associate salary. No negotiation necessary.

[Anonymous User]

OP

Damn. You guys are good!

Turns out that the OCI topic came up today and it was suggested that we consider upping the associate pay for this city. My response, you guessed it, “Exactly. Good point.” 10 day decision stays (two weeks to be exact). Only 2L recruiting. No split summers. SA is for 10 weeks (some wiggle room to extend to 12 weeks). I now have a new motto, spare no expense.

Thanks all.