Student loan payments: Actual numbers

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krads153
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby krads153 » Mon Jan 25, 2016 5:45 pm

Tls2016 wrote:
ballouttacontrol wrote:
krads153 wrote:Re: buying in NYC, likely none of us will ever have to worry about that. At least in Manhattan, the condo/coop fees these days are my rent...so you'd be paying rent for a one bed somewhere plus a huge mortgage on top of that.

I can't imagine who would have the money to buy in Manhattan without parents funding at least the downpayment these days, if not part of the mortgage.


condo association fees are $2k/month in NY? wtf? I've never heard of such a thing. Condo fees on a $5M luxury condo downtown SF are like $1-1.5k :? :?

Condo fees on my friends $3,750,000 3 bedroom in park avenue are $2100 a month. And he had to have a minimum of 50% down in cash for the board to even consider him.( There are a lot of buildings that are 100% cash.)
Of course the condo fee doesn't include lots of other building expenses.


Yeah, my friend bought a tiny renovation needed apt in some old building in Manhattan - I think fees were like 1800 a month. Mortgage was 1 million. Plus the entire thing had to be reno'd for like 300-400k cash. I don't know how much they fronted for deposit - i assume 300k or so. So that's like 600-700k cash, plus an insane mortgage, plus 1800 a month fees. I think he pays around 9-10k a month on fees/mortgage/etc. Apt is tiny too but it looks good because they reno'd.

Not worth it IMO...you'd have to be tied down to a very well paying job...

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lacrossebrother
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby lacrossebrother » Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:00 pm

zot1 wrote:
lacrossebrother wrote:
zot1 wrote:It's all about that stupid down payment. What I pay in rent is more than what I would have to pay for a mortgage in my area if I had one. But since I don't have a down payment to throw around, no house for me!

is this a joke?


No. But you can tell me why you thought it was one.

Why is a down payment stupid? It seems stupid to me that people are allowed to "buy" houses putting less than 20% down on them.
If you would agree to completely indemnify the bank for the downside scenario by posting some alternative collateral, I suppose then a down payment might be unnecessary...but I have no idea why you think you should be allowed to expose yourself to a highly leveraged (or infinitely leveraged...) investment opportunity without any risk.

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zot1
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby zot1 » Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:17 pm

lacrossebrother wrote:
zot1 wrote:
lacrossebrother wrote:
zot1 wrote:It's all about that stupid down payment. What I pay in rent is more than what I would have to pay for a mortgage in my area if I had one. But since I don't have a down payment to throw around, no house for me!

is this a joke?


No. But you can tell me why you thought it was one.

Why is a down payment stupid? It seems stupid to me that people are allowed to "buy" houses putting less than 20% down on them.
If you would agree to completely indemnify the bank for the downside scenario by posting some alternative collateral, I suppose then a down payment might be unnecessary...but I have no idea why you think you should be allowed to expose yourself to a highly leveraged (or infinitely leveraged...) investment opportunity without any risk.


I meant "stupid" in the same that I don't have it. I don't think the idea is altogether stupid.

However, the lender has the property as a collateral so it's not that risky for it.

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bk1
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby bk1 » Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:52 pm

zot1 wrote:I meant "stupid" in the same that I don't have it. I don't think the idea is altogether stupid.

However, the lender has the property as a collateral so it's not that risky for it.

With little to no money down, it's very easy for the house to become upside down due to real estate fluctuations. That is why PMI exists.

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Tiago Splitter
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby Tiago Splitter » Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:53 pm

bk1 wrote:
zot1 wrote:I meant "stupid" in the same that I don't have it. I don't think the idea is altogether stupid.

However, the lender has the property as a collateral so it's not that risky for it.

With little to no money down, it's very easy for the house to become upside down due to real estate fluctuations. That is why PMI exists.

No way the banks could never lose money on real estate.

Anonymous User
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jan 25, 2016 8:17 pm

whysoseriousbiglaw wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Law School Debt: $0---the one upside to taking the scholarship at the shitty school.

Mortgage Debt: Maybe 145k left on my mortgage on a house in a city I no longer live in. I could sell for about 300k. Right now I rent it out for like 1700/month. My monthly payment is like 1300/month considering HOA fees and all expenses and bullshit that comes up with the renters. I'm thinking hard about dumping it and just moving the equity elsewhere. One big problem with the renters could wipe out all my gains.

Combined household income: $200k. We have 1 kid. I'm working for the government now, but I'll probably go back to biglaw. I got too used to the pay, and as embarrassing as it is to admit it, it's tough to save money on $200k. I think we'll have a combined household income of $400k once I go back.

Notes: biggest expenses are kid's daycare (like 1,800/mo, which is competitive here) and rent (like 3,000/mo, which is high here and a vestige of my good old days in biglaw. I'll probably downgrade if I'm still in government when my lease is up, or I'll buy a new place if I'm back in biglaw).


Do you live in a big city with a kid? If so, then yeah 200k is not enough to save on. Why not relocate and transfer offices in your job?


Fairly big city. Definitely an expensive city. I agree saving is tough on 200k. This is an ideal place to live, though, so I'll probably try to make it work here. Another thing that weighs on me is that being an (e.g.) AUSA here is a nice resume line that would allow me to cash in if I need to, but the same job in a less expensive district probably wouldn't have the same benefit. I get that they don't bury you with your prestige points and exit options, but since I don't know where I'm headed in life, it's nice to have them in case I need them.

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zot1
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby zot1 » Mon Jan 25, 2016 8:23 pm

Tiago Splitter wrote:
bk1 wrote:
zot1 wrote:I meant "stupid" in the same that I don't have it. I don't think the idea is altogether stupid.

However, the lender has the property as a collateral so it's not that risky for it.

With little to no money down, it's very easy for the house to become upside down due to real estate fluctuations. That is why PMI exists.

No way the banks could never lose money on real estate.


Oh I get that completely, I just meant that it's not like they would completely lose out on their investment.

Why are y'all so bank friendly today?

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JohannDeMann
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby JohannDeMann » Mon Jan 25, 2016 9:18 pm

krads153 wrote:
Tls2016 wrote:
ballouttacontrol wrote:
krads153 wrote:Re: buying in NYC, likely none of us will ever have to worry about that. At least in Manhattan, the condo/coop fees these days are my rent...so you'd be paying rent for a one bed somewhere plus a huge mortgage on top of that.

I can't imagine who would have the money to buy in Manhattan without parents funding at least the downpayment these days, if not part of the mortgage.


condo association fees are $2k/month in NY? wtf? I've never heard of such a thing. Condo fees on a $5M luxury condo downtown SF are like $1-1.5k :? :?

Condo fees on my friends $3,750,000 3 bedroom in park avenue are $2100 a month. And he had to have a minimum of 50% down in cash for the board to even consider him.( There are a lot of buildings that are 100% cash.)
Of course the condo fee doesn't include lots of other building expenses.


Yeah, my friend bought a tiny renovation needed apt in some old building in Manhattan - I think fees were like 1800 a month. Mortgage was 1 million. Plus the entire thing had to be reno'd for like 300-400k cash. I don't know how much they fronted for deposit - i assume 300k or so. So that's like 600-700k cash, plus an insane mortgage, plus 1800 a month fees. I think he pays around 9-10k a month on fees/mortgage/etc. Apt is tiny too but it looks good because they reno'd.

Not worth it IMO...you'd have to be tied down to a very well paying job...


remember 4 pages ago when you talked about how NYC wasnt that expensive?

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Old Gregg
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby Old Gregg » Tue Jan 26, 2016 4:55 am

Condo fees and prop taxes can easily add up to make a home purchase look stupid. If you're looking at a home in the $3mm+ range, you presumably are well off enough not to worry about condo fees.

That said, my mortgage check comes out to around $3,400 a month, condo fees are $650 and prop taxes around $900 a month in SF, but I also get about $1,000 back per month from tax deductions. So about $4000 a month for my 2BR. It seems like a lot, but renting s 2BR in SF is often far more expensive, so if shit hit the fan I could rent it out, get positive cash flow and seek refuge somewhere cheaper.

I don't know how people in NYC do it. I'm glad I got out when I did.

krads153
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby krads153 » Tue Jan 26, 2016 4:12 pm

JohannDeMann wrote:
krads153 wrote:
Tls2016 wrote:
ballouttacontrol wrote:
krads153 wrote:Re: buying in NYC, likely none of us will ever have to worry about that. At least in Manhattan, the condo/coop fees these days are my rent...so you'd be paying rent for a one bed somewhere plus a huge mortgage on top of that.

I can't imagine who would have the money to buy in Manhattan without parents funding at least the downpayment these days, if not part of the mortgage.


condo association fees are $2k/month in NY? wtf? I've never heard of such a thing. Condo fees on a $5M luxury condo downtown SF are like $1-1.5k :? :?

Condo fees on my friends $3,750,000 3 bedroom in park avenue are $2100 a month. And he had to have a minimum of 50% down in cash for the board to even consider him.( There are a lot of buildings that are 100% cash.)
Of course the condo fee doesn't include lots of other building expenses.


Yeah, my friend bought a tiny renovation needed apt in some old building in Manhattan - I think fees were like 1800 a month. Mortgage was 1 million. Plus the entire thing had to be reno'd for like 300-400k cash. I don't know how much they fronted for deposit - i assume 300k or so. So that's like 600-700k cash, plus an insane mortgage, plus 1800 a month fees. I think he pays around 9-10k a month on fees/mortgage/etc. Apt is tiny too but it looks good because they reno'd.

Not worth it IMO...you'd have to be tied down to a very well paying job...


remember 4 pages ago when you talked about how NYC wasnt that expensive?


Huh? I commuted far and paid like nothing in rent for awhile while having a ton of roommates - i didn't live in Manhattan.

Buying in Manhattan is another story from renting outside of Manhattan with roommates. I'd never buy in Manhattan unless I had so much money that I could throw it in the trash without thinking twice.

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LA Spring
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby LA Spring » Tue Jan 26, 2016 5:25 pm

Tls2016 wrote:Of course the condo fee doesn't include lots of other building expenses.


I assume that the "doesn't include" means you have to pay for [condo] parking.

My only NYC acquaintance says cabs cost her around $200 a week ― admittedly she doesn’t use the subway. Also, I’ll assume that firms do not pay (or chip in) for associate parking.

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JohannDeMann
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby JohannDeMann » Tue Jan 26, 2016 5:30 pm

my bad krads. confused with someone else. youre cool.

Anonymous User
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jan 26, 2016 5:40 pm

Does anyone have any info about first time home buyer assistance? Is there any?

Tls2016
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby Tls2016 » Tue Jan 26, 2016 7:18 pm

LA Spring wrote:
Tls2016 wrote:Of course the condo fee doesn't include lots of other building expenses.


I assume that the "doesn't include" means you have to pay for [condo] parking.

My only NYC acquaintance says cabs cost her around $200 a week ― admittedly she doesn’t use the subway. Also, I’ll assume that firms do not pay (or chip in) for associate parking.

No. Just know that parking is very expensive. That's why most people don't have cars.
But I was mostly thinking of Christmas tips for everyone and other tips for everything.

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Mlk&Ckies
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby Mlk&Ckies » Tue Jan 26, 2016 9:07 pm

Have we talked about the allowances (exemptions?) stub-year associates should take to make sure we're not over-taxed during those months?

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Danger Zone
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby Danger Zone » Tue Jan 26, 2016 9:24 pm

Mlk&Ckies wrote:Have we talked about the allowances (exemptions?) stub-year associates should take to make sure we're not over-taxed during those months?

Yes. Maybe not in this thread but somewhere.

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bk1
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby bk1 » Tue Jan 26, 2016 9:56 pm

Mlk&Ckies wrote:Have we talked about the allowances (exemptions?) stub-year associates should take to make sure we're not over-taxed during those months?

Just use the IRS withholding calculator. If you do this, don't forget to adjust it when the new year rolls around.

whysoseriousbiglaw
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby whysoseriousbiglaw » Tue Jan 26, 2016 10:55 pm

Tls2016 wrote:But I was mostly thinking of Christmas tips for everyone and other tips for everything.


You're right - some people I know spend $1000+ tipping the doormen, etc. in their building. NYC tipping is ridiculous. I hear in some buildings they can make 20k under the table at Christmas.

I should trade jobs with the concierge.

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zot1
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby zot1 » Tue Jan 26, 2016 11:11 pm

whysoseriousbiglaw wrote:
Tls2016 wrote:But I was mostly thinking of Christmas tips for everyone and other tips for everything.


You're right - some people I know spend $1000+ tipping the doormen, etc. in their building. NYC tipping is ridiculous. I hear in some buildings they can make 20k under the table at Christmas.

I should trade jobs with the concierge.


I obviously picked the wrong profession.

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Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:55 am

bk1 wrote:
Mlk&Ckies wrote:Have we talked about the allowances (exemptions?) stub-year associates should take to make sure we're not over-taxed during those months?

Just use the IRS withholding calculator. If you do this, don't forget to adjust it when the new year rolls around.


IRS calculator is TCR. I start in October and will be taking 17 allowances to per the IRS calculator to make sure I'm not over-taxed. ($40,000 income during stub year puts my federal taxes at ~$4,200).

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gk101
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby gk101 » Wed Jan 27, 2016 2:58 pm

probably not the right place to ask, but has anyone here gotten a mortgage from SoFi? They are offering no PMI (or loan origination fees) for at least 10% down payment. wondering how competitive their rates are as compared to other traditional lenders

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bk1
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby bk1 » Wed Jan 27, 2016 3:02 pm

gk101 wrote:probably not the right place to ask, but has anyone here gotten a mortgage from SoFi? They are offering no PMI (or loan origination fees) for at least 10% down payment. wondering how competitive their rates are as compared to other traditional lenders

(Don't have a ton of knowledge about the subject.) Is it structured as an 80/10/10? If so, any place that offers that will get you no PMI.

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gk101
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby gk101 » Wed Jan 27, 2016 3:12 pm

bk1 wrote:
gk101 wrote:probably not the right place to ask, but has anyone here gotten a mortgage from SoFi? They are offering no PMI (or loan origination fees) for at least 10% down payment. wondering how competitive their rates are as compared to other traditional lenders

(Don't have a ton of knowledge about the subject.) Is it structured as an 80/10/10? If so, any place that offers that will get you no PMI.

I don't think so. it appears to be a straight 90/10 but they don't have a ton of information available. My understanding with the 80/10/10 was that the interest rates on the 10% are usually pretty high thereby negating any benefit of avoiding PMI

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bk1
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby bk1 » Wed Jan 27, 2016 3:24 pm

gk101 wrote:I don't think so. it appears to be a straight 90/10 but they don't have a ton of information available. My understanding with the 80/10/10 was that the interest rates on the 10% are usually pretty high thereby negating any benefit of avoiding PMI

Yea the interest rate usually is higher so it's not straight up saving, but I think people probably do at least save some money going that route (how much on average, I'm not sure). You're right that a lot of SoFi's terms are annoyingly closed off on their site if you don't actually go through the application process.

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Desert Fox
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Re: Student loan payments: Actual numbers

Postby Desert Fox » Wed Jan 27, 2016 3:43 pm

Phil Brooks wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Has anyone heard of biglaw firms offering some sort of student loan consolidation deal with a bank? I heard Latham offers it to its associates. Is this commonplace? If anyone has any knowledge of this, what interest rate is the consolidated loan?


Law firms do this in order to erode any shred of leverage the associate would have over it. Do you really want to be an employee AND debtor to a single firm?


sure, at that point the firm will actually have a vested interested in my career. I'd take that deal.




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