Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

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How will bonuses compare to last year?

Up
21
22%
Same
66
68%
Down
10
10%
 
Total votes: 97

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Old Gregg
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Old Gregg » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:26 pm

Tiago Splitter wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:Also anyone in biglaw aggressively paying down loans is pretty far from being eligible for forgiveness. I get that risk aversion might lead you to want the IBR safety net, but at a certain point you're paying more than that's worth. IMO a 4% interest rate reduction is past that point.

Obviously if you intend to stay in private practice for the long term and can get a 4% reduction it's a pretty easy choice. But for someone set on getting into some kind of PI or government work after a couple of years in Biglaw keeping the PSLF option open is pretty important.


Also very important to note. But for some reason I don't get the impression Big Shrimpin is on that track.

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ExBiglawAssociate
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby ExBiglawAssociate » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:29 pm

zweitbester wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:With respect to mutual funds/ETFs, it was my understanding that most of them charge pretty ridiculous fees. I looked at a chart of some of the best performing ETFs and people weren't making out with much of a return due to the fees. Maybe this has changed? In any event, I plan on living maybe 2-3 more years given my current lifestyle, so I should probably just spend everything on hookers and blow.


Yeah, your info is way off base here. One of my favorite options is the Fidelity Spartan S&P 500 fund, which is common in 401(k) plans and charges 0.05%in fees per annum. That's basically free: literally 20-40x less than a lot of shitty funds out there.

As the artist currently known as zweitbester mentions, Vanguard is another great option for absurdly low fee mutual funds and ETFs.


Thanks bud. Also, JPMorgan Private Bank gives clients access to their inhouse ETFs and Mutual Funds at discounted loads, some of which are pretty competitive with Vanguard.


Access to these discounts requires a fairly high amount of investment, which I wouldn't be able to do. I know this for sure because I've spoken with JPMorganChase bankers about it.

Fidelity Spartan sounds like TCR, but I'm trying to save up for a home purchase and don't want my nest egg pwnd by the next downturn.

Finally, my 3.5% rate is pretty sweet, but another reason I'm paying down as quickly as possible is because the guy who loaned me the money is kind of a dickhead and feels like he can treat me like somewhat of a bitch every time I see him since I'm indebted to him. So I'd like to remove myself from this situation as quickly as possible.

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Old Gregg
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Old Gregg » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:54 pm

Access to these discounts requires a fairly high amount of investment, which I wouldn't be able to do. I know this for sure because I've spoken with JPMorganChase bankers about it.


Really? Because I have an account and I definitely don't have the assets or wealth for it. Associates at most biglaw firms can get one for free.

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ExBiglawAssociate
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby ExBiglawAssociate » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:58 pm

zweitbester wrote:
Access to these discounts requires a fairly high amount of investment, which I wouldn't be able to do. I know this for sure because I've spoken with JPMorganChase bankers about it.


Really? Because I have an account and I definitely don't have the assets or wealth for it. Associates at most biglaw firms can get one for free.


Hmmm... this particular banker didn't know I was a biglaw associate. Maybe if I flash some PRESTIGE at him with my business card, he'll hook me up.

Anonymous User
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:15 pm

911 crisis actor wrote:Looks like bonus season is done


Has Davis Polk announced yet?

911 crisis actor
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby 911 crisis actor » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:55 pm

I don't think DPW has ever SHATTERED the market or even come close to lightly denting it

Could be wrong though

run26.2
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby run26.2 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:27 pm

Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:
zweitbester wrote:
Access to these discounts requires a fairly high amount of investment, which I wouldn't be able to do. I know this for sure because I've spoken with JPMorganChase bankers about it.


Really? Because I have an account and I definitely don't have the assets or wealth for it. Associates at most biglaw firms can get one for free.


Hmmm... this particular banker didn't know I was a biglaw associate. Maybe if I flash some PRESTIGE at him with my business card, he'll hook me up.

Your firm might have an existing relationship with a private bank. Ask your HR department. Associates are often also allowed to open an account with the bank.

run26.2
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby run26.2 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:37 pm

Also, the Dow is up about 20% this year. While average overall returns haven't been great over the last 7 years, that also includes one of the larger recessions since WWII.

You could use your bonus $ to open a Fidelity account. In addition to the fund TSL identified, they have numerous no load funds.

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Big Shrimpin
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Big Shrimpin » Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:22 pm

zweitbester wrote:
Before ITE, 2-3 years was doable. Now, not so much with these shitbonuses (unless you're at BSF/WLRK/etc.).


Before ITE, nobody I know in biglaw paid off their loans that aggressively because before ITE they were getting loans at pretty competitive interest rates. Back then, many private lenders were offering competitive variable interest rate loans. Most of my loans for law school were with a private lender (who now no longer provides student loans) and they were hovering close to 2% interest when I graduated.


I was speaking in a more hypothetical sense, but agree with what you said generally because that was the case.

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Big Shrimpin
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Big Shrimpin » Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:26 pm

run26.2 wrote:Also, the Dow is up about 20% this year. While average overall returns haven't been great over the last 7 years, that also includes one of the larger recessions since WWII.

You could use your bonus $ to open a Fidelity account. In addition to the fund TSL identified, they have numerous no load funds.


DOW being up 20% is just more reason for me not to invest.

I'm not taking what little money I have and basically exposing it to market downside risk. That cash, for me relative to my risk tolerance, is better spent reducing debt.

But if I could qualify for a 4% rate or lower, I'd do it. Problem is just that I was never approved for such a low rate and switching now doesn't make much sense if there isn't a very strong possibility of the rate going down from what they quoted me.

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thesealocust
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby thesealocust » Thu Dec 12, 2013 6:50 pm

Yeah, it really doesn't make sense to invest instead of paying down high interest loans (which is economically equivalent to leveraged investing, which is a horrible idea for pretty much everyone pretty much all the time, unless you're playing with Other People's Money (TM))

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ExBiglawAssociate
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby ExBiglawAssociate » Thu Dec 12, 2013 7:46 pm

It's a lot more complicated than "if your student loan rate is X%, you should invest, otherwise, pay down your debt."

1) Before you invest anything, you need to set aside enough liquid funds for an emergency. The amount depends on your family size, risk tolerance, and a bajillion other factors.

2) Before you start throwing your money into shit that's going to require you to pay short-term capital gains tax (if you withdraw it prematurely), you should set aside another set of funds in low-risk, semi-liquid assets (and by that I mean your money is not going to have to be locked up for >1). Again, how much you save in this basket depends on your situation: For example, are you saving up for a house or some other large expensive?

3) When you finally invest for retirement (lol @ Millennials ever being able to retire), you have to do it with the mindset that you're not going to touch the money for a few years at least (or decades).

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Tiago Splitter
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Tiago Splitter » Thu Dec 12, 2013 8:08 pm

Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:2) Before you start throwing your money into shit that's going to require you to pay short-term capital gains tax (if you withdraw it prematurely),

There's really no reason to be investing outside of retirement accounts unless you're really putting a lot away. Use a Roth IRA as your emergency fund and if the emergency doesn't happen you can invest a whole lot of money tax free. If you need it the contributions come out tax and penalty free.

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ExBiglawAssociate
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby ExBiglawAssociate » Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:04 pm

Tiago Splitter wrote:
Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:2) Before you start throwing your money into shit that's going to require you to pay short-term capital gains tax (if you withdraw it prematurely),

There's really no reason to be investing outside of retirement accounts unless you're really putting a lot away. Use a Roth IRA as your emergency fund and if the emergency doesn't happen you can invest a whole lot of money tax free. If you need it the contributions come out tax and penalty free.


Agreed.

Anonymous User
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Dec 13, 2013 12:06 am

RATE how dumb (or shrewd) it would be to clerk in a major-ish market DCt after a year of biglaw and a debtload of like 150k or so.

And a kind of expensive apartment in NYC.

With the hoaps of going right back into biglaw after.

Edit: biglawyers need only opine.

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thesealocust
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby thesealocust » Fri Dec 13, 2013 12:07 am

federal clerkship? totally fine / good plan.

keg411
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby keg411 » Fri Dec 13, 2013 12:35 am

Bonus memo dropped today. No SHATTERING to be had (except for high billers, but I dunno how many people that actually effects since I've heard different things).

For the person who wants to clerk - sure, go for it.

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Big Shrimpin
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Big Shrimpin » Fri Dec 13, 2013 12:41 am

keg411 wrote:Bonus memo dropped today. No SHATTERING to be had (except for high billers, but I dunno how many people that actually effects since I've heard different things).

For the person who wants to clerk - sure, go for it.


Are you at K&E?

Fuck, my bone-us memo hasn't dropped yet. Scurred.

Rilly on the clerking thing? Sounds dumb if you're strapped for cash doe?

keg411
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby keg411 » Fri Dec 13, 2013 12:47 am

Big Shrimpin wrote:
keg411 wrote:Bonus memo dropped today. No SHATTERING to be had (except for high billers, but I dunno how many people that actually effects since I've heard different things).

For the person who wants to clerk - sure, go for it.


Are you at K&E?

Fuck, my bone-us memo hasn't dropped yet. Scurred.

Rilly on the clerking thing? Sounds dumb if you're strapped for cash doe?


LOLno. I was just mocking ATL since they like to make it sound like every firm is going to SHATTER THE MARKET.

As for the clerking, I don't think it's something you do for the $$$$. You do it for the preftige points. Although the poster could always wait since I know people who are doing alumni clerkships even 3-4 years out.

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thesealocust
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby thesealocust » Fri Dec 13, 2013 1:54 am

Stopping big law for a year, getting a modest pay cut and then collecting a giant bonus and going back to biglaw is hardly going to lead to financial ruin.

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ExBiglawAssociate
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby ExBiglawAssociate » Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:14 am

Anonymous User wrote:RATE how dumb (or shrewd) it would be to clerk in a major-ish market DCt after a year of biglaw and a debtload of like 150k or so.

And a kind of expensive apartment in NYC.

With the hoaps of going right back into biglaw after.

Edit: biglawyers need only opine.


You'll be fine.

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Old Gregg
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Old Gregg » Fri Dec 13, 2013 4:30 pm

Cahill and Kaye Scholer bucking the trend.

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thelawyler
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby thelawyler » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:02 pm

zweitbester wrote:Cahill and Kaye Scholer bucking the trend.


There should be associate-wide collusion to rig the Vault rankings to align with bonuses. After all, it is an associate rating system, right?

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thesealocust
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby thesealocust » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:13 pm

Cahill is either kind of new on the bonus wars scene or there was a gap in my due diligence during recruiting. I don't remember hearing anything about them every paying above market comp back in the day, but it seems quite regular now.

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Blindmelon
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Re: Biglaw Bonus Watch (2013)

Postby Blindmelon » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:33 pm

thelawyler wrote:
zweitbester wrote:Cahill and Kaye Scholer bucking the trend.


There should be associate-wide collusion to rig the Vault rankings to align with bonuses. After all, it is an associate rating system, right?


Preftige > $. Go big vault or go home.




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