IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

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IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 02, 2013 10:36 pm

How strict is their hiring criteria? Because it seems a bit extreme to me. They will only take people ranked top 20% in their school? Is that really their cutoff? So someone in the top 20% at Cardozo is eligible, but someone at top third at Columbia is SOL?

nomdeplumeify
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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby nomdeplumeify » Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:11 am

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Last edited by nomdeplumeify on Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:25 am

nomdeplumeify wrote:1L here. I've talked to many IRS attorneys and those that have tried to get into the IRS, the 20% is a hard cutoff. I go to a T2 school and a guy that went there was top 25% and already worked for the IRS, and they would not even consider hiring him or giving him an interview because he didn't meet the top 20% requirement. Also, top 20% is for T14 schools, lower ranked schools you're going to need to be top 5-10% to even be considered. They might make some exceptions for HYS but I don't think it's very likely.

I just can't believe a GS9 job is that competitive.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:40 am

I have no idea whether the IRS does stick to those cutoffs or not, but there are enough people who would love a stable, secure federal job with good benefits and very reasonable hours (especially compared to biglaw), and government hiring has been cut significantly enough, that most government agencies are overwhelmed with applicants and can pick and choose. They may not always pick and choose based purely on grades, but I'm sure they could, if they chose to.

ETA: I was really thinking about permanent jobs when I wrote the above, but if they ever hire out of their summer program I'm sure the same considerations apply.

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby nomdeplumeify » Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:52 am

Anonymous User wrote: I just can't believe a GS9 job is that competitive.


Echoing what A.Nony Mouse said above. A lot of people would trade a larger salary [if you're lucky to get biglaw] for the stability, more reasonable hours, and benefits that a government job offers. Additionally, for people wanting to be tax attorneys doing any sort of controversy work, it can be a huge plus to have IRS experience because half the battle in dealing with them is knowing who to talk to and cultivating relationships with the agents and attorneys.

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:57 am

GS9 is $50K a year. I make more than that with my B.A.

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby hephaestus » Thu Oct 03, 2013 2:00 am

Anonymous User wrote:GS9 is $50K a year. I make more than that with my B.A.

Ok, then don't go to law school?

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 03, 2013 2:27 am

I was talking to a friend who just left a major field office about this, as it struck me as excessive too. It's not an absolute barrier if you are in the ballpark and have other resume features. As to whether median at T-14 would turn heads, maybe not in itself. Most of the attorneys I know at the IRS are not from top schools. My impression is that demonstrated interest in tax is the real key.

That being said this friend did not work in HR, so whether this is actual policy or office rumor is open for debate.

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby NYstate » Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:13 am

A. Nony Mouse wrote:I have no idea whether the IRS does stick to those cutoffs or not, but there are enough people who would love a stable, secure federal job with good benefits and very reasonable hours (especially compared to biglaw), and government hiring has been cut significantly enough, that most government agencies are overwhelmed with applicants and can pick and choose. They may not always pick and choose based purely on grades, but I'm sure they could, if they chose to.

ETA: I was really thinking about permanent jobs when I wrote the above, but if they ever hire out of their summer program I'm sure the same considerations apply.


This. There are so many more applicants than jobs for government positions. I wonder if the IRS will be hiring at all now. I posted in the Vale thread that government jobs right now feels like biglaw and the recession. There just aren't jobs.

Plus, IRS jobs would qualify for LRAP, making them even more desirable.

Don't compare government hiring in some jobs to biglaw hiring. Government isn't as concerned with showing potential clients that they have people from T14 schools. It makes sense that the government would use a strict grade cutoff instead of going deeper into a class to hire.

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:25 am

Anonymous User wrote:GS9 is $50K a year. I make more than that with my B.A.

That's nice. It matters to how the IRS hires why?

(Also, does the IRS actually start attorneys at GS-9? I'd be surprised - every other government attorney job I've seen starts at GS-11. If you're talking about the summer program, of course it would pay less.)

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby nomdeplumeify » Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:32 am

A. Nony Mouse wrote:That's nice. It matters to how the IRS hires why?

(Also, does the IRS actually start attorneys at GS-9? I'd be surprised - every other government attorney job I've seen starts at GS-11. If you're talking about the summer program, of course it would pay less.)


I think summers start at GS-9 Step 1-3, but new hires start out at GS-11 Step 8.

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby kalvano » Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:36 am

A. Nony Mouse wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:GS9 is $50K a year. I make more than that with my B.A.

That's nice. It matters to how the IRS hires why?

(Also, does the IRS actually start attorneys at GS-9? I'd be surprised - every other government attorney job I've seen starts at GS-11. If you're talking about the summer program, of course it would pay less.)


IRS Honors Program starts at GS-11. GS-9 is only the summer program.

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:07 am

A. Nony Mouse wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:GS9 is $50K a year. I make more than that with my B.A.

That's nice. It matters to how the IRS hires why

I would think that shit salary would make the job undesirable despite the reduced hours and therefore less competitive. It boggles the fucking mind that someone with a JD and at top 20% in a t14 would settle for $50k a year. Even with LRP.

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby kalvano » Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:10 am

Anonymous User wrote:
A. Nony Mouse wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:GS9 is $50K a year. I make more than that with my B.A.

That's nice. It matters to how the IRS hires why

I would think that shit salary would make the job undesirable despite the reduced hours and therefore less competitive. It boggles the fucking mind that someone with a JD and at top 20% in a t14 would settle for $50k a year.



This is such a great use of anon posting.

You do understand an actual IRS attorney job pays more? And that not everyone wants a Biglaw job? And that someone may totally geek out over tax work and it may be their dream job? Or any number of possible scenarios?

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:15 am

Anonymous User wrote:I would think that shit salary would make the job undesirable despite the reduced hours and therefore less competitive. It boggles the fucking mind that someone with a JD and at top 20% in a t14 would settle for $50k a year. Even with LRP.

There are PLENTY of people in the Vale thread who'd blow a hobo for a $50K salary. There are no uncompetitive jobs these days. That doesn't at all mean that you, personally, have to be willing to work for that salary, but you can't be surprised that the job is competitive. (Of course, leaving aside the fact that the job PAYS MORE THAN $50K. According to the latest salary tables, GS-11 step 8 in DC = $77,040. Keep in mind you can move up the scale fairly quickly.)

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bk1
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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby bk1 » Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:25 am

+1 to the above.

But seriously, most fresh lawyers will probably be making 50k or less, and that doesn't even factor in the ones who don't get a legal job. What you consider a "shit salary" is actually the norm.

Anonymous User wrote:It boggles the fucking mind that someone with a JD and at top 20% in a t14 would settle for $50k a year. Even with LRP.

Dude, if you strike out at a T14 and don't get biglaw/clerkship (yes, this happens routinely every year to people in the T14 with top 20% grades), getting a 50k job that qualifies for 10 year PSLF is not a bad outcome. Striking out at OCI is a pretty bad spot to be in. So while most top 20% T14ers won't end up working in a position like this (since they will likely get biglaw), this would not be a bad option for someone who struck out.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:32 am

bk1 wrote:Dude, if you strike out at a T14 and don't get biglaw/clerkship (yes, this happens routinely every year to people in the T14 with top 20% grades), getting a 50k job that qualifies for 10 year PSLF is not a bad outcome. Striking out at OCI is a pretty bad spot to be in. So while most top 20% T14ers won't end up working in a position like this (since they will likely get biglaw), this would not be a bad option for someone who struck out.

Or even for someone who actually went to law school to get a government job to start with. :D

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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:44 am

Thanks for the info.

Dropping out makes more sense as each day passes.

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bk1
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Re: IRS Summer Program Hiring Criteria

Postby bk1 » Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:50 am

1. To get at the original question, if you read the link it actually says a 160 LSAT will satisfy rather than top 20% for any school that doesn't rank (this includes all T14s to my knowledge). So that top 1/3 at CLS isn't SoL.

2. Dropping out depends on a lot of things. If you really want to be an attorney then it may not make sense. Your debt level is another factor. The ceiling on the nonlaw job you'd go back to compared to the ceiling on the job you'd get at the end of law school. It may be worth it, it may not be, but it isn't all about pure salary.




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