New associate banter

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keg411
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Re: New associate banter

Postby keg411 » Sun Nov 24, 2013 10:07 am

LOL at the idea that they would pro rate you after the first milestone. The reason firms have milestones like that is to induce people to get to the higher ones, since they're making WAY more off of you to work those extra hours than you're getting as an additional bonus.

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El Pollito
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Re: New associate banter

Postby El Pollito » Sun Nov 24, 2013 10:19 am

keg411 wrote:LOL at the idea that they would pro rate you after the first milestone. The reason firms have milestones like that is to induce people to get to the higher ones, since they're making WAY more off of you to work those extra hours than you're getting as an additional bonus.

+1
Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:bone us

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gk101
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Re: New associate banter

Postby gk101 » Sun Nov 24, 2013 10:40 am

keg411 wrote:LOL at the idea that they would pro rate you after the first milestone. The reason firms have milestones like that is to induce people to get to the higher ones, since they're making WAY more off of you to work those extra hours than you're getting as an additional bonus.


Yup. My firm does not prorate and I haven't heard of any others that do that.

Anonymous User
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Nov 24, 2013 12:53 pm

gk101 wrote:
keg411 wrote:LOL at the idea that they would pro rate you after the first milestone. The reason firms have milestones like that is to induce people to get to the higher ones, since they're making WAY more off of you to work those extra hours than you're getting as an additional bonus.


Yup. My firm does not prorate and I haven't heard of any others that do that.


As I said, stupid question. I only asked because I have no partnership ambitions whatsoever and would gladly take whatever heat/consequences would come with slacking if it looked like I was going to get stuck in "no man's land" and spend 100+ extra hours in the office for no reason (unless it looked clear that it would be possible to get to the milestone).

- anon with question

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TatteredDignity
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Re: New associate banter

Postby TatteredDignity » Sun Nov 24, 2013 1:07 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
gk101 wrote:
keg411 wrote:LOL at the idea that they would pro rate you after the first milestone. The reason firms have milestones like that is to induce people to get to the higher ones, since they're making WAY more off of you to work those extra hours than you're getting as an additional bonus.


Yup. My firm does not prorate and I haven't heard of any others that do that.


As I said, stupid question. I only asked because I have no partnership ambitions whatsoever and would gladly take whatever heat/consequences would come with slacking if it looked like I was going to get stuck in "no man's land" and spend 100+ extra hours in the office for no reason (unless it looked clear that it would be possible to get to the milestone).

- anon with question


I'm also just a 3L, so it isn't really my place to say, but based on what's been said in these threads I'm not sure if your plan is realistic. TSL and others have emphasized that how many hours you work is largely outside of your control. It's not as though people are deciding to stay until 10:00PM rather than leaving at 7:00 just because they want to pad their hours and gun for partner/bonus. It's because a filing deadline is coming up, or a deal just came in, and it's all hands on deck. At that point, working late isn't about making partner or not, it's about getting fired or not.

Sup Kid
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Sup Kid » Sun Nov 24, 2013 1:25 pm

TatteredDignity wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
gk101 wrote:
keg411 wrote:LOL at the idea that they would pro rate you after the first milestone. The reason firms have milestones like that is to induce people to get to the higher ones, since they're making WAY more off of you to work those extra hours than you're getting as an additional bonus.


Yup. My firm does not prorate and I haven't heard of any others that do that.


As I said, stupid question. I only asked because I have no partnership ambitions whatsoever and would gladly take whatever heat/consequences would come with slacking if it looked like I was going to get stuck in "no man's land" and spend 100+ extra hours in the office for no reason (unless it looked clear that it would be possible to get to the milestone).

- anon with question


I'm also just a 3L, so it isn't really my place to say, but based on what's been said in these threads I'm not sure if your plan is realistic. TSL and others have emphasized that how many hours you work is largely outside of your control. It's not as though people are deciding to stay until 10:00PM rather than leaving at 7:00 just because they want to pad their hours and gun for partner/bonus. It's because a filing deadline is coming up, or a deal just came in, and it's all hands on deck. At that point, working late isn't about making partner or not, it's about getting fired or not.

Yep, this. If you're at 2000 hours at the end of November and have 5 deals that need to close by year-end, you can't just stop working and take the month of December off unless you don't want the job anymore.

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quakeroats
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Re: New associate banter

Postby quakeroats » Sun Nov 24, 2013 1:49 pm

zweitbester wrote:
quakeroats wrote:
zweitbester wrote:I feel like trip insurance never pays out except in the most particular circumstances. And I'm pretty sure being called into work isn't one of then, but could be wrong.


Many firms will make you whole if they need you during a scheduled vacation.


Only if the client is willing to foot the bill.


For scheduled vacations, my firm will foot the bill. I'd be surprised if most firms didn't take a similar tack.

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Old Gregg
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Old Gregg » Sun Nov 24, 2013 1:55 pm

I know better than to get into an argument with you.

keg411
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Re: New associate banter

Postby keg411 » Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:48 pm

Sup Kid wrote:Yep, this. If you're at 2000 hours at the end of November and have 5 deals that need to close by year-end, you can't just stop working and take the month of December off unless you don't want the job anymore.


+1. As a junior (and especially as a first year), you have almost no control over how much or how little you work. But it's more than just that -- there are also a ton of other dynamics at play that you can't possibly predict until you actually start working (such as the sub-group you end up working with, the case/deals you end up working on, how many other first years are in your group/sub-group, which partners or sub-groups you *want* to work for, if you're at a Free Market firm where you have to seek out your own work, etc.).*

*Obviously if you're at a firm with a very strict rotation system, the other stuff won't be in play, but you'll just have zero control over your schedule instead of almost zero control.

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: New associate banter

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Sun Nov 24, 2013 6:53 pm

keg411 wrote:
Sup Kid wrote:Yep, this. If you're at 2000 hours at the end of November and have 5 deals that need to close by year-end, you can't just stop working and take the month of December off unless you don't want the job anymore.


+1. As a junior (and especially as a first year), you have almost no control over how much or how little you work. But it's more than just that -- there are also a ton of other dynamics at play that you can't possibly predict until you actually start working (such as the sub-group you end up working with, the case/deals you end up working on, how many other first years are in your group/sub-group, which partners or sub-groups you *want* to work for, if you're at a Free Market firm where you have to seek out your own work, etc.).*

*Obviously if you're at a firm with a very strict rotation system, the other stuff won't be in play, but you'll just have zero control over your schedule instead of almost zero control.

This is why I think it's healthier to think of bonuses as recognition of past work rather than incentives to work harder. I know that's kind of an artificial distinction, but thinking "hey thanks for $10k" will take fewer years off your life than "wtf this only works out to $15 an hour why did I bother" or whatever.

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Old Gregg
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Old Gregg » Sun Nov 24, 2013 7:52 pm

dixiecupdrinking wrote:
keg411 wrote:
Sup Kid wrote:Yep, this. If you're at 2000 hours at the end of November and have 5 deals that need to close by year-end, you can't just stop working and take the month of December off unless you don't want the job anymore.


+1. As a junior (and especially as a first year), you have almost no control over how much or how little you work. But it's more than just that -- there are also a ton of other dynamics at play that you can't possibly predict until you actually start working (such as the sub-group you end up working with, the case/deals you end up working on, how many other first years are in your group/sub-group, which partners or sub-groups you *want* to work for, if you're at a Free Market firm where you have to seek out your own work, etc.).*

*Obviously if you're at a firm with a very strict rotation system, the other stuff won't be in play, but you'll just have zero control over your schedule instead of almost zero control.

This is why I think it's healthier to think of bonuses as recognition of past work rather than incentives to work harder. I know that's kind of an artificial distinction, but thinking "hey thanks for $10k" will take fewer years off your life than "wtf this only works out to $15 an hour why did I bother" or whatever.


Isn't the bolded thinking of bonuses as recognition of past work, though?

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: New associate banter

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:51 pm

zweitbester wrote:
dixiecupdrinking wrote:
keg411 wrote:
Sup Kid wrote:Yep, this. If you're at 2000 hours at the end of November and have 5 deals that need to close by year-end, you can't just stop working and take the month of December off unless you don't want the job anymore.


+1. As a junior (and especially as a first year), you have almost no control over how much or how little you work. But it's more than just that -- there are also a ton of other dynamics at play that you can't possibly predict until you actually start working (such as the sub-group you end up working with, the case/deals you end up working on, how many other first years are in your group/sub-group, which partners or sub-groups you *want* to work for, if you're at a Free Market firm where you have to seek out your own work, etc.).*

*Obviously if you're at a firm with a very strict rotation system, the other stuff won't be in play, but you'll just have zero control over your schedule instead of almost zero control.

This is why I think it's healthier to think of bonuses as recognition of past work rather than incentives to work harder. I know that's kind of an artificial distinction, but thinking "hey thanks for $10k" will take fewer years off your life than "wtf this only works out to $15 an hour why did I bother" or whatever.


Isn't the bolded thinking of bonuses as recognition of past work, though?

well yes I suppose it is. excellent point.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that the more you can think about these as gratuitous payments rather than part of your core compensation, the happier you'll be.

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quakeroats
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Re: New associate banter

Postby quakeroats » Sun Nov 24, 2013 10:52 pm

zweitbester wrote:I know better than to get into an argument with you.


Don't argue with me. If you're planning a vacation ask your peers what the policy is. Don't spend money on trip insurance if your firm will cover you.

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Old Gregg
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Old Gregg » Sun Nov 24, 2013 11:23 pm

quakeroats wrote:
zweitbester wrote:I know better than to get into an argument with you.


Don't argue with me. If you're planning a vacation ask your peers what the policy is. Don't spend money on trip insurance if your firm will cover you.


I've been at my firm long enough to become a midlevel. I think I'd know our vacation policies by now.

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5ky
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Re: New associate banter

Postby 5ky » Sun Nov 24, 2013 11:25 pm

zweitbester wrote:
quakeroats wrote:
zweitbester wrote:I know better than to get into an argument with you.


Don't argue with me. If you're planning a vacation ask your peers what the policy is. Don't spend money on trip insurance if your firm will cover you.


I've been at my firm long enough to become a midlevel. I think I'd know our vacation policies by now.


I don't know. quakeroats graduated in 2013. i'd be inclined to listen to him as an authority on all firm matters.

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El Pollito
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Re: New associate banter

Postby El Pollito » Mon Nov 25, 2013 10:51 am

5ky wrote:
zweitbester wrote:
quakeroats wrote:
zweitbester wrote:I know better than to get into an argument with you.


Don't argue with me. If you're planning a vacation ask your peers what the policy is. Don't spend money on trip insurance if your firm will cover you.


I've been at my firm long enough to become a midlevel. I think I'd know our vacation policies by now.


I don't know. quakeroats graduated in 2013. i'd be inclined to listen to him as an authority on all firm matters.

Especially ones that involve social cues.

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quakeroats
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Re: New associate banter

Postby quakeroats » Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:17 pm

5ky wrote:
zweitbester wrote:
quakeroats wrote:
zweitbester wrote:I know better than to get into an argument with you.


Don't argue with me. If you're planning a vacation ask your peers what the policy is. Don't spend money on trip insurance if your firm will cover you.


I've been at my firm long enough to become a midlevel. I think I'd know our vacation policies by now.


I don't know. quakeroats graduated in 2013. i'd be inclined to listen to him as an authority on all firm matters.


+1

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thesealocust
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Re: New associate banter

Postby thesealocust » Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:16 pm

+2

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20160810
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Re: New associate banter

Postby 20160810 » Wed Nov 27, 2013 12:21 am

5ky wrote:
zweitbester wrote:
quakeroats wrote:
zweitbester wrote:I know better than to get into an argument with you.


Don't argue with me. If you're planning a vacation ask your peers what the policy is. Don't spend money on trip insurance if your firm will cover you.


I've been at my firm long enough to become a midlevel. I think I'd know our vacation policies by now.


I don't know. quakeroats graduated in 2013. i'd be inclined to listen to him as an authority on all firm matters.

In measured defense of a bad poster, he basically just said "ask hr about the policy."

Anonymous User
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:11 pm

sorry to ask here but this doesn't deserve its own thread

if i have good credit, and standard NY biglaw salary, how much money do i need in the bank to convince a landlord to let me take on a lease before i start my job? (presume trying to move in in august or september with start date in october). or does the employment letter pretty much cover it as long as you can pay first/security?

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thesealocust
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Re: New associate banter

Postby thesealocust » Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:31 pm

Anonymous User wrote:sorry to ask here but this doesn't deserve its own thread

if i have good credit, and standard NY biglaw salary, how much money do i need in the bank to convince a landlord to let me take on a lease before i start my job? (presume trying to move in in august or september with start date in october). or does the employment letter pretty much cover it as long as you can pay first/security?


The employment letter will specify the salary and should do the trick for anything non-obscene, although an August move/October start might be a problem.

Anonymous User
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:43 pm

thesealocust wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:sorry to ask here but this doesn't deserve its own thread

if i have good credit, and standard NY biglaw salary, how much money do i need in the bank to convince a landlord to let me take on a lease before i start my job? (presume trying to move in in august or september with start date in october). or does the employment letter pretty much cover it as long as you can pay first/security?


The employment letter will specify the salary and should do the trick for anything non-obscene, although an August move/October start might be a problem.


so best to keep it to one month ahead at most, then?

Anonymous User
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 03, 2013 2:03 am

thesealocust wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:sorry to ask here but this doesn't deserve its own thread

if i have good credit, and standard NY biglaw salary, how much money do i need in the bank to convince a landlord to let me take on a lease before i start my job? (presume trying to move in in august or september with start date in october). or does the employment letter pretty much cover it as long as you can pay first/security?


The employment letter will specify the salary and should do the trick for anything non-obscene, although an August move/October start might be a problem.


Roommate and I did an August lease signing/Oct move-in/Dec start date, and didn't have any problems. Both of us had solid 700+ credit scores, but I had 3 digits in my bank account when we signed the lease. This was in CA and not NYC, so you may have more trouble, but we signed for a place that was around $4000 and had no trouble with the delays. GL!

Anonymous User
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:22 am

I'm planning to move to NYC after graduation but before bar study gets super serious-- probably sometime in June. I have $10K in SA money set aside plus a $4K stipend from my firm and a good credit score. Does that plus my employment letter sound like enough for a lease?

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Dr. Review
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Re: New associate banter

Postby Dr. Review » Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:36 am

Anonymous User wrote:I'm planning to move to NYC after graduation but before bar study gets super serious-- probably sometime in June. I have $10K in SA money set aside plus a $4K stipend from my firm and a good credit score. Does that plus my employment letter sound like enough for a lease?

I have never been denied a lease with an offer letter in hand. I have signed at least 2-3 leases that way. [disclaimer: this was not NYC, YMMV]




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