Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:00 pm

could people who are getting mass mail callbacks post approximate stats? My stats aren't terrible (above median at T10) but I haven't got a single peep out of 400+ mass mails to multiple markets. I'd just be interested to see if there is an anecdotal mass mail cutoff or something.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:29 pm

It depends on what you are looking to get. If looking for mid law I think connections are often more important than stats so you need to hit up markets you have good connections in. I got a mid law offer in my hometown for example. If you are gunning for biglaw I don't know if you have the stats to make your resume stand out but I don't really know. I was 5.5% at third tier and transferred to UT. I struck out with biglaw. I think with biglaw the best way to get mass mail interviews is be at a top 20 school at least with decent grades or be in the top 10% at a reputable school. It just makes your résumé pop I would think, but again I don't really know.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:38 pm

Anonymous User wrote:could people who are getting mass mail callbacks post approximate stats? My stats aren't terrible (above median at T10) but I haven't got a single peep out of 400+ mass mails to multiple markets. I'd just be interested to see if there is an anecdotal mass mail cutoff or something.


I'm around top third at BU/BC, mailing in the Northeast, and have had a few bites - not much, but a bit. I have strong ties to the area as well as strong, relevant work experience (I had some OCI screeners tell me my WE is why they were interested in me - though obviously not enough! :wink: ).

I've found that following up (but not too soon) has produced more responses (both positive and negative). I've also had multiple responses telling me that they do not hire until later in the year (some say they'll get back to me then, others ask me to resubmit during x month) and some that say they are unsure of their hiring needs/if they'll have a program/clerks yet but will keep me in mind if they do.

I feel as though I'm on the edge, but the bites have mostly been from mid-sized firms, particularly in the areas in which I am most interested and/or have the most experience.

I've sent over 100 mass mails (and still going). I've also been leaning on contacts a little, but that has not actually been as successful for me, unfortunately.

Edited to update: I've received three immediate (within the next few weeks) responses and a decent number of responses that they want to interview me when they meet later in the year. All of this was from mass mailing follow ups and does not include opportunities I've wrangled through networking or CSO. These all have also been relatively recent, so mid-sized in New England seems to be picking up right now.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Sat Oct 12, 2013 8:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:43 pm

around 300 massmails. CCN top 60%. Two callbacks

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 09, 2013 10:04 pm

below median at CCN
1 cb from around 150

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 09, 2013 10:27 pm

top 15% at a T20, 2 callbacks from mass-mail in Memphis and Dallas out of 7 screeners (1 NYC, 2 Chicago, and 2 DC). Sent about 750 total to a ton of markets, have followed up with about 200-300 (some twice), and have been contacting alumni at firms.

If you haven't heard anything from a firm, follow up. Assume you're still in the running until they tell you otherwise (try not to cross the line to being a pest, though).

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Devlin » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:23 am

Anonymous User wrote:top 15% at a T20, 2 callbacks from mass-mail in Memphis and Dallas out of 7 screeners (1 NYC, 2 Chicago, and 2 DC). Sent about 750 total to a ton of markets, have followed up with about 200-300 (some twice), and have been contacting alumni at firms.

If you haven't heard anything from a firm, follow up. Assume you're still in the running until they tell you otherwise (try not to cross the line to being a pest, though).

Can you tell me how long you waited before you sent a follow up? What did the follow up say, was it just reiterating your interest?


Also, if you don't mind, can you PM me the Dallas firm. I'm sure I already massmailed them, just wanted to make sure.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:54 am

Devlin wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:top 15% at a T20, 2 callbacks from mass-mail in Memphis and Dallas out of 7 screeners (1 NYC, 2 Chicago, and 2 DC). Sent about 750 total to a ton of markets, have followed up with about 200-300 (some twice), and have been contacting alumni at firms.

If you haven't heard anything from a firm, follow up. Assume you're still in the running until they tell you otherwise (try not to cross the line to being a pest, though).

Can you tell me how long you waited before you sent a follow up? What did the follow up say, was it just reiterating your interest?


Also, if you don't mind, can you PM me the Dallas firm. I'm sure I already massmailed them, just wanted to make sure.


My initial mass-mail was in mid August and I sent the first round of followups in mid-September (I honestly probably waited too long to do this) and a second round last week. If it's been at least 2 weeks since you mass-mailed, I would think about following up. The first followups just said something along the lines of "I'm still interested. Here are updated copies of my resume and transcript." I actually got a grade already this semester from a weekend course, and the 2nd round I mentioned that and included copies of my resume and transcript with the change.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:15 pm

Top 10% at T50
500+ mass mails in mid-Aug. (followups ongoing)
6 callbacks (1 major market, 1 secondary with no ties, 4 secondary home market)

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:13 pm

Devlin wrote:Can you tell me how long you waited before you sent a follow up? What did the follow up say, was it just reiterating your interest?


Not the prior poster you were asking, but I've gotten more positive responses to follow up emails than the initial. (Many emails were just telling me they hire later or rejections.) I waited too long for my initial followups - a little over a month - since I was still focused on sending out initial emails. Since then, I've generally been following up after approximately three weeks - no less than 2.5 weeks. I know a lot of people say two weeks, but I err on waiting a few more days to avoid being a pest. If I had something to actually update, I'd send it at two weeks. My follow up (only have sent one round) just reaffirms interest in a quick, maybe 3 sentence email.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:41 pm

34% at T35 and LR = Nothing at all out of 400+

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Oct 11, 2013 4:57 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Devlin wrote:Can you tell me how long you waited before you sent a follow up? What did the follow up say, was it just reiterating your interest?


Not the prior poster you were asking, but I've gotten more positive responses to follow up emails than the initial. (Many emails were just telling me they hire later or rejections.) I waited too long for my initial followups - a little over a month - since I was still focused on sending out initial emails. Since then, I've generally been following up after approximately three weeks - no less than 2.5 weeks. I know a lot of people say two weeks, but I err on waiting a few more days to avoid being a pest. If I had something to actually update, I'd send it at two weeks. My follow up (only have sent one round) just reaffirms interest in a quick, maybe 3 sentence email.


Did you send the follow up to the same person?


I have been emailing the hiring partner, managing partner, or if those are not indicated a partner from my law school / undergrad.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:21 pm

I got a problem I need done collective advice on.

I had a CB at a particular firm, for satellite office X.
I have a friend who is a senior partner there and basically told me that the firm will not have an SA class in office X. When I spoke with him a few days ago he asked if the firm had contacted me yet. No they hadn't. He told me what the partners who interviewed me at CB thought of me (generally good, with some minor constructive criticism). He said that the firm likes me and that they will probably fit me into main office Y or satellite office Z. He indicated he was annoyed that they hadn't contacted me and he was gonna get on it.

So far, I've heard nothing. I know that at this point I should just gang tight, but it's getting late in the season. How long do you guys think I should wait before following up?

Also, if given the choice, should I ask for the satellite office (my preferred market) or should I go to the main office? Just to specify, both are major legal markets (NYC/DC/LA/Dal/Hou/Chi/SF)

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby bk1 » Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:So far, I've heard nothing. I know that at this point I should just gang tight, but it's getting late in the season. How long do you guys think I should wait before following up?

Also, if given the choice, should I ask for the satellite office (my preferred market) or should I go to the main office? Just to specify, both are major legal markets (NYC/DC/LA/Dal/Hou/Chi/SF)

I'd follow up with your friend after a couple weeks if he indicated that it would happen soon. Generally main office is a better bet (more access to more people, generally higher likelihood of an offer, etc), but it really is something only you can answer based on where you want to be and the kind of practice group(s) you are interested in.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 12, 2013 3:47 am

Anonymous User wrote:could people who are getting mass mail callbacks post approximate stats? My stats aren't terrible (above median at T10) but I haven't got a single peep out of 400+ mass mails to multiple markets. I'd just be interested to see if there is an anecdotal mass mail cutoff or something.


Just below median T14. I wrote personalized cover letters to firms in markets I had ties to and got 6 CBs, 2 offers. Don't underestimate the power of a good cover letter. I know its hard when you're sending out 400+ mass mails, but I don't think I got a CB from any unpersonalized mailings. At this point, I think you need to start following up.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 12, 2013 4:07 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:could people who are getting mass mail callbacks post approximate stats? My stats aren't terrible (above median at T10) but I haven't got a single peep out of 400+ mass mails to multiple markets. I'd just be interested to see if there is an anecdotal mass mail cutoff or something.


Just below median T14. I wrote personalized cover letters to firms in markets I had ties to and got 6 CBs, 2 offers. Don't underestimate the power of a good cover letter. I know its hard when you're sending out 400+ mass mails, but I don't think I got a CB from any unpersonalized mailings. At this point, I think you need to start following up.

Just how personalized do you make them? I've personalized every cover letter by practice area (though I recycled some material) and have gotten only dings. Just above median at t14.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 12, 2013 4:39 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:could people who are getting mass mail callbacks post approximate stats? My stats aren't terrible (above median at T10) but I haven't got a single peep out of 400+ mass mails to multiple markets. I'd just be interested to see if there is an anecdotal mass mail cutoff or something.


Just below median T14. I wrote personalized cover letters to firms in markets I had ties to and got 6 CBs, 2 offers. Don't underestimate the power of a good cover letter. I know its hard when you're sending out 400+ mass mails, but I don't think I got a CB from any unpersonalized mailings. At this point, I think you need to start following up.

Just how personalized do you make them? I've personalized every cover letter by practice area (though I recycled some material) and have gotten only dings. Just above median at t14.


I focused more on the location and emphasized my ties to the area. The CBs I got were in the cities I had the strongest ties to, which, and I suppose this is just sort of lucky for me, happen to be relatively successful secondary markets without prestigious law schools nearby.

I also tried to point out specific things I liked about the firm if I could find any that weren't too generic (ex: an initiative they're clearly proud of, particular types of community involvement, etc.)

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 12, 2013 1:39 pm

I have been sending my mass mails to head of recruiting. I thought that was right, but when following up should I cc the hiring partner?

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Oct 14, 2013 5:27 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Top 10% at T50
500+ mass mails in mid-Aug. (followups ongoing)
6 callbacks (1 major market, 1 secondary with no ties, 4 secondary home market)


This is me - got my offer in a secondary market today.

"Success seems to be largely a matter of hanging on after others have let go." http://Error.com/kfkfugg

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 15, 2013 10:31 am

I spend hours upon hours researching and mass mailing each day. During that time, my classmates who have SAs line up are studying. I know my grades are just going to slip even more and its going to make getting a job even harder. I'm in the death spiral.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 15, 2013 10:41 am

Anonymous User wrote:I spend hours upon hours researching and mass mailing each day. During that time, my classmates who have SAs line up are studying. I know my grades are just going to slip even more and its going to make getting a job even harder. I'm in the death spiral.


Same here. Add crying my eyes out every day.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 15, 2013 1:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I spend hours upon hours researching and mass mailing each day. During that time, my classmates who have SAs line up are studying. I know my grades are just going to slip even more and its going to make getting a job even harder. I'm in the death spiral.

I feel this. I feel this hard.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby bk1 » Tue Oct 15, 2013 1:39 pm

1. Grades from this point on are much less important for the most part.

2. You can honestly learn most subjects with just a few days studying for each before the final.

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 15, 2013 2:44 pm

What do you recommend to put in the subject line for the initial MM? As for the body, just a mini introduction and then please see attached? Thanks!

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Re: Reminder: Stop reading tea leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby goldeneye » Tue Oct 15, 2013 3:01 pm

Anonymous User wrote:What do you recommend to put in the subject line for the initial MM? As for the body, just a mini introduction and then please see attached? Thanks!


2L Summer Associate Application or something similar.

YMMV but some people put their cover letter in the body of the e-mail, some attach a separate one.

I am a (law student) at (Cooley) and am applying for X. I love your firm for Z and the city for Y. I have attached ABC.




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