Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

(On Campus Interviews, Summer Associate positions, Firm Reviews, Tips, ...)
Forum rules
Anonymous Posting

Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are revealing sensitive employment related information about a firm, job, etc. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.

Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned.
Porkypots
Posts: 91
Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2014 9:42 pm

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Porkypots » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:20 pm

BigZuck wrote:
Porkypots wrote:I go to a shitty school. I have read all the advice from TLS re: the possibility of getting a big law or mid law SA. is it even worth mass mailing or applying to the law firms that post on my schools symplicity?

Not sure what you mean by "worth"

If someone walked up to you and gave you a free lottery ticket that had a billion dollar prize but low odds of winning would you just throw it in the trash? Or would you keep it long enough to at least check the numbers to see if you might have won?


"worth" as in do I even have a shot at any of these big law/mid law firms? I have applied to smaller firms and other legal orgs, but I am not sure if I should broaden my search to include these other firms. thanks :)

BigZuck
Posts: 11709
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:53 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby BigZuck » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:57 pm

Porkypots wrote:
BigZuck wrote:
Porkypots wrote:I go to a shitty school. I have read all the advice from TLS re: the possibility of getting a big law or mid law SA. is it even worth mass mailing or applying to the law firms that post on my schools symplicity?

Not sure what you mean by "worth"

If someone walked up to you and gave you a free lottery ticket that had a billion dollar prize but low odds of winning would you just throw it in the trash? Or would you keep it long enough to at least check the numbers to see if you might have won?


"worth" as in do I even have a shot at any of these big law/mid law firms? I have applied to smaller firms and other legal orgs, but I am not sure if I should broaden my search to include these other firms. thanks :)

Your chances depend on a bunch of stuff such as school you attend, GPA, diversity factors, interview skills, etc. Not sure anyone can assess those based on what little you've presented here. Also not sure if the probability of getting a job through mass mailing should even be a factor TBH.

User avatar
A. Nony Mouse
Posts: 28438
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:05 pm

If the firms wouldn't hire from your school, they wouldn't post on your simplicity. I don't know if you personally have a chance, but your school won't be the deal breaker.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Mass-mailed about 4 weeks ago now. Should I follow up, if i haven't heard anything? If so, should I just reiterate my interest?


Great question. Anyone willing to trade/edit/share mass mailing sample materials?


4 weeks is certainly ok for a follow-up. I did the same thing after not hearing back for a month and within 24 hours was thanked for my patience and told they would be back with me within the week. Some firms recognize they are only one of dozens we are applying to and don't want to waste time on an application that seems to have next to no interest.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:30 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Mass-mailed about 4 weeks ago now. Should I follow up, if i haven't heard anything? If so, should I just reiterate my interest?


Great question. Anyone willing to trade/edit/share mass mailing sample materials?


4 weeks is certainly ok for a follow-up. I did the same thing after not hearing back for a month and within 24 hours was thanked for my patience and told they would be back with me within the week. Some firms recognize they are only one of dozens we are applying to and don't want to waste time on an application that seems to have next to no interest.


Willing to edit/trade

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:04 pm

Super worried, no bites after a little over a month.

User avatar
UVA2B
Posts: 2928
Joined: Sun May 22, 2016 10:48 pm

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby UVA2B » Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:41 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Super worried, no bites after a little over a month.


It's a tough spot to be in, but have you expanded your focus geographically? MM is all about the long game and avoiding pigeonholing yourself in specific markets. Keep finding markets you'd like to practice, and keep sending off your materials to those markets.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 19, 2017 12:03 am

UVA2B wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Super worried, no bites after a little over a month.


It's a tough spot to be in, but have you expanded your focus geographically? MM is all about the long game and avoiding pigeonholing yourself in specific markets. Keep finding markets you'd like to practice, and keep sending off your materials to those markets.


Thanks, I mass mailed NY. Any idea of other markets with big classes that aren't tie sensitive?

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:56 am

a
Last edited by Anonymous User on Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

cavalier1138
Posts: 4458
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:01 pm

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby cavalier1138 » Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:00 am

Anonymous User wrote:Tier 1 school transfer student. 3.82/4.33 gpa, law review and 7 years work experience (lobbyist). Went 13/30 on OCI bids with 1 callback (which may not have gone great).

Just MM’d over 100 firms in DC.

What are the odds I can find a SA this late in the game?

I’m interested in transactional corpotate work, but will litigate for food.


Why are you gunning for DC? Seems like your interests are more NYC-centric, and there are way more SA spots open in New York.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:09 am

a
Last edited by Anonymous User on Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

sparkytrainer
Posts: 282
Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2015 12:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby sparkytrainer » Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:37 am

Anonymous User wrote:
cavalier1138 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Tier 1 school transfer student. 3.82/4.33 gpa, law review and 7 years work experience (lobbyist). Went 13/30 on OCI bids with 1 callback (which may not have gone great).

Just MM’d over 100 firms in DC.

What are the odds I can find a SA this late in the game?

I’m interested in transactional corpotate work, but will litigate for food.


Why are you gunning for DC? Seems like your interests are more NYC-centric, and there are way more SA spots open in New York.


Live and own a house in DC.

To the guy focusing on DC- you are going to have a bad time. DC has less summer associates in total than LA or Chicago, and it's the most grade sensitive city to search. Kids in the top 20% at t13s strike out in DC. You should start expanding your search ASAP because it's very likely you won't find anything at this point. Plus DC has completely embraced pre-oci the last few years, so I know for a fact a bunch of firms go into oci with significant chunks of their class already filled. Time to look elsewhere if you want a SA.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 19, 2017 4:24 pm

a
Last edited by Anonymous User on Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 19, 2017 7:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Tier 1 school transfer student. 3.82/4.33 gpa, law review and 7 years work experience (lobbyist). Went 13/30 on OCI bids with 1 callback (which may not have gone great).

Just MM’d over 100 firms in DC.

What are the odds I can find a SA this late in the game?

I’m interested in transactional corpotate work, but will litigate for food.


As said above: Blanket NYC. It's not too late - only mid-August. You're on Law Review which is a huge plus. You should be able to find something. Target large class-size firms especially, and firms that maybe are traditionally a teensy bit less popular with 2Ls. Like, say, PW corporate.

Lit tends to be somewhat harder to get than corporate, so esp since you actually want corporate, focus on corporate; don't pretend you want lit. Don't see any benefit to you in applying lit.

Every day counts. Best wishes!

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 19, 2017 7:23 pm

i
Last edited by Anonymous User on Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

McChicken
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2016 4:55 pm

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby McChicken » Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:20 pm

This may have been answered before, but I can't find it. When massmailing, is it okay to mail the same firm at different offices? Or should one try to avoid it?

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:24 pm

McChicken wrote:This may have been answered before, but I can't find it. When massmailing, is it okay to mail the same firm at different offices? Or should one try to avoid it?


Generally OK. With many (most?) firms, each office makes hiring decisions independently. There have been multiple examples here on TLS (and also in my personal experience) of a rejection from one office and a CB from another.

That said, NYC remains the "easiest" market to get into, relatively speaking. Would still recommend focusing on NYC instead of trying to break into DC or CA.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:19 am

Anonymous User wrote:
McChicken wrote:This may have been answered before, but I can't find it. When massmailing, is it okay to mail the same firm at different offices? Or should one try to avoid it?


Generally OK. With many (most?) firms, each office makes hiring decisions independently. There have been multiple examples here on TLS (and also in my personal experience) of a rejection from one office and a CB from another.

That said, NYC remains the "easiest" market to get into, relatively speaking. Would still recommend focusing on NYC instead of trying to break into DC or CA.


How about Paul Hastings? I have a single callback in DC. Can I use it to break into that market

cavalier1138
Posts: 4458
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:01 pm

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby cavalier1138 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 6:39 am

Anonymous User wrote:How about Paul Hastings? I have a single callback in DC. Can I use it to break into that market


Having a callback at one DC firm will not suddenly convince others that you're worth a look.

But if you're concerned that you can't apply to a separate office of the same firm, just look at their website. If they give the same contact information for recruiting regardless of where you want to apply, then don't bother. If they give different contacts, then you're good to go.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 22, 2017 2:21 pm

On email 365 (not counting all the web submissions I was directed to do). No bites yet, just seemed significant :cry: .

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 22, 2017 4:20 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Mass-mailed about 4 weeks ago now. Should I follow up, if i haven't heard anything? If so, should I just reiterate my interest?


Great question. Anyone willing to trade/edit/share mass mailing sample materials?


4 weeks is certainly ok for a follow-up. I did the same thing after not hearing back for a month and within 24 hours was thanked for my patience and told they would be back with me within the week. Some firms recognize they are only one of dozens we are applying to and don't want to waste time on an application that seems to have next to no interest.


What do you do when you do a follow-up? Just checking in and seeing if there are any materials they want from me?

lawyersHATEhim
Posts: 78
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:52 pm

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby lawyersHATEhim » Tue Aug 22, 2017 9:26 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Mass-mailed about 4 weeks ago now. Should I follow up, if i haven't heard anything? If so, should I just reiterate my interest?


Great question. Anyone willing to trade/edit/share mass mailing sample materials?


4 weeks is certainly ok for a follow-up. I did the same thing after not hearing back for a month and within 24 hours was thanked for my patience and told they would be back with me within the week. Some firms recognize they are only one of dozens we are applying to and don't want to waste time on an application that seems to have next to no interest.


What do you do when you do a follow-up? Just checking in and seeing if there are any materials they want from me?


It's basically a good time to thrown in a statement of continued interest and subtly ask about an update to your application.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Aug 22, 2017 9:59 pm

what about if you go to a TTTT? should i continue to mass mail, accept my unpaid public interest offer, wait for spring oci, or accept my fate for the mistakes i have made (aka going to a TTTT)?

User avatar
bk1
Posts: 19937
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 7:06 pm

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby bk1 » Wed Aug 23, 2017 4:50 am

Anonymous User wrote:what about if you go to a TTTT? should i continue to mass mail, accept my unpaid public interest offer, wait for spring oci, or accept my fate for the mistakes i have made (aka going to a TTTT)?

It's probably not worthwhile to gun for biglaw, but I don't think it's unreasonable to at least shoot for a paid gig. Unless the PI position would potentially result in a postgrad offer, I don't see why you shouldn't keep hunting.

Anonymous User
Posts: 301322
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Reminder: Stop Reading Tea Leaves; Start Mass Mailing

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Aug 23, 2017 5:57 pm

Aside from NY are there any other markets that someone without real ties could apply to/markets with bigger classes?




Return to “Legal Employment”

Who is online

The online users are hidden on this forum.