2013 Texas OCI (+all Texas firms) Forum

[Anonymous User]

Okay. I stand corrected. I guess, as far as Texas goes, it's not "HYSUT" just yet. For 0Ls, it is still a good school if you like Hogwarts-style societies, though.

To 0Ls: please do not choose UT over MVPB if you want Texas biglaw, unless Texas is free.[/quote]

As a current UT student who made that mistake, I second the advice given here. UT is NOT at a top-14 law school. Your opportunities are better at a real t14 even in Texas.

[Anonymous User]

Okay. I stand corrected. I guess, as far as Texas goes, it's not "HYSUT" just yet. For 0Ls, it is still a good school if you like Hogwarts-style societies, though.

To 0Ls: please do not choose UT over MVPB if you want Texas biglaw, unless Texas is free.

As a current UT student who made that mistake, I second the advice given here. UT is NOT at a top-14 law school. Your opportunities are better at a real t14 even in Texas.

Texas ties + T14 is a pretty sweet combo. Even if people don't think there's a significant difference between DNCG and UT, you'll face a LOT less competition. I'm assuming 90%+ of UT students are gunning for TX biglaw. For most T14s, students want NY/DC/Chicago/LA/SF almost exclusively.

And to the anon above: Sorry to hear about your experience. Did you take a larger scholarship to go to UT?

[Anonymous User]

Okay. I stand corrected. I guess, as far as Texas goes, it's not "HYSUT" just yet. For 0Ls, it is still a good school if you like Hogwarts-style societies, though.

To 0Ls: please do not choose UT over MVPB if you want Texas biglaw, unless Texas is free.

As a current UT student who made that mistake, I second the advice given here. UT is NOT at a top-14 law school. Your opportunities are better at a real t14 even in Texas.

Texas ties + T14 is a pretty sweet combo. Even if people don't think there's a significant difference between DNCG and UT, you'll face a LOT less competition. I'm assuming 90%+ of UT students are gunning for TX biglaw. For most T14s, students want NY/DC/Chicago/LA/SF almost exclusively.

And to the anon above: Sorry to hear about your experience. Did you take a larger scholarship to go to UT?

No reason to be sorry: I did indeed take a larger scholarship and with savings from before law school and working through law school, I'll graduate with around $20,000 in debt which is not bad at all. I've enjoyed my time at UT but the cold hard facts are just there that T14 is going to give a law student far better opportunities than UT. If I had to do it over, I would have went to a T14: had I known what I know now about job opportunities T14 v. UT. I bought into the hype that UT is as good as any T14...which just does not fit with the facts.

[Anonymous User]

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[Teflon_Don]

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[Anonymous User]

As a data point: SMU top 10%, LR, etc. 20ish screeners-->10 callbacks-->6 callbacks completed before accepting 1 of 3 offers and canceling the remaining 4 CBs.

Two observations: (1) people that brought something beyond a good GPA outperformed their rank i.e. work experience, engaging personality, etc. (2) I was surprised at the number of students at my school going into screeners without having done their homework on the firm. That's not to say that if you struck out it was because you didn't know the firms well enough. In a down market with an influx of T-14 students aiming for Texas, you can't count just on your class rank anymore, particularly at a school like SMU.

[Anonymous User]

I'm curious how IP candidates at UT fared? I am top 10% IP bro at non-Texas T-30 and ended up with offers from 2/3 of the Big 3.

[Anonymous User]

You guys are confirming my decision to have chosen HLS with my TX ties. I'm randomly looking at OCI threads and freaking out about getting no offered for biglaw in TX

1) People generally use no offer to refer to getting no-offered after an SA, which would be really shitty. I think you're talking about striking out. Odds are heavily against your striking out coming from HLS.

2) You'll very likely get multiple offers, including big 3 and national satellites, if you're interested in returning to TX. You have TX ties and go to Harvard, so you're in the best possible position to get an offer. Plus, you have an advantage that other T14 students like myself who are looking to get back to TX do not have: Lots of TX firms interview at Harvard in addition to the Texas schools. A couple of notable examples include Bracewell and Andrews Kurth. You can be below median and get these and other great firms. Coming from Harvard, you pretty much just need a good personality.

3) I'm not saying you shouldn't attempt to contribute to the OCI discussion, and I'm certainly not saying you shouldn't lurk. There's a lot of useful information in this thread that has been very helpful to me, and perhaps I'm overreacting here, but your post where you're "freaking out about getting no offered for biglaw in TX" seems a little insensitive to me when many of the anons are still scrambling for jobs and discussing their shortcomings from UT OCI. I'm sure others might not feel that way, and it's fair to be neurotic and freak out a year in advance, but popping in to say "glad I didn't go to UT like a lot of you people!" seems slightly counterproductive and perhaps inconsiderate.

[Teflon_Don]

You guys are confirming my decision to have chosen HLS with my TX ties. I'm randomly looking at OCI threads and freaking out about getting no offered for biglaw in TX

1) People generally use no offer to refer to getting no-offered after an SA, which would be really shitty. I think you're talking about striking out. Odds are heavily against your striking out coming from HLS.

2) You'll very likely get multiple offers, including big 3 and national satellites, if you're interested in returning to TX. You have TX ties and go to Harvard, so you're in the best possible position to get an offer. Plus, you have an advantage that other T14 students like myself who are looking to get back to TX do not have: Lots of TX firms interview at Harvard in addition to the Texas schools. A couple of notable examples include Bracewell and Andrews Kurth. You can be below median and get these and other great firms. Coming from Harvard, you pretty much just need a good personality.

3) I'm not saying you shouldn't attempt to contribute to the OCI discussion, and I'm certainly not saying you shouldn't lurk. There's a lot of useful information in this thread that has been very helpful to me, and perhaps I'm overreacting here, but your post where you're "freaking out about getting no offered for biglaw in TX" seems a little insensitive to me when many of the anons are still scrambling for jobs and discussing their shortcomings from UT OCI. I'm sure others might not feel that way, and it's fair to be neurotic and freak out a year in advance, but popping in to say "glad I didn't go to UT like a lot of you people!" seems slightly counterproductive and perhaps inconsiderate.

Thanks for the reply and I'm sorry I didn't mean to come off like that, my apologies everyone. Best of luck!

[Anonymous User]

What is the general consensus for how OCI is going in Texas? Specifically, how are your respective schools performing?

I am top 10% at SMU with LR and utterly failed at OCI. Received over a dozen screeners with very few callbacks and no offers. Ordinarily, I would say that I am just a dumbass but I know several other people in the top 10% that have also struck out. It would seem that our numbers are down from last year. How are UT, UH, Baylor, Tech, etc. doing?

Same situation. 15% LR at SMU/UHLC and I struck out. However, mass mailing has gotten me a few bites so I'm hoping one of those pull through.


Nice to know market is down (I guess?) this makes my ego feel better.

[Anonymous User]

Two observations: (1) people that brought something beyond a good GPA outperformed their rank i.e. work experience, engaging personality, etc. (2) I was surprised at the number of students at my school going into screeners without having done their homework on the firm. That's not to say that if you struck out it was because you didn't know the firms well enough. In a down market with an influx of T-14 students aiming for Texas, you can't count just on your class rank anymore, particularly at a school like SMU.

This is absolutely credited. One of the most successful individuals at my school (SMU/UH) was not top 10% and got something like 5 or 6 Biglaw offers. Personality and WE appear to be more important than grades ITE.

[Anonymous User]

What is the general consensus for how OCI is going in Texas? Specifically, how are your respective schools performing?

I am top 10% at SMU with LR and utterly failed at OCI. Received over a dozen screeners with very few callbacks and no offers. Ordinarily, I would say that I am just a dumbass but I know several other people in the top 10% that have also struck out. It would seem that our numbers are down from last year. How are UT, UH, Baylor, Tech, etc. doing?

So far as I can tell, OCI seems to be going well for those with offers and poorly for those without.

Cheesy but funny.

Problem is this year that there are very few offers going out. Many of the big firms in Texas have dramatically cut their classes this year. If you talk to CSO at UT, they will tell you that we have a *really* low offer rate from UT. Almost half the offer rate as last year.

Can anyone actually verify this? The firms I clerked at last summer (two Houston V50 firms) gave no indication that this summer's classes would be any smaller.

No. As far as I can tell it's crap. I've spoken with UT CSO and this wasn't what they said nor the impression they gave. Almost every summer class in Houston is larger than before (VE shrank ~10-15 iirc, largely because a number of partners/senior associates have left for other firms and they also previously had a huge summer class of ~50) and many firms are desperate for people. I even know of people on the IP side w/ ~3.0 (bottom 50%) GPAs that got Biglaw (personality and interesting WE).

As far as UT vs. MVP for Texas biglaw, I think it's a mixed bag. If you have clear demonstrable Texas ties (lived here for a major part of life, UG here, or worked here) then I think MVP make more sense. Otherwise, if you want Texas biglaw, I think you'll have a tough time convincing people at Texas firms that you actually want it. With that said, the firms definitely go lower in the class at MVP (I recall seeing VE regularly hiring bottom 50%-25% at Chicago in one thread) but i'm not sure how much lower. They may give screeners to many people below their GPA target but offer more limited numbers of CBs at those schools. I would say that, for me, UT was very generous with scholarships whereas the T10 was not. Considering that I would probably have had the same outcome from one school vs. UT, UT made sense in that it significantly limited my cost of school.

If cost is the same, I think MVP clearly make more sense. Given that they almost certainly aren't if you are making that decision, I would say UT quickly becomes the better proposition.

[Anonymous User]

I am top 10% at SMU with LR and utterly failed at OCI. Received over a dozen screeners with very few callbacks and no offers. Ordinarily, I would say that I am just a dumbass but I know several other people in the top 10% that have also struck out. It would seem that our numbers are down from last year. How are UT, UH, Baylor, Tech, etc. doing?

So far as I can tell, OCI seems to be going well for those with offers and poorly for those without.

Cheesy but funny.

Problem is this year that there are very few offers going out. Many of the big firms in Texas have dramatically cut their classes this year. If you talk to CSO at UT, they will tell you that we have a *really* low offer rate from UT. Almost half the offer rate as last year.

Can anyone actually verify this? The firms I clerked at last summer (two Houston V50 firms) gave no indication that this summer's classes would be any smaller.

No. As far as I can tell it's crap. I've spoken with UT CSO and this wasn't what they said nor the impression they gave. Almost every summer class in Houston is larger than before (VE shrank ~10-15 iirc, largely because a number of partners/senior associates have left for other firms and they also previously had a huge summer class of ~50) and many firms are desperate for people. I even know of people on the IP side w/ ~3.0 (bottom 50%) GPAs that got Biglaw (personality and interesting WE).

As far as UT vs. MVP for Texas biglaw, I think it's a mixed bag. If you have clear demonstrable Texas ties (lived here for a major part of life, UG here, or worked here) then I think MVP make more sense. Otherwise, if you want Texas biglaw, I think you'll have a tough time convincing people at Texas firms that you actually want it. With that said, the firms definitely go lower in the class at MVP (I recall seeing VE regularly hiring bottom 50%-25% at Chicago in one thread) but i'm not sure how much lower. They may give screeners to many people below their GPA target but offer more limited numbers of CBs at those schools. I would say that, for me, UT was very generous with scholarships whereas the T10 was not. Considering that I would probably have had the same outcome from one school vs. UT, UT made sense in that it significantly limited my cost of school.

If cost is the same, I think MVP clearly make more sense. Given that they almost certainly aren't if you are making that decision, I would say UT quickly becomes the better proposition.

Right, but you rolled the dice and won. You're in a better position as a 2L because you secured biglaw and took on less debt. I go to CCN and would absolutely trade places with you right now. But the real question to consider is how risk-averse you are. Going into 1L, would you rather take a larger scholarship offer and have a 33% chance at TX biglaw or pay more for a 75% chance?

A person with a full ride at UH who is top of his class might also suggest that he's in the best position right now (and he'd be right). Going into 1L, though, that wouldn't have been such a great argument because we don't know how we're going to perform.

Posts like these

Okay. I stand corrected. I guess, as far as Texas goes, it's not "HYSUT" just yet. For 0Ls, it is still a good school if you like Hogwarts-style societies, though.

To 0Ls: please do not choose UT over MVPB if you want Texas biglaw, unless Texas is free.

As a current UT student who made that mistake, I second the advice given here. UT is NOT at a top-14 law school. Your opportunities are better at a real t14 even in Texas.

make you think long and hard about going to a T14.

[Anonymous User]

any movement by Thompson Coe Dallas?

Offers going out now.

[Anonymous User]

any movement by Thompson Coe Dallas?

Offers going out now.

How did they contact you? Call/email/snail?

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know of anyone who interviewed with Sutherland. If so, any word?

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know of anyone who interviewed with Sutherland. If so, any word?

I interviewed with Sutherland a few days ago. They told me that they're interviewing for the next two weeks and that we should expect to hear back by November 1st.

[Anonymous User]

Can anyone speak for JW Austin's timeline?

[Anonymous User]

Can anyone speak for JW Austin's timeline?

At the beginning of the season, the committee was meeting on Wednesday and calling the same day. I received an offer in August about two weeks after an early CB and have since declined the offer.

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know of anyone who interviewed with Sutherland. If so, any word?

I interviewed with Sutherland a few days ago. They told me that they're interviewing for the next two weeks and that we should expect to hear back by November 1st.

Screener right? Hm... They have me a shorter deadline.

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know of anyone who interviewed with Sutherland. If so, any word?

I interviewed with Sutherland a few days ago. They told me that they're interviewing for the next two weeks and that we should expect to hear back by November 1st.

Screener right? Hm... They have me a shorter deadline.

Yes, it was a screener. They said within 2 weeks. They also told me that they are looking to hire about 3 summer associates, but there's also the possibility that they might not hire anyone at all!

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know of anyone who interviewed with Sutherland. If so, any word?

I interviewed with Sutherland a few days ago. They told me that they're interviewing for the next two weeks and that we should expect to hear back by November 1st.

Screener right? Hm... They have me a shorter deadline.

Yes, it was a screener. They said within 2 weeks. They also told me that they are looking to hire about 3 summer associates, but there's also the possibility that they might not hire anyone at all!

Wtf, well good luck.

[Anonymous User]

Did anyone interview with Pirkey Barber and if so have you heard back?

[Anonymous User]

Did anyone interview with Pirkey Barber and if so have you heard back?

Screener. Dinged within about 10 days of screener.

[Anonymous User]

What is this nov 1st deadline I keep hearing about?