Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

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Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:00 pm

Not sure whether to bid on 3L OCI. Bids are due tomorrow.

At a big law firm this summer. Last year, firmwide, offer rate was 97%. Put otherwise, of all the summer associates last year, only two were no-offered (according to NALP). I think my office offered to everybody last year. We have an unusually large summer class this summer, and they told us at the beginning there was room for all of us to get offers. I'm nervous that they were lying (I have no grounds to back up that assumption).

Mid-summer review was good - no critiques on my work product, said I was doing well, people wanted to work with me again, etc. Yet, for some reason, I have this neurotic feeling that I'm getting no offered. I probably read too much TLS.

We won't find out about offers until after our summer program finishes. My school's OCI is very early (the week of Aug. 5) and I may not have heard about an offer by then.

It's probably good to bid on 3L OCI, right? Just in case? Are other SAs bidding on 3L OCI?

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Jsa725
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Jsa725 » Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:03 pm

CYA, the prudent thing to do is BID... And happily cancel when you get offered a job.

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Flips88
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Flips88 » Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:17 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Not sure whether to bid on 3L OCI. Bids are due tomorrow.

At a big law firm this summer. Last year, firmwide, offer rate was 97%. Put otherwise, of all the summer associates last year, only two were no-offered (according to NALP). I think my office offered to everybody last year. We have an unusually large summer class this summer, and they told us at the beginning there was room for all of us to get offers. I'm nervous that they were lying (I have no grounds to back up that assumption).

Mid-summer review was good - no critiques on my work product, said I was doing well, people wanted to work with me again, etc. Yet, for some reason, I have this neurotic feeling that I'm getting no offered. I probably read too much TLS.

We won't find out about offers until after our summer program finishes. My school's OCI is very early (the week of Aug. 5) and I may not have heard about an offer by then.

It's probably good to bid on 3L OCI, right? Just in case? Are other SAs bidding on 3L OCI?

Have you talked with people at your firm about what type of people got no offered previously? When I've talked about it with first and second year associates they always say that when someone got no offered, everyone knew why. I feel like if you haven't had any indication that there's a problem with any aspect of your work or fit with the firm, then you shouldn't be worrying.

NYstate
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby NYstate » Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:23 pm

You should definitely bid. Should you not get an offer for whatever reason, you want to have been actively looking for jobs. A few people on this forum got severely burnt last year by waiting for offers that ended up not coming through. Never count on a job, particularly in law.

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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:34 pm

Flips88 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Not sure whether to bid on 3L OCI. Bids are due tomorrow.

At a big law firm this summer. Last year, firmwide, offer rate was 97%. Put otherwise, of all the summer associates last year, only two were no-offered (according to NALP). I think my office offered to everybody last year. We have an unusually large summer class this summer, and they told us at the beginning there was room for all of us to get offers. I'm nervous that they were lying (I have no grounds to back up that assumption).

Mid-summer review was good - no critiques on my work product, said I was doing well, people wanted to work with me again, etc. Yet, for some reason, I have this neurotic feeling that I'm getting no offered. I probably read too much TLS.

We won't find out about offers until after our summer program finishes. My school's OCI is very early (the week of Aug. 5) and I may not have heard about an offer by then.

It's probably good to bid on 3L OCI, right? Just in case? Are other SAs bidding on 3L OCI?

Have you talked with people at your firm about what type of people got no offered previously? When I've talked about it with first and second year associates they always say that when someone got no offered, everyone knew why. I feel like if you haven't had any indication that there's a problem with any aspect of your work or fit with the firm, then you shouldn't be worrying.


It seems like the people who get no-offered are ones who commit major faux pas, like hitting on attorneys or making really egregious racist/sexist/homophobic remarks, or for not being able to do the basic job of an associate. The 2009 class had a pretty bad offer rate, but that was due to the economy more than anything (at least, that's what the attorneys say). I certainly have not made any inappropriate remarks, and they told me my research and writing were good. The summer class is twice the size they normally accept, so in my mind that became a clear sign that they wouldn't take us all. I probably shouldn't be as nervous as I am, but I am a naturally nervous person I guess.

I really appreciate everybody's quick responses -- I think the right course of action is to bid just in case something bad happens. Hopefully I will be able to cancel my OCI interviews!

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Summerz
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Summerz » Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:41 pm

For a 3L what is the OCI protocol? You meet with the recruiter and at some point they ask if you have received an offer. You say that no decision has been tendered. What happens then….especially if no one is certain when a decision might be made.

This this certainly seems like an awkward situation for everyone.

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Flips88
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Flips88 » Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:It seems like the people who get no-offered are ones who commit major faux pas, like hitting on attorneys or making really egregious racist/sexist/homophobic remarks, or for not being able to do the basic job of an associate. The 2009 class had a pretty bad offer rate, but that was due to the economy more than anything (at least, that's what the attorneys say). I certainly have not made any inappropriate remarks, and they told me my research and writing were good. The summer class is twice the size they normally accept, so in my mind that became a clear sign that they wouldn't take us all. I probably shouldn't be as nervous as I am, but I am a naturally nervous person I guess.

I really appreciate everybody's quick responses -- I think the right course of action is to bid just in case something bad happens. Hopefully I will be able to cancel my OCI interviews!

Yeah, your anxiety is understandable. I'm sure i'll be a bundle of nerves in a couple weeks.

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Sheffield
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Sheffield » Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:38 pm

Summerz wrote:For a 3L what is the OCI protocol? You meet with the recruiter and at some point they ask if you have received an offer. You say that no decision has been tendered. What happens then….especially if no one is certain when a decision might be made.

This this certainly seems like an awkward situation for everyone.


Those are some damn good questions and I haven’t a clue on how to handle it if my offer was hung up in the limbo zone. Tricky at best. Sorry no advice here.

Peyton
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Peyton » Mon Jul 15, 2013 5:11 pm

Did anyone's SA end last week or is ending this week? How are things working out? Any thoughts on OCI participation, even if you were offered?

Morgan12Oak
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Morgan12Oak » Mon Jul 15, 2013 5:21 pm

Absolutely bid 3L if you aren’t sure. You never know and stories of no-offer and cold offers are incredibly underreported. At my T10 my 3L year, I personally knew of 3 people who were actually no offered/cold offered at firms with high offer rates, who told people they got offers, but weren’t “fit for biglaw” so they are looking for other things. I’m sure even at some of your firms, some of your colleagues will pretend they got offers/genuine offer to come back but mysteriously not come back full—time and go somewhere else.

Also, for those worried about cold offers. I do know one story of a guy who came back to the firm that cold offered him. He is now a 2nd year associate and nothing bad has happened to him – something to consider.

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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 15, 2013 6:03 pm

If I received an in-all-ways positive mid-summer review but just got an epic verbal beatdown from an associate for screwing up an assignment, how much do I worry, 1-10 scale?

Firm historically gives offers to summers.

Peyton
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Peyton » Mon Jul 15, 2013 6:11 pm

Morgan12Oak wrote:Also, for those worried about cold offers. I do know one story of a guy who came back to the firm that cold offered him. He is now a 2nd year associate and nothing bad has happened to him – something to consider.

I had heard that story too…. I thought it was urban legend. Is it uncommon for people with a legit offer to use OCI to try and move up (maybe for more money, geographic, etc.). And finally, when your SA firm offers you, do you say yes right then and there (and perhaps do a little Snoopy dance), or is there some other protocol in play?

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bk1
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby bk1 » Mon Jul 15, 2013 6:19 pm

Peyton wrote:I had heard that story too…. I thought it was urban legend. Is it uncommon for people with a legit offer to use OCI to try and move up (maybe for more money, geographic, etc.). And finally, when your SA firm offers you, do you say yes right then and there (and perhaps do a little Snoopy dance), or is there some other protocol in play?

It is uncommon in the sense that a low percentage of people who had 2L SAs w/ offers try to trade firms at 3L OCI. It is not uncommon in the sense that pretty much the only people who are successful at 3L OCI are those w/ offers.

You can say yes right away. You also generally have a time window in which your offer is held open (until Nov 1? per NALP guidelines).

NYstate
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby NYstate » Mon Jul 15, 2013 9:42 pm

Anonymous User wrote:If I received an in-all-ways positive mid-summer review but just got an epic verbal beatdown from an associate for screwing up an assignment, how much do I worry, 1-10 scale?

Firm historically gives offers to summers.


What did you do?

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:29 pm

Was out at an after party with 1 partner, 7 or 8 associates, and the rest of the summers in NYC a few weeks back. Took part in some flip cup and some other drinking games at the partner's insistence. Fell in the middle of the bar and ripped my skirt, am I getting no offered for sure or am I okay since the whole situation was ridiculous?

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Bronte
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Bronte » Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Was out at an after party with 1 partner, 7 or 8 associates, and the rest of the summers in NYC a few weeks back. Took part in some flip cup and some other drinking games at the partner's insistence. Fell in the middle of the bar and ripped my skirt, am I getting no offered for sure or am I okay since the whole situation was ridiculous?


This sounds like no big deal. Did anyone say anything to you about it?

AllTheLawz
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby AllTheLawz » Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Was out at an after party with 1 partner, 7 or 8 associates, and the rest of the summers in NYC a few weeks back. Took part in some flip cup and some other drinking games at the partner's insistence. Fell in the middle of the bar and ripped my skirt, am I getting no offered for sure or am I okay since the whole situation was ridiculous?


Almost certainly won't get a no offer just because of this

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:39 pm

A few comments about me being a little bit too drunk and some jokes, but didn't make any racist jokes or anything, and don't have too much of a sailer's mouth when I drink.

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:41 pm

Mostly just feel really dumb for getting a bit to drunk, but glad I didn't pull an aqua girl or makeout with or punch anyone

Peyton
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Peyton » Tue Jul 16, 2013 1:05 am

The reason some notable screw-ups won’t get you whacked is because the partner that is involved is not on the hiring committee. OTOH a minor irritating screw-up could be problematic if it involves a hiring committee partner. For that reason, not all similar screw-ups are equal.

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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 16, 2013 1:42 am

NYstate wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:If I received an in-all-ways positive mid-summer review but just got an epic verbal beatdown from an associate for screwing up an assignment, how much do I worry, 1-10 scale?

Firm historically gives offers to summers.


What did you do?


Wrote a really unhelpful memo on an area of law and a type of format/assignment with which I was unfamiliar, told it was completely not acceptable.

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mephistopheles
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby mephistopheles » Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:05 am

Anonymous User wrote:
NYstate wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:If I received an in-all-ways positive mid-summer review but just got an epic verbal beatdown from an associate for screwing up an assignment, how much do I worry, 1-10 scale?

Firm historically gives offers to summers.


What did you do?


Wrote a really unhelpful memo on an area of law and a type of format/assignment with which I was unfamiliar, told it was completely not acceptable.



were you given an opportunity to fix it or make amends with the associate?

mr.hands
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby mr.hands » Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:10 am

Anonymous User wrote:
NYstate wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:If I received an in-all-ways positive mid-summer review but just got an epic verbal beatdown from an associate for screwing up an assignment, how much do I worry, 1-10 scale?

Firm historically gives offers to summers.


What did you do?


Wrote a really unhelpful memo on an area of law and a type of format/assignment with which I was unfamiliar, told it was completely not acceptable.


What do you mean by really unhelpful? How long was it? Etc.

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alicrimson
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby alicrimson » Tue Jul 16, 2013 7:27 pm

One week and a half left. Getting antsy for offers. haha.

Stinson
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Re: Summer Associate: Thoughts, Anxieties, Experiences, etc.

Postby Stinson » Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:06 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Was out at an after party with 1 partner, 7 or 8 associates, and the rest of the summers in NYC a few weeks back. Took part in some flip cup and some other drinking games at the partner's insistence. Fell in the middle of the bar and ripped my skirt, am I getting no offered for sure or am I okay since the whole situation was ridiculous?


This is fairly standard drinking-at-a-party stuff, on the tame side really. Saw several such incidents my summer. No big deal at all. Keep doing a good job and you've got nothing to worry about.




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