What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

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redsox550
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby redsox550 » Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:58 am

I do not understand why anyone regardless of goals, regardless of grades , would choose to sit out of OCI if they had the opportunity to go

KidStuddi
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby KidStuddi » Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:45 am

redsox550 wrote:I do not understand why anyone regardless of goals, regardless of grades , would choose to sit out of OCI if they had the opportunity to go


It happens. Or at least it does at my school. We're entirely pre-select so I'm sure it's more common here than at schools that do lotteries.

KidStuddi
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby KidStuddi » Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:16 am

Lincoln wrote:
bhan87 wrote:http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=cornell&show=chars&sub=employers

8% Federal Clerkships
38.9% Firms with 101+ Attorneys

Around 46.9% is my guess.


Again, this is c/o 2011, which was ground zero for the job market collapse. As is the case at pretty much every school, it's improved significantly for the subsequent two classes, although I'd say it leveled off or even dropped a bit for c/o 2014.


Just came across this: http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog ... -2014.html

Big Law, More or Less (Number of graduates employed in law firm / total graduates * graduates employed in law firms consisting of more than 100 lawyers, full-time, long-term)
10. Cornell University 38.8%

Seems like the 2014 USNews is reporting employment data substantially lower. Normally I would say USNews is BS, but I can't imagine a school underreporting employment data to them of all places.

It should also be noted that Cornell did not make the "Elite Outcome" Top 10 either (biglaw+AIII), and #10 was at 51.3.

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BullShitWithBravado
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby BullShitWithBravado » Fri Mar 29, 2013 4:39 am

KidStuddi wrote:
BullShitWithBravado wrote:
KidStuddi wrote:Pro Tip: Google.com
http://www.lawschool.cornell.edu/career ... -Stats.pdf

Doesn't break down the data by firm size, but 75% of the 2L reported firm jobs last year.

Interesting to see that they actually release summer data. I wish more schools did.


Last year DeRosa told us that 80% of the class of 2013 who participated in AJF got Big Law. Looking at this graph, there's no way that that's right.


You're probably right, but to be fair, if a significant portion of your class self-selected themselves out of OCI (I assume that's what AJF is) because they had bottom 1/3rd grades or whatever, then the figures could match up.


Very few people don't go to AJF. The people who I know chose not to attend either wanted to work in a specific secondary market or only wanted to public interest. I would be surprised if as many as 15 people self-selected out of AJF though, since AJF is the reason why people choose to go to Cornell in the first place.

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Lincoln
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby Lincoln » Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:01 am

KidStuddi wrote:
Lincoln wrote:
bhan87 wrote:http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=cornell&show=chars&sub=employers

8% Federal Clerkships
38.9% Firms with 101+ Attorneys

Around 46.9% is my guess.


Again, this is c/o 2011, which was ground zero for the job market collapse. As is the case at pretty much every school, it's improved significantly for the subsequent two classes, although I'd say it leveled off or even dropped a bit for c/o 2014.


Just came across this: http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog ... -2014.html

Big Law, More or Less (Number of graduates employed in law firm / total graduates * graduates employed in law firms consisting of more than 100 lawyers, full-time, long-term)
10. Cornell University 38.8%

Seems like the 2014 USNews is reporting employment data substantially lower. Normally I would say USNews is BS, but I can't imagine a school underreporting employment data to them of all places.

It should also be noted that Cornell did not make the "Elite Outcome" Top 10 either (biglaw+AIII), and #10 was at 51.3.


The ABA data is more accurate:http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=206368, http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=cornell.

Edited to include link to updated LST profile.

09042014
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby 09042014 » Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:49 am

redsox550 wrote:I do not understand why anyone regardless of goals, regardless of grades , would choose to sit out of OCI if they had the opportunity to go


Many do OCI anyway. But there is no point. It's not like you can tell a firm, thanks for the offer, I'll let you know in March if I found my dream job. Firms hire before everyone else. So it's not a backup, it's the first option.

But even if you do OCI for "Backup" or "for practice" if you don't give it your all, you won't do very well.

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Arbiter213
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby Arbiter213 » Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:15 pm

This all jives roughly with what I'd expect. 2014 is probably something like 80%.

09042014
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby 09042014 » Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:18 pm

Arbiter213 wrote:This all jives roughly with what I'd expect. 2014 is probably something like 80%.


Which isn't to say 80% of students get a good outcome. Aiming for gov. and pi seems ends up in pure unemployment even with decent grades a large amount of time.

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Arbiter213
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby Arbiter213 » Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:22 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
Arbiter213 wrote:This all jives roughly with what I'd expect. 2014 is probably something like 80%.


Which isn't to say 80% of students get a good outcome. Aiming for gov. and pi seems ends up in pure unemployment even with decent grades a large amount of time.


For many, yah. Not counting clerkships, I can think of at least 4, if not more, people with government jobs for after graduation. I can't think of any PI that I know of.

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Lincoln
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby Lincoln » Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:11 am

I can think of two 3Ls with non-govt PI jobs. Generally, the people who apply for the Rhodes fellowship have something lined up but need funding.

Anonymous User
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:43 am

At Cornell, if you hustle, you can likelyget big law unless you have a major negative (really horrible grades as hustle won't cure a 2.9, interview like a drunk frat boy/sorority girl, tell the interviewer to fuck off, etc). But this requires not relying solely on just the August Job Fair.

I know 3 people who ended up with what I will consider Big Law jobs (meaning they pay north of $140,000). Two are in NYC, one in her/his home state on the east coast. Neither of the 3 got it from AJF. None of the 3 have a GPA above a 3.4. Take that for what it is worth. If you rely on Career Services to get you a job, your probability of being jobless rises. This goes for nearly all schools, not just Cornell. I'll leave Yale of that list because they are Yale.

That being said, I know of 3 people personally without Big Law who wanted it. One caught another job through hustle that is by no means a shit job. The other 2, still aren't hustling and jobless. If I know 3, there are likely more.

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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Mar 30, 2013 5:21 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
redsox550 wrote:I do not understand why anyone regardless of goals, regardless of grades , would choose to sit out of OCI if they had the opportunity to go


Many do OCI anyway. But there is no point. It's not like you can tell a firm, thanks for the offer, I'll let you know in March if I found my dream job. Firms hire before everyone else. So it's not a backup, it's the first option.

But even if you do OCI for "Backup" or "for practice" if you don't give it your all, you won't do very well.


I'm just one Cornell person who really half-assed it. My goal for OCI was to get a place that would let me split a summer between them and a PI org. I also worked at a PI org 1L summer. I'm not into doing biglaw work and wasn't going to put in a lot of effort but it just seemed crazy to not show up for three days of just talking to people for the chance of making 20k in 10 weeks. I definitely struck out really hard though haha.

Pokemon
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Re: What is Cornell's ACTUAL Big Law Rate?

Postby Pokemon » Sat Mar 30, 2013 5:59 pm

Anecdotally, at my t-14 which apparently has better employment stats than Cornell, 80% of people who wanted biglaw getting it, seems slightly too optimistic.
Also, here there is a lot of counting of people who got biglaw + people who did not want big law. Do not forget that a lot of PI/Gov-oriented people did OCI anyways and filled some of those biglaw sports.

If statistics say that about 65% of the class has AIII or Biglaw, and you know 20% did not want biglaw and did not get biglaw, it does not mean that the ratio of people wanting and getting biglaw is 65/80.
You discount out of that 65 people who did not really want biglaw. And then you conduct the division.




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