First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

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v20lawyer
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby v20lawyer » Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:40 pm

Objection wrote:
wiseowl wrote:Seriously Objection, wtf happened to you? You went from a pretty chill, fun, knowledgable person in the bar study thread last summer to an ugly, bitter misanthrope. It ain't flattering.


Just being honest about big law.

Hard to do that without sounding bitter.


Wait.. so you just took the bar this past summer and worked in biglaw for what, a few months at most? And I thought this couldn't get more ridiculous...

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Objection
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Objection » Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:47 pm

v20lawyer wrote:
Objection wrote:
wiseowl wrote:Seriously Objection, wtf happened to you? You went from a pretty chill, fun, knowledgable person in the bar study thread last summer to an ugly, bitter misanthrope. It ain't flattering.


Just being honest about big law.

Hard to do that without sounding bitter.


Wait.. so you just took the bar this past summer and worked in biglaw for what, a few months at most? And I thought this couldn't get more ridiculous...


Would you trust someone who escaped kidnapping after "a few months," or someone suffering from Stockholm Syndrome when it comes to the realities of what being kidnapped is like?

"Happiness as a big law associate is just another form of Stockholm Syndrome." -- A wise man (probably an ATL commenter though).

iconoclasttt
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby iconoclasttt » Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:52 pm

Objection wrote:
v20lawyer wrote:
Objection wrote:
wiseowl wrote:Seriously Objection, wtf happened to you? You went from a pretty chill, fun, knowledgable person in the bar study thread last summer to an ugly, bitter misanthrope. It ain't flattering.


Just being honest about big law.

Hard to do that without sounding bitter.


Wait.. so you just took the bar this past summer and worked in biglaw for what, a few months at most? And I thought this couldn't get more ridiculous...


Would you trust someone who escaped kidnapping after "a few months," or someone suffering from Stockholm Syndrome when it comes to the realities of what being kidnapped is like?

"Happiness as a big law associate is just another form of Stockholm Syndrome." -- A wise man (probably an ATL commenter though).


So, just to be clear, is your position that:

- All biglaw experiences are tantamount to "kidnapping";
- Any satisfied biglaw associate is necessarily deluded/lacks the capacity to objectively evaluate their circumstances;
- Your basis for evaluating the universality of biglaw experiences is your own tenure of several months?

Anonymous User
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:26 pm

Magic Circle first-year associate here. I haven't read anything after the first three pages, but someone was asking about what it's like having a family. I have a wife and kid and I'll give you a picture of what it's like.

I usually leave for work at 9:00 and get home around midnight. After reading some of the comments here, it appears that my hours are especially brutal. I have had a few lucky weeks (like 2-3) during the last 6 months where I have only billed 9-10 hours a day. Otherwise I bill 12-14 hours a day regularly. I have had a few weeks where I've billed nearly 100 hours in a week. And I've had a handful of 24+ hour days (true all nighters where there is no sleep). It all depends on what stage of the deal I'm on and how many deals I'm on at the same time.

As for the family, I see them on the weekends mostly. I see them normally for 20-30 minutes before I head out in the mornings. But this is while I'm shaving and eating breakfast. I have eaten dinner with the family at home less than five times during the last six months. I've tried to schedule lunches near the office but those have been cancelled due to last-minute assignments from seniors.

Luckily, I've only worked a few weekends. That means that most of my time with my family is on the weekend.

Hope this helps.

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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby wert3813 » Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:30 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Magic Circle first-year associate here. I haven't read anything after the first three pages, but someone was asking about what it's like having a family. I have a wife and kid and I'll give you a picture of what it's like.

I usually leave for work at 9:00 and get home around midnight. After reading some of the comments here, it appears that my hours are especially brutal. I have had a few lucky weeks (like 2-3) during the last 6 months where I have only billed 9-10 hours a day. Otherwise I bill 12-14 hours a day regularly. I have had a few weeks where I've billed nearly 100 hours in a week. And I've had a handful of 24+ hour days (true all nighters where there is no sleep). It all depends on what stage of the deal I'm on and how many deals I'm on at the same time.

As for the family, I see them on the weekends mostly. I see them normally for 20-30 minutes before I head out in the mornings. But this is while I'm shaving and eating breakfast. I have eaten dinner with the family at home less than five times during the last six months. I've tried to schedule lunches near the office but those have been cancelled due to last-minute assignments from seniors.

Luckily, I've only worked a few weekends. That means that most of my time with my family is on the weekend.

Hope this helps.


NYC? M&A?

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TTRansfer
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby TTRansfer » Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:35 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Magic Circle first-year associate here. I haven't read anything after the first three pages, but someone was asking about what it's like having a family. I have a wife and kid and I'll give you a picture of what it's like.

I usually leave for work at 9:00 and get home around midnight. After reading some of the comments here, it appears that my hours are especially brutal. I have had a few lucky weeks (like 2-3) during the last 6 months where I have only billed 9-10 hours a day. Otherwise I bill 12-14 hours a day regularly. I have had a few weeks where I've billed nearly 100 hours in a week. And I've had a handful of 24+ hour days (true all nighters where there is no sleep). It all depends on what stage of the deal I'm on and how many deals I'm on at the same time.

As for the family, I see them on the weekends mostly. I see them normally for 20-30 minutes before I head out in the mornings. But this is while I'm shaving and eating breakfast. I have eaten dinner with the family at home less than five times during the last six months. I've tried to schedule lunches near the office but those have been cancelled due to last-minute assignments from seniors.

Luckily, I've only worked a few weekends. That means that most of my time with my family is on the weekend.

Hope this helps.


If you can avoid working weekends, that's not the worst in the world. You get your 8 hours or so of sleep, too.

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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby seespotrun » Thu Mar 21, 2013 5:06 pm

Anonymous User wrote: And I've had a handful of 24+ hour days (true all nighters where there is no sleep).


Are you traveling across time zones while not sleeping during these 24+ hour days?

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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Mar 21, 2013 5:23 pm

seespotrun wrote:
Anonymous User wrote: And I've had a handful of 24+ hour days (true all nighters where there is no sleep).


Are you traveling across time zones while not sleeping during these 24+ hour days?


I think he's saying that the workday spills over into the next day. We have those occasionally in my current job, where you work from 9am one day till noon the next day, before you go home and shower and come back. I'd call that a 24+ hour day. I'd also call it brutal.

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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:29 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Magic Circle first-year associate here. I haven't read anything after the first three pages, but someone was asking about what it's like having a family. I have a wife and kid and I'll give you a picture of what it's like.

I usually leave for work at 9:00 and get home around midnight. After reading some of the comments here, it appears that my hours are especially brutal. I have had a few lucky weeks (like 2-3) during the last 6 months where I have only billed 9-10 hours a day. Otherwise I bill 12-14 hours a day regularly. I have had a few weeks where I've billed nearly 100 hours in a week. And I've had a handful of 24+ hour days (true all nighters where there is no sleep). It all depends on what stage of the deal I'm on and how many deals I'm on at the same time.

As for the family, I see them on the weekends mostly. I see them normally for 20-30 minutes before I head out in the mornings. But this is while I'm shaving and eating breakfast. I have eaten dinner with the family at home less than five times during the last six months. I've tried to schedule lunches near the office but those have been cancelled due to last-minute assignments from seniors.

Luckily, I've only worked a few weekends. That means that most of my time with my family is on the weekend.
Hope this helps.

This is really bad sounding bro. I have a buddy at Morgan Lewis who routinely sleeps at the office, but otherwise I don't know anyone who puts in these kinds of hours with regularity.

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Lasers
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Lasers » Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:51 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Magic Circle first-year associate here. I haven't read anything after the first three pages, but someone was asking about what it's like having a family. I have a wife and kid and I'll give you a picture of what it's like.

I usually leave for work at 9:00 and get home around midnight. After reading some of the comments here, it appears that my hours are especially brutal. I have had a few lucky weeks (like 2-3) during the last 6 months where I have only billed 9-10 hours a day. Otherwise I bill 12-14 hours a day regularly. I have had a few weeks where I've billed nearly 100 hours in a week. And I've had a handful of 24+ hour days (true all nighters where there is no sleep). It all depends on what stage of the deal I'm on and how many deals I'm on at the same time.

As for the family, I see them on the weekends mostly. I see them normally for 20-30 minutes before I head out in the mornings. But this is while I'm shaving and eating breakfast. I have eaten dinner with the family at home less than five times during the last six months. I've tried to schedule lunches near the office but those have been cancelled due to last-minute assignments from seniors.

Luckily, I've only worked a few weekends. That means that most of my time with my family is on the weekend.

Hope this helps.

damn, what do your billables end up looking like at the end of the year with this kind of schedule?! :shock:

Anonymous User
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:50 pm

Stupid question. 3L going to biglaw.

My best friend (3-year college roommate, best man @ wedding, godfather to my oldest son) works for a major commercial bank. He sends a lot of work to my firm, specifically to my office. He routinely works with a few partners and a handful of associates. Best to keep this connection private or allow him to say something?

Didn't come up as an SA because he worked for a different department and he was recently transferred back to my city. I haven't been assigned to a practice group yet, but I'm interested in the work we handle for his bank.

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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby lawsthetics » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:11 am

Objection wrote:
v20lawyer wrote:
Objection wrote:
wiseowl wrote:Seriously Objection, wtf happened to you? You went from a pretty chill, fun, knowledgable person in the bar study thread last summer to an ugly, bitter misanthrope. It ain't flattering.


Just being honest about big law.

Hard to do that without sounding bitter.


Wait.. so you just took the bar this past summer and worked in biglaw for what, a few months at most? And I thought this couldn't get more ridiculous...


Would you trust someone who escaped kidnapping after "a few months," or someone suffering from Stockholm Syndrome when it comes to the realities of what being kidnapped is like?

"Happiness as a big law associate is just another form of Stockholm Syndrome." -- A wise man (probably an ATL commenter though).


I've been lurking for a while but this dude is just too much at this point.

You worked in big law for 6 months, calm down.

My pops worked an 8/hr job standing all day while providing for a family of 4 in a high COL city. To make ends meet, he would have periods where his dreams would come true and work was busy enough that he would pull 8am-9pm days during the week and hop on for an extra 8 hour shift from 8am-4pm on Saturdays. That's over 70 hours a week, with only the hours after 4pm and Saturdays counting for overtime (time and a half). This brought him home 600$ in a weekly paycheck after taxes (...lmao). Sure, these were only periods at a time, but no different than periods at a time of such hours (if not a bit worse) in big law. Guess what the difference is?

Not trying to create some sob story here but I'm just illustrating the realities of life for those who are not nearly as fortunate as a vast majority of people who are born even into "middle" class. For you, working these hours may really hurt your chances to watch Super Bowl Sunday but you're getting 3K/week to put up with the hassle, as much of a drain as it is. Think about my example, and how you think big law is just so soul-crushing.

I see this type of attitude and I laugh, I really do. Time is important, of course big law will create problems for people trying to maintain a life outside of it. However, you're completely missing the point here. There is no other job where you come out of school making that much money, it's unreal. And there's plenty of jobs around that put in similar hours for half the pay (and as my example illustrates, well...chinese sweatshop labor for minimum wage). People do what they have to do to get by, and you're complaining about how you spent 6 months in big law raking in 3K/week and worked a lot of hours?

By the way, the first few months in big law aren't even that busy, you're getting settled in and you have to find your way before the onslaught starts a bit later. Did you even experience very many work weeks with such high hours in your extremely limited amount of time working there? Your entitled attitude is laughable, bet you were raised middle-upper class or you bought into too many TV commercials.

How you cope with big law will clearly be based on your prior experiences in life and the way you were raised. You wonder why some big firms don't like to hire rich kids from HYS, it's quite simple. They've been living life with a golden spoon and walk around the office like the firm should be honored to have them there. Eventually, they fizzle out and leave because they actually have to work hard. Objection shows a similar attitude, buddy, go work construction for 12 hours in 100 degree heat doing rooftops outside for 6 days a week and let me know how happy you are for your 12/hr cash wages (at least there's no taxes!).

TLDR:
You're severely over-estimating how bad big law is in comparison to the potential lifestyles people live in other professions, or in manual labor. Except, big law pays you out the ass for it. Entitled individuals like Objection can never understand this because they've been brought up thinking life is rosy and everybody should have a quality of life they desire while still raking in the big bucks. That's the American Dream! :)

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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby crazycanuck » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:22 am

Edit: wrong thread

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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Clearly » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:30 am

seespotrun wrote:
Anonymous User wrote: And I've had a handful of 24+ hour days (true all nighters where there is no sleep).


Are you traveling across time zones while not sleeping during these 24+ hour days?

This made me actually LOL

NYstate
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby NYstate » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:32 am

lawsthetics wrote:
I've been lurking for a while but this dude is just too much at this point.

You worked in big law for 6 months, calm down.

My pops worked an 8/hr job standing all day while providing for a family of 4 in a high COL city. To make ends meet, he would have periods where his dreams would come true and work was busy enough that he would pull 8am-9pm days during the week and hop on for an extra 8 hour shift from 8am-4pm on Saturdays. That's over 70 hours a week, with only the hours after 4pm and Saturdays counting for overtime (time and a half). This brought him home 600$ in a weekly paycheck after taxes (...lmao). Sure, these were only periods at a time, but no different than periods at a time of such hours (if not a bit worse) in big law. Guess what the difference is?

Not trying to create some sob story here but I'm just illustrating the realities of life for those who are not nearly as fortunate as a vast majority of people who are born even into "middle" class. For you, working these hours may really hurt your chances to watch Super Bowl Sunday but you're getting 3K/week to put up with the hassle, as much of a drain as it is. Think about my example, and how you think big law is just so soul-crushing.

I see this type of attitude and I laugh, I really do. Time is important, of course big law will create problems for people trying to maintain a life outside of it. However, you're completely missing the point here. There is no other job where you come out of school making that much money, it's unreal. And there's plenty of jobs around that put in similar hours for half the pay (and as my example illustrates, well...chinese sweatshop labor for minimum wage). People do what they have to do to get by, and you're complaining about how you spent 6 months in big law raking in 3K/week and worked a lot of hours?

By the way, the first few months in big law aren't even that busy, you're getting settled in and you have to find your way before the onslaught starts a bit later. Did you even experience very many work weeks with such high hours in your extremely limited amount of time working there? Your entitled attitude is laughable, bet you were raised middle-upper class or you bought into too many TV commercials.

How you cope with big law will clearly be based on your prior experiences in life and the way you were raised. You wonder why some big firms don't like to hire rich kids from HYS, it's quite simple. They've been living life with a golden spoon and walk around the office like the firm should be honored to have them there. Eventually, they fizzle out and leave because they actually have to work hard. Objection shows a similar attitude, buddy, go work construction for 12 hours in 100 degree heat doing rooftops outside for 6 days a week and let me know how happy you are for your 12/hr cash wages (at least there's no taxes!).

TLDR:
You're severely over-estimating how bad big law is in comparison to the potential lifestyles people live in other professions, or in manual labor. Except, big law pays you out the ass for it. Entitled individuals like Objection can never understand this because they've been brought up thinking life is rosy and everybody should have a quality of life they desire while still raking in the big bucks. That's the American Dream! :)


Do not assume that people leave biglaw because they are spoiled and don't want to work hard. You do not understand the sheer mental and physical fatigue that biglaw creates. Most people leave because they are exhausted. These are hard strivers who want all the stuff biglaw gives- but eventually most of those who leave break down.

You would be mistaken if you think the biglaw associates aren't filled with people who want to prove how hard and how much they will work. These are competitive people who want status and money. But they still simply can't handle it- at least not many of them can.

And I don't know a single biglaw firm who would refuse to hire a qualified Harvard student. Maybe if they completely fucked up there SA. But I have never heard of a firm saying: this bright wealthy socially connected Harvard guy is probably too lazy so we will give him a pass.

Also there are plenty of T6 grads who don't come from money . That is why this paycheck is so alluring that they are willing to borrow insane amounts of money just for a shot at getting a biglaw job. Of course, once you break it down per hour, you are really working two $80,000 fulltime jobs.
Last edited by NYstate on Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:34 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:32 am

v20lawyer wrote:
Objection wrote:
wiseowl wrote:Seriously Objection, wtf happened to you? You went from a pretty chill, fun, knowledgable person in the bar study thread last summer to an ugly, bitter misanthrope. It ain't flattering.


Just being honest about big law.

Hard to do that without sounding bitter.


Wait.. so you just took the bar this past summer and worked in biglaw for what, a few months at most? And I thought this couldn't get more ridiculous...

This.

6 months in I actually enjoyed having a job that had me cranking around the clock.... many associates do. You must have gone in with a pretty bad attitude, worked at a really awful firm or just really pissed someone off early on so you got treated really poorly. I get someone leaving after 2+ years.... you burn out, but who can't tough it out for 6 months? The sleeplessness didn't catch up to me until at least a year and a half in....and you were in litigation which is materially more predictable and steady than transactional work.

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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Pokemon » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:36 am

Earth to TLS: they do not pay you $3100 week so you can hang out with your buddies and watch TV. Not biglaw, not any other job that pays 3k a week to people who just bring their degree to the table.

By the way, has anybody mentioned how much of a first world problem this is. Oh the horror, I have to work really hard but only get paid twice or three times as much as the average American.

NYstate
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby NYstate » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:42 am

I agree with the points about salary and getting paid for your pain threshold , etc. What I hate is that people have so much debt just to even get a chance to get a job that will let them repay that debt. It is a completely fucked up situation. And the pressure of loans just adds stress levels.

As I said before if you can live without sleep, do error free work quickly under pressure, handle all kinds of stress and stay incredibly organized , biglaw could be your ticket to happiness.

The debt part which is creeping up to over $250,000 to $300,000 just to get a shot at these jobs is what seems so out of whack. I would never tell anyone to take that risk- but the paycheck is a big lure.

lawsthetics
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby lawsthetics » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:43 am

NYstate wrote:
Do not assume that people leave biglaw because they are spoiled and don't want to work hard. You do not understand the sheer mental and physical fatigue that biglaw creates. Most people leave because they are exhausted. These are hard strivers who want all the stuff biglaw gives- but eventually most of those who leave break down.

You would be mistaken if you think the biglaw associates aren't filled with people who want to prove how hard and how much they will work. These are competitive people who want status and money. But they still simply can't handle it- at least not many of them can.

And I don't know a single biglaw firm who would refuse to hire a qualified Harvard student. Maybe if they completely fucked up there SA. But I have never heard of a firm saying: this bright wealthy socially connected Harvard guy is probably too lazy so we will give him a pass.

Also there are plenty of T6 grads who don't come from money . That is why this paycheck is so alluring that they are willing to borrow insane amounts of money just for a shot at getting a biglaw job. Of course, once you break it down per hour, you are really working two $80,000 fulltime jobs.


I'm fully aware that big law winds up killing almost everybody a few years in, that's not my point. My point is complaining for the extent of time you are there about how truly awful it is...and not taking into account everything I mentioned above about doing the same without the money.

Even so, people have different attitudes, regardless of how smart all of them may be. Some can naturally handle a lot more based on past experience or how they were raised, making the few years they are there much easier to handle than others who are completely unaccustomed to dealing with such situations because they haven't done it somewhere else or haven't known anybody who has.

Objection stormed out and started firing off posts as if his 6 month stint is now the bible on big law experience and his subjective attitude (and consequently, his understanding and handling of his time there) is what people should generally abide by. Because anything to the contrary means the associate is suffering from SS...

It's just way over the top. Say what you have to say, alert people to your experience of how bad it was and generally is, and call it a day bro. This is quite possibly the best first world problem I've ever read. Oh noes, 3K/week no life for a few years. How horrible :(

NYstate
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby NYstate » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:51 am

Pokemon wrote:Earth to TLS: they do not pay you $3100 week so you can hang out with your buddies and watch TV. Not biglaw, not any other job that pays 3k a week to people who just bring their degree to the table.

By the way, has anybody mentioned how much of a first world problem this is. Oh the horror, I have to work really hard but only get paid twice or three times as much as the average American.

I thought people wanted to know the reality of biglaw. I thought we were trying to warn people what to expect because few 0Ls seem to understand what biglaw really means, no matter how great the paycheck looks from the outside.

But if you just want to start calling people with actual experience entitled and oblivious to how much the average american makes, then I don't have anything to add. I don't see why anyone else would bother to try to enlighten you as you seem to think you know it all already.

If you think everyone can hack it in biglaw - you are woefully mistaken. There is a reason most people get out as fast as they can. If you don't want to understand why, before you make a huge investment in that career choice, then go ahead and ignore everything in this thread. I'm sure you will have no trouble working 3 days with no sleep- how could that possibly be a negative? You will be making so much money! At least until your body starts to hit physical exhaustion, money can't really fix that problem .

NYstate
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby NYstate » Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:56 am

lawsthetics wrote:
NYstate wrote:
Do not assume that people leave biglaw because they are spoiled and don't want to work hard. You do not understand the sheer mental and physical fatigue that biglaw creates. Most people leave because they are exhausted. These are hard strivers who want all the stuff biglaw gives- but eventually most of those who leave break down.

You would be mistaken if you think the biglaw associates aren't filled with people who want to prove how hard and how much they will work. These are competitive people who want status and money. But they still simply can't handle it- at least not many of them can.

And I don't know a single biglaw firm who would refuse to hire a qualified Harvard student. Maybe if they completely fucked up there SA. But I have never heard of a firm saying: this bright wealthy socially connected Harvard guy is probably too lazy so we will give him a pass.

Also there are plenty of T6 grads who don't come from money . That is why this paycheck is so alluring that they are willing to borrow insane amounts of money just for a shot at getting a biglaw job. Of course, once you break it down per hour, you are really working two $80,000 fulltime jobs.


I'm fully aware that big law winds up killing almost everybody a few years in, that's not my point. My point is complaining for the extent of time you are there about how truly awful it is...and not taking into account everything I mentioned above about doing the same without the money.

Even so, people have different attitudes, regardless of how smart all of them may be. Some can naturally handle a lot more based on past experience or how they were raised, making the few years they are there much easier to handle than others who are completely unaccustomed to dealing with such situations because they haven't done it somewhere else or haven't known anybody who has.

Objection stormed out and started firing off posts as if his 6 month stint is now the bible on big law experience and his subjective attitude (and consequently, his understanding and handling of his time there) is what people should generally abide by. Because anything to the contrary means the associate is suffering from SS...

It's just way over the top. Say what you have to say, alert people to your experience of how bad it was and generally is, and call it a day bro. This is quite possibly the best first world problem I've ever read. Oh noes, 3K/week no life for a few years. How horrible :(


Like I said, I thought people asked for stories about biglaw so they would have insight to the lifestyle. You obviously are not interested in continuing the point of the thread. I'm not sure why you are trying to shut it down, though, as other people have expressed interest. Not everyone is willing to go into deep debt for the biglaw lifestyle.

lawsthetics
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Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby lawsthetics » Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:05 am

NYstate wrote:
Like I said, I thought people asked for stories about biglaw so they would have insight to the lifestyle. You obviously are not interested in continuing the point of the thread. I'm not sure why you are trying to shut it down, though, as other people have expressed interest. Not everyone is willing to go into deep debt for the biglaw lifestyle.


Hey relax buddy, I'm not trying to shut anything down. Thread is great, keep it coming. I'm just pointing out this isn't exactly indentured servitude with beans and rice as payment. For those with sticket debt, yes, that sucks...but they got the absolute best case scenario by getting big law. Now it's time to make the best of it until they are debt free, not sulk in pain and agony.

I agree though that this thread is the most important for the 0Ls, have to shatter the rose colored glasses that create the dreams that serve as the basis for taking out sticker debt.

NYstate
Posts: 1566
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:44 am

Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby NYstate » Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:14 am

lawsthetics wrote:
NYstate wrote:
Like I said, I thought people asked for stories about biglaw so they would have insight to the lifestyle. You obviously are not interested in continuing the point of the thread. I'm not sure why you are trying to shut it down, though, as other people have expressed interest. Not everyone is willing to go into deep debt for the biglaw lifestyle.


Hey relax buddy, I'm not trying to shut anything down. Thread is great, keep it coming. I'm just pointing out this isn't exactly indentured servitude with beans and rice as payment. For those with sticket debt, yes, that sucks...but they got the absolute best case scenario by getting big law. Now it's time to make the best of it until they are debt free, not sulk in pain and agony.

I agree though that this thread is the most important for the 0Ls, have to shatter the rose colored glasses that create the dreams that serve as the basis for taking out sticker debt.


I'm sure people will be thrilled to post so they can be told not to sulk.

lawsthetics
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:44 pm

Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby lawsthetics » Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:20 am

NYstate wrote:
lawsthetics wrote:
NYstate wrote:
Like I said, I thought people asked for stories about biglaw so they would have insight to the lifestyle. You obviously are not interested in continuing the point of the thread. I'm not sure why you are trying to shut it down, though, as other people have expressed interest. Not everyone is willing to go into deep debt for the biglaw lifestyle.


Hey relax buddy, I'm not trying to shut anything down. Thread is great, keep it coming. I'm just pointing out this isn't exactly indentured servitude with beans and rice as payment. For those with sticket debt, yes, that sucks...but they got the absolute best case scenario by getting big law. Now it's time to make the best of it until they are debt free, not sulk in pain and agony.

I agree though that this thread is the most important for the 0Ls, have to shatter the rose colored glasses that create the dreams that serve as the basis for taking out sticker debt.


I'm sure people will be thrilled to post so they can be told not to sulk.


I'm not referring to the associates posting, I'm reffering to students who may be entering big law with that debt who read this thread and can do nothing but prepare to enter that world. Which, judging by TLS' member base, is a large majority viewing this thread. Let's not derail it any further.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: First year at a big firm; brutal hours; like the job. AMA.

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:24 am

A couple of things:

(1) folks tend to post these family sob stories of backbreaking physical work for.minimal pay. These stories tend to underestimate how exhausting mental work can be compared to physical work. The brain is not a muscle. In addition, for people like us who have spent our entire lives being mentally stimulated, having to endure 12 hours of mindnumbing work can be far more of a grind than for a guy who has been laying bricks all his life. These comparisons may be imperfect, but that's precisely what I want to warn against: facile comparisons of fundamentally dissimilar occupations.

(2) Unless they are built differently from me, people underestimate how hard it is to go more than a few days with minimal sleep. It's a truly miserable state to be in. it affects your perception of everything. Think about our worst finals week, except you don't have the luxury of knowing that it wil be all over in a week. I had a hellish week during my 2L summer, and the thought of doing this week in week out despresses the hell out of me.




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