how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

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lawninja1
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how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby lawninja1 » Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:58 pm

I am a 1L at UMN. For those of you who don't know, UMN ranks students by quartile. I am currently in the middle of the second quartile. (above median).
I know I can push my grades higher this semester, hopefully I can make it to the top quartile.

What else can I do in the next year to increase my chances of getting a big law placement for the summer of 2014.

Anonymous User
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Mar 04, 2013 4:59 pm

bump

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cinephile
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby cinephile » Mon Mar 04, 2013 5:19 pm

Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.

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guano
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby guano » Mon Mar 04, 2013 5:53 pm

cinephile wrote:Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.

This, in this order*

*bidding well doesnt improve your odds that much but bidding bad can be ruinous

lawninja1
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby lawninja1 » Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:35 pm

cinephile wrote:Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.


How do you "bid well"? Any tips/advice on bidding?

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cinephile
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby cinephile » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:00 pm

lawninja1 wrote:
cinephile wrote:Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.


How do you "bid well"? Any tips/advice on bidding?


It really depends on your school, where you rank, where you have ties, and what firms are coming to your OCI (and their history with your school and people with your GPA/rank and how many slots they have in their summer program). Your CDO should be able to help you with this.

Full disclosure: I bid terribly. I took to heart the whole top 10% only need apply when maybe I could've gotten an interview there anyway - but, I didn't know because my CDO refuses to talk to students about bidding for some inexplicable reason (they don't want us to "game the system"). I'm assuming yours is better and cares about its students.

rad lulz
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby rad lulz » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:10 pm

lawninja1 wrote:
cinephile wrote:Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.


How do you "bid well"? Any tips/advice on bidding?

It's not gonna matter if your grades stay the same

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guano
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby guano » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:46 pm

lawninja1 wrote:
cinephile wrote:Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.


How do you "bid well"? Any tips/advice on bidding?
disclaimer: I did not do OCI (nor will I ever)

1) find out what GPA ranges the firms have for your school. Bonus points if you know the hard cutoffs
2) find out what impact any journal / moot court you're on night have (not the same boost for each firm)
3) don't bid anywhere you don't have demonstrable ties
4) talk to students who were similarly ranked during last year's OCI
5) bid realistically (go for firms where you're firmly within their ranges, don't waste bids on Hail Marys, etc)
Basically, do your research and don't suffer from special snowflake syndrome

peeonyou
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby peeonyou » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:57 pm

rad lulz wrote:
lawninja1 wrote:
cinephile wrote:Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.


How do you "bid well"? Any tips/advice on bidding?

It's not gonna matter if your grades stay the same

37.5% is screwed at UMN? Wow. Why does anyone go to a TTTT?

rad lulz
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby rad lulz » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:10 pm

peeonyou wrote:
rad lulz wrote:
lawninja1 wrote:
cinephile wrote:Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.


How do you "bid well"? Any tips/advice on bidding?

It's not gonna matter if your grades stay the same

37.5% is screwed at UMN? Wow. Why does anyone go to a TTTT?

You're not fucked, but big firms at OCI are pretty much out

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Ludo!
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby Ludo! » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:22 pm

guano wrote:
lawninja1 wrote:
cinephile wrote:Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.


How do you "bid well"? Any tips/advice on bidding?
disclaimer: I did not do OCI (nor will I ever)

1) find out what GPA ranges the firms have for your school. Bonus points if you know the hard cutoffs
2) find out what impact any journal / moot court you're on night have (not the same boost for each firm)
3) don't bid anywhere you don't have demonstrable ties
4) talk to students who were similarly ranked during last year's OCI
5) bid realistically (go for firms where you're firmly within their ranges, don't waste bids on Hail Marys, etc)
Basically, do your research and don't suffer from special snowflake syndrome


You did one semester in law school and you're going to give OCI bidding advice now?

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guano
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby guano » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:25 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:
guano wrote:
lawninja1 wrote:
cinephile wrote:Get better grades. Write on to law review. Bid well. Develop connections. Interview well.


How do you "bid well"? Any tips/advice on bidding?
disclaimer: I did not do OCI (nor will I ever)

1) find out what GPA ranges the firms have for your school. Bonus points if you know the hard cutoffs
2) find out what impact any journal / moot court you're on night have (not the same boost for each firm)
3) don't bid anywhere you don't have demonstrable ties
4) talk to students who were similarly ranked during last year's OCI
5) bid realistically (go for firms where you're firmly within their ranges, don't waste bids on Hail Marys, etc)
Basically, do your research and don't suffer from special snowflake syndrome


You did one semester in law school and you're going to give OCI bidding advice now?

Is anything I said wrong? I spent a significant amount of time learning everything I could about how to get an SA. Happy to admit if I'm wrong, but, that's what I picked up.

Edit: and I did preface by saying I don't have any experience. Bo was kind of hoping its get a conversation going

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thesealocust
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby thesealocust » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:32 pm

OP: Ge straight As this semester and/or build a time machine.

guano wrote:
Ludovico Technique wrote:
guano wrote:disclaimer: I did not do OCI (nor will I ever)

1) find out what GPA ranges the firms have for your school. Bonus points if you know the hard cutoffs
2) find out what impact any journal / moot court you're on night have (not the same boost for each firm)
3) don't bid anywhere you don't have demonstrable ties
4) talk to students who were similarly ranked during last year's OCI
5) bid realistically (go for firms where you're firmly within their ranges, don't waste bids on Hail Marys, etc)
Basically, do your research and don't suffer from special snowflake syndrome


You did one semester in law school and you're going to give OCI bidding advice now?

Is anything I said wrong? I spent a significant amount of time learning everything I could about how to get an SA. Happy to admit if I'm wrong, but, that's what I picked up.

Edit: and I did preface by saying I don't have any experience. Bo was kind of hoping its get a conversation going


What you said isn't out of left field generally, but none of it applies to somebody who goes into OCI with OP's credentials. If you're not competitive for big firm jobs in the first place, you don't have to worry about minutia like mis-bidding.

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Ludo!
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby Ludo! » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:32 pm

I don't know how good your advice is because I don't know what kind of system UMN has, I don't know how many employers they have coming and from how many different regions. But with OPs school and rank it's not likely that he's getting anything out of OCI anyway so not worth fighting about

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guano
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby guano » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:35 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:I don't know how good your advice is because I don't know what kind of system UMN has, I don't know how many employers they have coming and from how many different regions. But with OPs school and rank it's not likely that he's getting anything out of OCI anyway so not worth fighting about

All valid points. It's easy to forget that schools operate differently (hell, I tend to forget that 90% of this country even exists)

Anonymous User
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:39 pm

What were the cutoffs [for OCI purposes] set by big law firms last year for students from UMN law?

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thesealocust
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby thesealocust » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:42 pm

Anonymous User wrote:What were the cutoffs [for OCI purposes] set by big law firms last year for students from UMN law?


Well, the most recent graduating class only had about 10% getting big firm jobs, so it's safe to say if you're not in the top 10% you shouldn't count on something. Obviously some in the top 10% struck out or never tried for a firm, and some outside of the top 10% got big firm jobs, but 2L hiring is immensely 1L grade dependent.

Sauce: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 0204194047

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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:51 pm

The current 2015 UMN Law class is about 200 students. Top 10% will only mean that 20 students are "safe" for OCI purposes. Big law firms won't necessarily cut off all those after the top 10%, but the above poster is right. If you aren't in the top 10%, it's going to be a harder, but not impossible endeavor.

Big law firms are looking for students with top grades. But, sometimes, Good grades (3.5 GPA or above) + excellent interviewing skills (charismatic, relatable, personable) = Great grades + poor/awkward interviewing skills.

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cinephile
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby cinephile » Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:45 pm

If you're diverse in any sense, apply to and attend diversity job fairs. Also, are you IP eligible? Maybe you should register for the Loyola fair (I think today's the last day to do so).

rad lulz
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby rad lulz » Mon Mar 04, 2013 11:04 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:I don't know how good your advice is because I don't know what kind of system UMN has, I don't know how many employers they have coming and from how many different regions. But with OPs school and rank it's not likely that he's getting anything out of OCI anyway so not worth fighting about

Looked it up. 75% preselect, 25% lottery. Where OP bids won't matter past the first like 3 or 4 bids probably.

OP, just make good grades

Anonymous User
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:44 am

I'm going to come out and say try to make meaningful connections with law firms you are interested. Try Linkedin, post on groups, take a chance and write people. So much of TLS is blah blah blah grades blah blah lsat. Yes theses are important, but as someone who hit an SA position at a low end NLJ350 as a 1L I can tell you, ties matter. I am in the top third from a regional T2 outside my target market.

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Lasers
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby Lasers » Tue Mar 05, 2013 5:45 am

for a potentially borderline candidate such as yourself, besides upping your grades, your interviewing skills will decide if you get a biglaw job or not, imo.

sure law review would help, but the interview practically decides everything when it comes to the job hunt if your resume is good enough to get your foot in the door, but not great enough on its own to seal the deal.

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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Mar 06, 2013 9:07 pm

cinephile wrote:If you're diverse in any sense, apply to and attend diversity job fairs. Also, are you IP eligible? Maybe you should register for the Loyola fair (I think today's the last day to do so).


Thanks for the advice everyone.
how does being diverse help for law jobs?

I haven't heard of any diversity job fairs. I'll look into that. What is IP?

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Ludo!
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby Ludo! » Wed Mar 06, 2013 9:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
cinephile wrote:If you're diverse in any sense, apply to and attend diversity job fairs. Also, are you IP eligible? Maybe you should register for the Loyola fair (I think today's the last day to do so).


Thanks for the advice everyone.
how does being diverse help for law jobs?

I haven't heard of any diversity job fairs. I'll look into that. What is IP?


It can help in the sense of being eligible to go to diversity fairs. IP is Intellectual Property, do you have a hard science degree?

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cinephile
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Re: how to increase chances at big law for 2L internship

Postby cinephile » Wed Mar 06, 2013 9:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
cinephile wrote:If you're diverse in any sense, apply to and attend diversity job fairs. Also, are you IP eligible? Maybe you should register for the Loyola fair (I think today's the last day to do so).


Thanks for the advice everyone.
how does being diverse help for law jobs?

I haven't heard of any diversity job fairs. I'll look into that. What is IP?


Firms want to look diverse, and their clients want it too (at least sometimes), so they try to recruit qualified "diverse" candidates. But almost anyone can go to diversity fairs - like if you're female, LGBTQIA, have some sort of disability, etc. You should really talk to your CDO about this, but this site lists some of the job fairs you could sign up for last summer: http://law.duke.edu/career/interviewing/jobfairs/

And now I think you're too late for the Loyola one, but I guess if you don't know what intellectual property (IP) is, you wouldn't have been a good fit for that one anyway. Most are free to sign up for, and if they're not, your school might subsidize it for you. And might as well sign up and bid, see how many interviews you get, and then make the decision if you want to fly out.




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