Tax LLM

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rad lulz
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby rad lulz » Tue Feb 05, 2013 11:00 pm

Sans accounting or business background, I couldn't find any of the big 4 (or Grant Thornton etc.) that are looking to hire non LLMs in tax groups.

Anonymous User
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Feb 05, 2013 11:40 pm

Hattori Hanzo wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:For what its worth, I do not have a CPA or an LLM and I have been hired into a big 4 specialty group in a secondary market. The vast majority of the individuals in my group are lawyers, and the non-lawyers are very senior. My starting salary is also far greater than that of a CPA.


How much greater? I know a 2012 grad who went to E&Y tax at $80-90K base in DC. Non-LLM and no accounting background. Just want to get a general idea of the range.


That's the range.

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Hattori Hanzo
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Hattori Hanzo » Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:15 pm

rad lulz wrote:Sans accounting or business background, I couldn't find any of the big 4 (or Grant Thornton etc.) that are looking to hire non LLMs in tax groups.


Have you covered all the way down to super regionals? I know a couple of people without business exp. working in tax. One at E&Y and one at Moss Adams in CA.

The big 4 also hire JDs for non-legal positions in consulting.

rad lulz
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby rad lulz » Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:40 pm

Hattori Hanzo wrote:
rad lulz wrote:Sans accounting or business background, I couldn't find any of the big 4 (or Grant Thornton etc.) that are looking to hire non LLMs in tax groups.


Have you covered all the way down to super regionals? I know a couple of people without business exp. working in tax. One at E&Y and one at Moss Adams in CA.

The big 4 also hire JDs for non-legal positions in consulting.

Should have been more clear. UG business or accounting degree.

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Hattori Hanzo
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Hattori Hanzo » Wed Feb 06, 2013 4:51 pm

rad lulz wrote:
Hattori Hanzo wrote:
rad lulz wrote:Sans accounting or business background, I couldn't find any of the big 4 (or Grant Thornton etc.) that are looking to hire non LLMs in tax groups.


Have you covered all the way down to super regionals? I know a couple of people without business exp. working in tax. One at E&Y and one at Moss Adams in CA.

The big 4 also hire JDs for non-legal positions in consulting.

Should have been more clear. UG business or accounting degree.


That makes sense. I don't know how strong the market for tax LLMs in accounting firms is, but if it getting a tax LLM increases employment prospects significantly, it could be worth it even considering the extra debt. Also a note on big4 starting salaries, even though they are considerably lower than biglaw salaries, the bonuses are larger (25-30% in consulting). Also the first promotion can come as early as one year in, which adds another $10-20K to the base.

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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 06, 2013 6:43 pm

What is exactly the starting salary (w/LLM) at big 4?

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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:02 am

Anonymous User wrote:What is exactly the starting salary (w/LLM) at big 4?


No LLM, just JD here. Will start at EY/PwC (don't want to out myself). NY/LA/Chi, Low 100K+. So it's OK, and the hours are better.

Edit: non-accounting biz major in undergrad.

synergy
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby synergy » Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:23 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:What is exactly the starting salary (w/LLM) at big 4?


No LLM, just JD here. Will start at EY/PwC (don't want to out myself). NY/LA/Chi, Low 100K+. So it's OK, and the hours are better.

Edit: non-accounting biz major in undergrad.


What exactly does a JD do at a big 4?

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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:25 am

synergy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:What is exactly the starting salary (w/LLM) at big 4?


No LLM, just JD here. Will start at EY/PwC (don't want to out myself). NY/LA/Chi, Low 100K+. So it's OK, and the hours are better.

Edit: non-accounting biz major in undergrad.


What exactly does a JD do at a big 4?


Take care of the tax side of transactions. So basically tax+consulting.

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ManoftheHour
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby ManoftheHour » Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:50 pm

Anonymous User wrote:What is exactly the starting salary (w/LLM) at big 4?


I've heard that it's around 70-80k. You'd take care of some legal work but you also do a lot of consulting.

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ManoftheHour
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby ManoftheHour » Sun Feb 17, 2013 5:05 pm

On this subject, if one wants a career as a tax attorney:

-How much does where you get your JD from matter?
-How significant is having an accounting background?
-Is CPA certification useful to becoming employed as a tax attorney or is it just a waste of effort?

Sorry if any of these questions sound completely stupid. 0L here.

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nealric
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby nealric » Sun Feb 17, 2013 5:27 pm

On this subject, if one wants a career as a tax attorney:

-How much does where you get your JD from matter?
-How significant is having an accounting background?
-Is CPA certification useful to becoming employed as a tax attorney or is it just a waste of effort?


1. Extremely important. T14 or bust, but the better the school, the easier your path will be.
2. It's a plus, but not necessary
3. It's a plus if you are already a CPA, but it's not worth becoming one for the purposes of getting a tax position

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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:47 pm

ManoftheHour wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:What is exactly the starting salary (w/LLM) at big 4?


I've heard that it's around 70-80k. You'd take care of some legal work but you also do a lot of consulting.


Mine is 100K+, and I do not even have an LLM. I believe that big4 are trying to upgrade their tax law depts to compete with law firms.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Anonymous User
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:54 pm

ManoftheHour wrote:On this subject, if one wants a career as a tax attorney:

-How much does where you get your JD from matter?
-How significant is having an accounting background?
-Is CPA certification useful to becoming employed as a tax attorney or is it just a waste of effort?

Sorry if any of these questions sound completely stupid. 0L here.


Just to add

1. A good school is important. I believe that my T14 made things much easier.
2. Not necessary, but you should be well-versed in business/economics. You have to be the business-type person who can mix tax with biz strategies and numbers.
3. See nealric

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patrickd139
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby patrickd139 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:57 pm

NYU LLM student here. Echoing those posters above about not going to double down on job prospects. So many people are doing that here and it's not working out at all.

I also have a very good friend who is going to one of EY/PwC with no undergrad business degree, but with the JD/tax LLM combo. S/he's starting at $115k on the West coast in one if their M&A departments.

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IrwinM.Fletcher
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby IrwinM.Fletcher » Fri Feb 22, 2013 8:54 pm

I am impressed, I thought the Big 4 usually started JDs out sub-100k.

How common is it for someone to go Biglawl -----> Big 4? Or do the accounting firms usually like to groom their lawyers from the beginning?

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ManoftheHour
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby ManoftheHour » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:00 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
ManoftheHour wrote:On this subject, if one wants a career as a tax attorney:

-How much does where you get your JD from matter?
-How significant is having an accounting background?
-Is CPA certification useful to becoming employed as a tax attorney or is it just a waste of effort?

Sorry if any of these questions sound completely stupid. 0L here.


Just to add

1. A good school is important. I believe that my T14 made things much easier.
2. Not necessary, but you should be well-versed in business/economics. You have to be the business-type person who can mix tax with biz strategies and numbers.
3. See nealric


Assuming I can get into a T14 next cycle, what are the next steps to attaining such a job (other than good grades since that's probably a given for any good legal job out there)?

Thanks for the info so far btw.

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donzoli
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby donzoli » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:13 pm

Any idea what a JD + MBA would start out at at the Big4?

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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:23 pm

donzoli wrote:Any idea what a JD + MBA would start out at at the Big4?


I am sure it helps.

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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:25 pm

patrickd139 wrote:NYU LLM student here. Echoing those posters above about not going to double down on job prospects. So many people are doing that here and it's not working out at all.

I also have a very good friend who is going to one of EY/PwC with no undergrad business degree, but with the JD/tax LLM combo. S/he's starting at $115k on the West coast in one if their M&A departments.


Do you know what his hours are like?

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patrickd139
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby patrickd139 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:27 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
patrickd139 wrote:NYU LLM student here. Echoing those posters above about not going to double down on job prospects. So many people are doing that here and it's not working out at all.

I also have a very good friend who is going to one of EY/PwC with no undergrad business degree, but with the JD/tax LLM combo. S/he's starting at $115k on the West coast in one if their M&A departments.


Do you know what his hours are like?

Hasn't started yet, but I've heard they're going to be standard consulting hours (think biglaw light).

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donzoli
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Re: Tax LLM

Postby donzoli » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:34 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
donzoli wrote:Any idea what a JD + MBA would start out at at the Big4?


I am sure it helps.


Do they tend to negotiate much on salary?

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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:48 pm

donzoli wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
donzoli wrote:Any idea what a JD + MBA would start out at at the Big4?


I am sure it helps.


Do they tend to negotiate much on salary?


No, if it's just entry-level.

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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Mar 26, 2014 1:55 pm

Wondering if anyone here summered with the big 4?

I'm a 1L, interviewing with a big 4 national office soon and wondering if they do split summers? Is it normal that they are interviewing so early for 2L summer?

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Re: Tax LLM

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:23 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
ManoftheHour wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:What is exactly the starting salary (w/LLM) at big 4?


I've heard that it's around 70-80k. You'd take care of some legal work but you also do a lot of consulting.


Mine is 100K+, and I do not even have an LLM. I believe that big4 are trying to upgrade their tax law depts to compete with law firms.


I know it is 70-80k as entry level in major market (think SF/LA etc) but if you have prior experience or something, you can negotiate upwards.




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