Texas Scale vs. New York Forum

[Anonymous User]

I believe the OP is really asking about firms that pay NYC lock step in Texas, like Weil or Gibson Dunn, and those that do not, like Baker Botts. So COL isn't really an issue here.

Right, he was asking about a Texas office of a national firm. My impression has been that you'll get paid more as an associate at one of the satellite offices but you have a much better chance to make partner at one of the Texas firms.

I'd say this is an accurate assessment. However, when I went through the process, I came to the conclusion that, while the odds for partner are higher at one of the Texas Big firms, it is probably like 15% compared to 5%. That just wasn't worth it to me, so I chose the national satellite. It is almost certain that you will not be a partner at the firm you choose, either by your choice or their's, so I would just choose based on who you fit in best with. That is assuming offer rates for SAs are equal, which we all know isn't really the case.

[Anonymous User]

I think V&E at this point is much more of a national firm than the others. It pays NY scale all the way through, has offices all over the world, and recruits heavily from T-14 schools. I think I'd take it over the other big Texas firms.

[IrwinM.Fletcher]

Does V&E do deferred comp? Was thinking for some reason they do.

[Anonymous User]

Does V&E do deferred comp? Was thinking for some reason they do.

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Kind of makes me want to move to Texas... Could be nice to have a big house and a car!

[Citizen Genet]

This is interesting. I have heard the difference can be rather drastic. I believe (and could be completely wrong) that FJ, BB, AK, etc pay about 205-210 for a 6th year where a NYC step at that point would be 250k. This is a 40-45k difference (before bonus) and that is very substantial.

Just an FYI, under current tax rate schedules, NY state tax would be about $16,250 on that salary (filing singly or separately). In addition to that, if you live in NYC, there's an additional $9,000 in city tax that would be assessed on top of that. So the 40-45k difference turns into about a 15-20k difference all else equal. (All else equal is a bad assumption considering the, hopefully still to be around later, deduction of state income tax from federal tax. Even as a bad assumption, the difference won't be as drastic.) Considering what it costs to live in Dallas versus New York, even at the 6th year scale you give, you'll be getting way more bang for your buck in Dallas.

I believe the OP is really asking about firms that pay NYC lock step in Texas, like Weil or Gibson Dunn, and those that do not, like Baker Botts. So COL isn't really an issue here.

Woops. My mistake. Sorry about that.

At least you know that 250k in Dallas will mean way more than 250k would in NYC. Texas gov't FTW.

[BigLawer]

I believe the OP is really asking about firms that pay NYC lock step in Texas, like Weil or Gibson Dunn, and those that do not, like Baker Botts. So COL isn't really an issue here.

Right, he was asking about a Texas office of a national firm. My impression has been that you'll get paid more as an associate at one of the satellite offices but you have a much better chance to make partner at one of the Texas firms.

I'd say this is an accurate assessment. However, when I went through the process, I came to the conclusion that, while the odds for partner are higher at one of the Texas Big firms, it is probably like 15% compared to 5%. That just wasn't worth it to me, so I chose the national satellite. It is almost certain that you will not be a partner at the firm you choose, either by your choice or their's, so I would just choose based on who you fit in best with. That is assuming offer rates for SAs are equal, which we all know isn't really the case.

I am guessing that you are talking about Dallas as the national offices are much more relevant than in Houston with the Big 3 plus AK and BG being based in Houston.

Do you feel that taking this national firm in Dallas over a Dallas based firm (like Haynes and Boone) was a good idea in regards to exit options? Or a Big 3 in Dallas, even though based in Houston, still have a huge name in Texas. Would love to hear your insight.

[Anonymous User]

I believe the OP is really asking about firms that pay NYC lock step in Texas, like Weil or Gibson Dunn, and those that do not, like Baker Botts. So COL isn't really an issue here.

Right, he was asking about a Texas office of a national firm. My impression has been that you'll get paid more as an associate at one of the satellite offices but you have a much better chance to make partner at one of the Texas firms.

I'd say this is an accurate assessment. However, when I went through the process, I came to the conclusion that, while the odds for partner are higher at one of the Texas Big firms, it is probably like 15% compared to 5%. That just wasn't worth it to me, so I chose the national satellite. It is almost certain that you will not be a partner at the firm you choose, either by your choice or their's, so I would just choose based on who you fit in best with. That is assuming offer rates for SAs are equal, which we all know isn't really the case.

I am guessing that you are talking about Dallas as the national offices are much more relevant than in Houston with the Big 3 plus AK and BG being based in Houston.

Do you feel that taking this national firm in Dallas over a Dallas based firm (like Haynes and Boone) was a good idea in regards to exit options? Or a Big 3 in Dallas, even though based in Houston, still have a huge name in Texas. Would love to hear your insight.

Quoted Anon: That's a great question, and one that I asked myself many times last fall, as I was choosing between a National Sat and 2 of the Texas Big 3. To be honest, I probably won't be able to give you an accurate answer for 5-7 years. I asked people I trust in the legal field and they thought the exit options would be a wash, but I understand they could be wrong. FWIW, I still have second thoughts every once in awhile (but those can quickly be squashed with a stiff drink). In the end, I just felt like the National firm was more of a fit, and since partnership chances/exit options 7-10 years out are so difficult to predict, I just went with my gut.

[005618502]

The above seems to be the consensus. It is hard to really tell. I will say I have heard that Haynes and Boone (for example since their HQ is in Dallas) has amazing exit options since they are primarily there and so are many of their clients. Also, I dont know if this is true, but I have heard Dallas is home to more F500 companies than any city besides NYC