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PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:21 pm
by anon168
If the thought never occurred to you (and it certainly never has for me, to be honest) it doesn't hurt to send a thank you note to those that you interviewed with even if they rejected you.

I've never been a big proponent of "thank you notes" -- either by snail mail or e-mail, but after having received a few in the past couple of weeks, it certainly doesn't hurt and one actually led to an additional interview (because of unforeseen circumstances an additional spot opened up for the summer program).

One more of way of keeping your name on the radar screen.

Just FYI.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:27 pm
by Anonymous User
anon168 wrote:If the thought never occurred to you (and it certainly never has for me, to be honest) it doesn't hurt to send a thank you note to those that you interviewed with even if they rejected you.

I've never been a big proponent of "thank you notes" -- either by snail mail or e-mail, but after having received a few in the past couple of weeks, it certainly doesn't hurt and one actually led to an additional interview (because of unforeseen circumstances an additional spot opened up for the summer program).

One more of way of keeping your name on the radar screen.

Just FYI.


So you do mean send another thank you note even after the rejection letter arrives?

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 11:39 am
by Gorki
TCR is to send thank-you notes immediately after the day of interview (either that same day, or if necessary the next morning). Sending them after a rejection would be awkward imo... Sending them near 2.5-3 months after OCI seems like it would either totally confuse people, or at best be super awkward.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 6:59 pm
by NotMyRealName09
If I recieved this sort of note- a post rejection thank you - it would creep me out and make me wonder if this thankful person is also waiting in the bushes outside work to thank me personally with a knife.

It's like sending a thank you note to the girl who just rejected your request for a date thanking her for the opportunity to smell her that one time. You wouldn't do that, and if you did, a TRO would be in your future.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 2:28 pm
by Agent
Post-rejection thank you notes seem like a good idea to me, assuming (1) they are not too soon after an initial thank you note and (2) they are tactful. This especially applies to 1L interviewees who might like to reapply with a firm for a 2L SA gig.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 2:38 pm
by thesealocust
Agent wrote:Post-rejection thank you notes seem like a good idea to me, assuming (1) they are not too soon after an initial thank you note and (2) they are tactful. This especially applies to 1L interviewees who might like to reapply with a firm for a 2L SA gig.


No.

You can sit there come up with an argument for why it could be a good idea, but it's not standard protocol and it's very, very odd.

At most firms there's some group in charge of handling incoming application materials, but the decision on who to hire comes down to a group of lawyers - some combination of a hiring committee and those who you meet with if you make it to a callback. None of them are going to be impressed by contact like that after they rejected you. The legal hiring market is abysmal, there's no credit for desire or persistence.

Best case scenario, your post-rejection correspondence winds up in the void and not seen by anyone who can help hire you. Worst case scenario, it comes across as passive aggressive / weird / off-putting / flags you as somebody who clearly doesn't understand normal business protocol.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 2:48 pm
by Agent
Understood about it being unusual. I still feel it's worth the potential upside. Though I will add that I'm thinking of a very brief "thank you for your consideration" email to recruiting, not multiple cards or emails to interviewers.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 3:59 pm
by 20160810
thesealocust wrote:
Agent wrote:Post-rejection thank you notes seem like a good idea to me, assuming (1) they are not too soon after an initial thank you note and (2) they are tactful. This especially applies to 1L interviewees who might like to reapply with a firm for a 2L SA gig.


No.

You can sit there come up with an argument for why it could be a good idea, but it's not standard protocol and it's very, very odd.

At most firms there's some group in charge of handling incoming application materials, but the decision on who to hire comes down to a group of lawyers - some combination of a hiring committee and those who you meet with if you make it to a callback. None of them are going to be impressed by contact like that after they rejected you. The legal hiring market is abysmal, there's no credit for desire or persistence.

Best case scenario, your post-rejection correspondence winds up in the void and not seen by anyone who can help hire you. Worst case scenario, it comes across as passive aggressive / weird / off-putting / flags you as somebody who clearly doesn't understand normal business protocol.

I agree with this. At the firm where I summered, some rejected applicants actually sent these kinds of notes, and how weird that was was a topic of conversation once among a few of the attorneys. Once you get rejected, just move on. Sending a post-rejection thank-you note to a law firm is like giving your ex-girlfriend a post-break-up 3-a.m. garbage-rummaging: No matter how tatful you are, she's still going to call the cops.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 7:56 pm
by MinEMorris
I think who the note is coming from can't be ignored-- if I was receiving the thank you note, context would really matter. If it was the kid that wouldn't release eye contact and drooled and murmured to himself who sent me the post-rejection thank you note, I might be concerned. If it was someone that I enjoyed talking to and I thought came off as an overall mature and competent person but just not quite what we were looking for, getting a post-rejection thank you note would honestly come across to me as communicating that the person was poised, doesn't get butthurt too easily, and has some class.

I don't mean to get pushy on the topic, but I can't help but believe that if you get disconcerted by someone who takes the time to write you a short but sincere thank you note for taking the time to interview them, it's you who has the problem, not them. In my mind, the better analogy is not rummaging through your girlfriend's garbage after a breakup, but rather sending her a short text or e-mail simply to thank her for the time you spent together and what she invested in the relationship (needless to say, job interviewing and relationships don't compare well). Bottom line is that if it's executed tastefully and you aren't an awkward person to begin with, I think you're more likely to impress than disturb.

All of that said, I think if you already wrote a thank you note, it's simply redundant to send another post-rejection. If you didn't get around to it and get canned a week later, I think it's fair game and really won't hurt you to write one (what're they going to do, reject you again?).

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 8:20 pm
by 20160810
MinEMorris wrote:I think who the note is coming from can't be ignored-- if I was receiving the thank you note, context would really matter. If it was the kid that wouldn't release eye contact and drooled and murmured to himself who sent me the post-rejection thank you note, I might be concerned. If it was someone that I enjoyed talking to and I thought came off as an overall mature and competent person but just not quite what we were looking for, getting a post-rejection thank you note would honestly come across to me as communicating that the person was poised, doesn't get butthurt too easily, and has some class.

I don't mean to get pushy on the topic, but I can't help but believe that if you get disconcerted by someone who takes the time to write you a short but sincere thank you note for taking the time to interview them, it's you who has the problem, not them. In my mind, the better analogy is not rummaging through your girlfriend's garbage after a breakup, but rather sending her a short text or e-mail simply to thank her for the time you spent together and what she invested in the relationship (needless to say, job interviewing and relationships don't compare well). Bottom line is that if it's executed tastefully and you aren't an awkward person to begin with, I think you're more likely to impress than disturb.

All of that said, I think if you already wrote a thank you note, it's simply redundant to send another post-rejection. If you didn't get around to it and get canned a week later, I think it's fair game and really won't hurt you to write one (what're they going to do, reject you again?).

This is the thing. It just isn't going to be sincere. You're not seriously so gracious they didn't hire you that you felt compelled to hit up the stationery shop. No way can this come across sincere.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 8:23 pm
by thesealocust
The thing about weird things people do in business/hiring is that they're not unheard of or completely inexplicable - they're just rare. Some people do them, and everyone else makes fun of them.

Choose which side of that line you want to be on when deciding how to handle rejections from firms.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 8:26 pm
by MinEMorris
admittedly, that's a good point. I've never written a post-rejection thank you note, but now it is dawning on me how very hard it would be to write anything beyond two lines that came off as sincere.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:48 pm
by Agent
I've never tried this either, and I don't mean to press the issue, but this is a pretty interesting discussion. It does occur to me that there's no need to write more than two lines. "Dear Recruiter: Thanks again for considering my application. I enjoyed meeting everyone. Best, Rejected Applicant."

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:52 pm
by thesealocust
You could save yourself the time expense of sending the letter and just call the recruiter shouting "I AM BAD AT FIGURING OUT SOCIAL NORMS"?

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:55 pm
by Agent
Dear thesealocust:

Thanks again for considering my perspective. I enjoyed the discussion.

Best,
Agent

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:27 pm
by 20160810
thesealocust wrote:You could save yourself the time expense of sending the letter and just call the recruiter shouting "I AM BAD AT FIGURING OUT SOCIAL NORMS"?

Or texting dick pix to everyone on the hiring committee.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:09 am
by Pokemon
SBL wrote:
thesealocust wrote:You could save yourself the time expense of sending the letter and just call the recruiter shouting "I AM BAD AT FIGURING OUT SOCIAL NORMS"?

Or texting dick pix to everyone on the hiring committee.


Since when is this something that society frowns upon?
The message that you will be sending to the firm is that you have nothing to hide. Nothing wrong with that.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:09 pm
by Anonymous User
Actually, what I did was send a few e-mails to recruiters at the firms and asking them if they could discuss with me the weaknesses in my application. I framed it as "thank you for giving me a callback interview, i enjoyed the experience a lot, and maybe you can give me some pointers for improvement." I did this for two firms, and both firms' hiring partners called me to discuss the details. They were very nice about it, and one firm even gave me a few contacts at other firms in the geographic market.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:22 pm
by cinephile
Anonymous User wrote:Actually, what I did was send a few e-mails to recruiters at the firms and asking them if they could discuss with me the weaknesses in my application. I framed it as "thank you for giving me a callback interview, i enjoyed the experience a lot, and maybe you can give me some pointers for improvement." I did this for two firms, and both firms' hiring partners called me to discuss the details. They were very nice about it, and one firm even gave me a few contacts at other firms in the geographic market.


Can I ask what kind of advice they gave?

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 4:00 pm
by Anonymous User
One of them suggested that I work on my interview confidence, as I scored well on likeability. They just wanted to see more aggression. The other felt that I wasn't interested enough in their geographic location (i guess i subliminally telegraphed my true feelings).

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:23 pm
by cinephile
Anonymous User wrote:One of them suggested that I work on my interview confidence, as I scored well on likeability. They just wanted to see more aggression. The other felt that I wasn't interested enough in their geographic location (i guess i subliminally telegraphed my true feelings).


That's really interesting. I wish career services would teach a course on interview aggression.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:52 pm
by 20160810
cinephile wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:One of them suggested that I work on my interview confidence, as I scored well on likeability. They just wanted to see more aggression. The other felt that I wasn't interested enough in their geographic location (i guess i subliminally telegraphed my true feelings).


That's really interesting. I wish career services would teach a course on interview aggression.

As a general tip, when they ask if you have any questions about the firm, you should stand up, whip out your presumptively gigantic balls, swing them across the desk knocking off all the papers thereupon, and yell that you like to take the bull by the motherfucking HORNS, and your question is whether they have a goddamn problem with that.

Re: PSA for those who got rejected at OCI and/or biglaw

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 7:32 am
by Scuppers
Lol