drop out?

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Anonymous User
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drop out?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:30 pm

MVP. Above top-half, below top-third.

I have multiple offers from from firms in secondary markets, but no big law offers.

I have a 3 kids and have to take out 90k/yr. in loans. So my debt will be around 270k. These offers pay between 80-100k/year but there's low cost of living. I don't love the law but I don't hate it. If I drop out now I'll have around 120k in debt. I was a philosophy major from a decent school with okay (but not impressive) work experience. I have no idea what I'd do if I dropped out.

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bk1
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Re: drop out?

Postby bk1 » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:32 pm

Do you have a SO? If yes, will they/are they helping financially?

Anonymous User
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Re: drop out?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:34 pm

bk1 wrote:Do you have a SO? If yes, will they/are they helping financially?


I have a SO, but she is not going to work until the kids are in school. She really wants to be home with them and I support that. So I'd be the sole income earner for at least the first 4 years out of law school.

Also, I do not like the city my offers are in. My wife "likes it okay."

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Cardboardbox
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Re: drop out?

Postby Cardboardbox » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:35 pm

You have no solid backup plan and already accumulated a sizable loan. It may not be big law, but it sounds like you have multiple opportunities for great jobs with even greater growth potential.

If you drop out now, can you realistically see yourself in a position within the next two years making as much as you would be if you pursue one of these opportunities? Because considering your degree it seems like the answer would be no quite frankly.

Pokemon
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Re: drop out?

Postby Pokemon » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:36 pm

I think you should stay since you do not seem to have another job to return to. In this economy you might end up being unemployed for some time.

Additionally, you do not have the choice of spending 270K for an 80-100k job.
Your option is that of spending 150K for 80-100K job. That is not a bad deal at this point. I would have though differently if you were not already 120K in, but you are. In my humble opinion, 80-100k job is not what most people at this forum aim at, but it is not at all a bad starting wage for the majority of the country to be in.
Can you do IBR with that wage?

09042014
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Re: drop out?

Postby 09042014 » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:39 pm

1) If you are taking out 90K a year, you are looking at more like 300K at graduation. Tyranny of the 8% bro.

2) 300K at 8% is what? 26K a year for 30 years. As long as you make like 40K more than you otherwise would, you are probably better off as a lawyer. That number shrinks if you can manage doing the 10 year repayment plan.

Do the IBR like the person below says.
Last edited by 09042014 on Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Anonymous User
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Re: drop out?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:44 pm

Pokemon wrote:I think you should stay since you do not seem to have another job to return to. In this economy you might end up being unemployed for some time.

Additionally, you do not have the choice of spending 270K for an 80-100k job.
Your option is that of spending 150K for 80-100K job. That is not a bad deal at this point. I would have though differently if you were not already 120K in, but you are. In my humble opinion, 80-100k job is not what most people at this forum aim at, but it is not at all a bad starting wage for the majority of the country to be in.
Can you do IBR with that wage?


I'll need to meet with my financial aid people to talk about IBR. I don't know if I qualify.

09042014
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Re: drop out?

Postby 09042014 » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Pokemon wrote:I think you should stay since you do not seem to have another job to return to. In this economy you might end up being unemployed for some time.

Additionally, you do not have the choice of spending 270K for an 80-100k job.
Your option is that of spending 150K for 80-100K job. That is not a bad deal at this point. I would have though differently if you were not already 120K in, but you are. In my humble opinion, 80-100k job is not what most people at this forum aim at, but it is not at all a bad starting wage for the majority of the country to be in.
Can you do IBR with that wage?


I'll need to meet with my financial aid people to talk about IBR. I don't know if I qualify.


You probably do actually. You'll pay like 775 bucks a month for 25 years. Which is WAY less your total debt.

The only downside is a potential tax bomb at the end. When they wipe out 300K of your debt in 25 years, you'll get a tax bill for like 100K. So I'd say using conservative investments for that date. There is hope congress fixes it, but nobody is sure. Best case, you have a college fund.

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sunynp
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Re: drop out?

Postby sunynp » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:50 pm

At least you have offers and a place to build from which is better than many people have.

You don't have to talk to financial aid to see about IBR - you can use an IBR financial aid calculator.

Here is an example, but there are others:

http://www.ibrinfo.org/calculator.php

I would be shocked if you don't qualify for IBR with a family of 5 people. Do you have family money or other resources?

Anonymous User
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Re: drop out?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:57 pm

sunynp wrote:Do you have family money or other resources?


Nope. Child labor.

Pokemon
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Re: drop out?

Postby Pokemon » Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:04 pm

Can you overpay IBR in order to keep debt low. Meaning you are asked to pay 15% of income, 15K, but OP might be able to afford to pay more than that, thus paying it off before the "tax bomb". He basically will have to pay 24K for it not to increase. Hard the first year, but with raises at work, and his wife starting work after a few years, it will be feasible to really cut that debt before 25 years pass.

KidStuddi
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Re: drop out?

Postby KidStuddi » Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:10 pm

I don't much understand how this is a serious question. I too have a philosophy degree. I was able to make about 50k a year between undergrad and law school, but I was always told that I drastically outperformed my degree. If your plan is to drop out and just make a career with your bachelors, what have you done previously with your philosophy degree that leads you to believe you could conceivably earn anything approaching 100k with it anytime soon? You sound like you were biglaw or bust, so I'm assuming your primary concern here is money. If that's the case, isn't the choice here essentially continue on in law school or go do some other graduate/professional degree?

If you're going back to school, won't that necessitate more years living on loans, given that the earliest you'd probably be able to even start such a program is next fall and they're probably all 2 years? Also, outside of medicine and maybe elite business schools, what else would you study where you think you would be able to land a job paying more than 100K in a low CoL area?

Anonymous User
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Re: drop out?

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:38 pm

If you are the sole earner for your family, it'd be irresponsible to drop out with no other plan. The fact that you say you have no idea what you'd do makes it seem like you're just looking for people to tell you to stay.

You should apply to other jobs now, non-law jobs. If you can't get a better offer (or at least similar) to your offers in secondary markets, than you should stay in school. If you can find a job that pays $50-60k/year, then drop out and take it.

The Duck
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Re: drop out?

Postby The Duck » Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:01 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Pokemon wrote:I think you should stay since you do not seem to have another job to return to. In this economy you might end up being unemployed for some time.

Additionally, you do not have the choice of spending 270K for an 80-100k job.
Your option is that of spending 150K for 80-100K job. That is not a bad deal at this point. I would have though differently if you were not already 120K in, but you are. In my humble opinion, 80-100k job is not what most people at this forum aim at, but it is not at all a bad starting wage for the majority of the country to be in.
Can you do IBR with that wage?


I'll need to meet with my financial aid people to talk about IBR. I don't know if I qualify.


You probably do actually. You'll pay like 775 bucks a month for 25 years. Which is WAY less your total debt.

The only downside is a potential tax bomb at the end. When they wipe out 300K of your debt in 25 years, you'll get a tax bill for like 100K. So I'd say using conservative investments for that date. There is hope congress fixes it, but nobody is sure. Best case, you have a college fund.


It would only be that big if he amassed a lot of assets which is unlikely. Now, that's a problem in of itself.

Which is good since it'll swell to way over $300K by then.

http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=194161

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ryanmot
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Re: drop out?

Postby ryanmot » Fri Oct 05, 2012 8:50 am

Anonymous User wrote:If you are the sole earner for your family, it'd be irresponsible to drop out with no other plan. The fact that you say you have no idea what you'd do makes it seem like you're just looking for people to tell you to stay.

You should apply to other jobs now, non-law jobs. If you can't get a better offer (or at least similar) to your offers in secondary markets, than you should stay in school. If you can find a job that pays $50-60k/year, then drop out and take it.

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L’Étranger
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Re: drop out?

Postby L’Étranger » Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:26 am

OP you have 3 children. Your job offers are just fine and accepting one of them and finishing law school puts your children in the least amount of risk. In fact, given that four people directly depend on you for food and shelter, you do not have any other option here.




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