The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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Pleasye
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pleasye » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:08 pm

This process definitely sucks and being unemployed and not knowing wtf is going to happen sucks, but February of 3L year is not "time to give up."

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I have a 3.006 from a T30. Barred or not, employers won't exactly be lining up to get applicants like me. Only 57% of the class of 2013 got a FTLT JD-required jerb 9 months after graduation. Not everyone gets something at some point. It's just the math. More students graduate from law school each year than there are jobs available. This process is just so distressing. I can't bum off my parents and volunteer for legal aid indefinitely.

What have you applied for so far?

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:24 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I have a 3.006 from a T30. Barred or not, employers won't exactly be lining up to get applicants like me. Only 57% of the class of 2013 got a FTLT JD-required jerb 9 months after graduation. Not everyone gets something at some point. It's just the math. More students graduate from law school each year than there are jobs available. This process is just so distressing. I can't bum off my parents and volunteer for legal aid indefinitely.

What have you applied for so far?


fellowships, legal aid orgs, non-profits, AGs offices, PDs offices, policy orgs, etc.

i just envision myself moving back in with my parents and being a chronic volunteer a.k.a. indentured servant. :(

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BarbellDreams
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BarbellDreams » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:29 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
BarbellDreams wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:
Anonymous User wrote: Also, is it time to give up hope and look for non-legal jobs?


Also curious about this. When to throw in the towel and give up? One can volunteer postgrad for only so long.


What do you mean by "give up"? What is the alternative? Living with parents in basement and delivering pizza for pocket money?

The long and short of it is that unless you have some awesome non-law opportunity, I don't see why you would ever give up. Its very easy to get discouraged, and I've been there where you're sick of everything and just don't want to look for jobs anymore and watch netflix instead, but you've got loans to pay and a career to make. Getting a job is just as much luck as discipline. When you have the discipline/drive to apply, info interview, volunteer, meet people, etc. thats when luck combos with that to get you a job.

I graduated in a class of 250 from a T2. I know ONE person who didn't have a job 6 months after bar results came out. If you dont sit around watching Netflix all day and grind it out everyone gets something at some point.


I have a 3.006 from a T30. Barred or not, employers won't exactly be lining up to get applicants like me. Only 57% of the class of 2013 got a FTLT JD-required jerb 9 months after graduation. Not everyone gets something at some point. It's just the math. More students graduate from law school each year than there are jobs available. This process is just so distressing. I can't bum off my parents and volunteer for legal aid indefinitely.


The math has been covered to death. Chances are the people at the bottom have worse grades and less grind in them than you do. ALso, I do not mean JD required jobs at all, if we only count those then admittedly not everyone I know got a job, though the vast majority did. The funny thing is the people who work a Landmen or in compliance are the happiest.

sparty99
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby sparty99 » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:33 pm

You haven't even graduated and are not barred. If you have graduated and worked 12 months and still can't find a job then it is at that point that you might consider NEVER BECOMING A LAWYER.

But shit. If you are a 3L, what do you expect? There are no fucking jobs to be had. No one is going to hire you without bar passage. You can try, but don't have too much hope. If you are a 3L you should really just relax. No need to get uptight. Start focusing on getting your mind right for the bar.

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:39 pm

sparty99 wrote:You haven't even graduated and are not barred. If you have graduated and worked 12 months and still can't find a job then it is at that point that you might consider NEVER BECOMING A LAWYER.

But shit. If you are a 3L, what do you expect? There are no fucking jobs to be had. No one is going to hire you without bar passage. You can try, but don't have too much hope. If you are a 3L you should really just relax. No need to get uptight. Start focusing on getting your mind right for the bar.


I'm the anon with a 3.006 from a T30. Should I start studying for the bar now? I mean, folks like me at the bottom of the class are more likely to fail, so perhaps an early start is in order. However, that will take time away from applying to jerbs.

sparty99
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby sparty99 » Sun Feb 22, 2015 10:02 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
sparty99 wrote:You haven't even graduated and are not barred. If you have graduated and worked 12 months and still can't find a job then it is at that point that you might consider NEVER BECOMING A LAWYER.

But shit. If you are a 3L, what do you expect? There are no fucking jobs to be had. No one is going to hire you without bar passage. You can try, but don't have too much hope. If you are a 3L you should really just relax. No need to get uptight. Start focusing on getting your mind right for the bar.


I'm the anon with a 3.006 from a T30. Should I start studying for the bar now? I mean, folks like me at the bottom of the class are more likely to fail, so perhaps an early start is in order. However, that will take time away from applying to jerbs.


You'll probably forget everything if you start now and will be burned out. I would start May 1st if you going to start early. Mostly just focus on the videos if you do a bar prep as that is a big waste of time and if you get that out the way, the better.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 23, 2015 7:55 pm

Pleasye wrote:This process definitely sucks and being unemployed and not knowing wtf is going to happen sucks, but February of 3L year is not "time to give up."

Yeah, you should wait another year when you're in my position before you decide you're totally fucked.

If I don't find a job in 3-4 more months I'm gonna have to leave the law behind. Maybe pursue a career as a teacher or something.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Tue Feb 24, 2015 10:13 am

http://webgui.phila.k12.pa.us/offices/e ... C8p-TbTs5A

Is this a JD Advantage jerb? I have experience in legal settings working with at-risk youth.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Tue Feb 24, 2015 10:46 am

BlueLotus wrote:http://webgui.phila.k12.pa.us/offices/e/ee/opportunities/school-based-positions2/offices/e/ee/opportunities/job-opportunities/school-based-positions15/special-education-classroom-assistant#TZkY0TviWsTuC8p-TbTs5A

Is this a JD Advantage jerb? I have experience in legal settings working with at-risk youth.

There doesn't seem to be anything at all suggesting a JD would be an advantage, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't apply if it's something you're interested in.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Tue Feb 24, 2015 10:54 am

A. Nony Mouse wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:http://webgui.phila.k12.pa.us/offices/e/ee/opportunities/school-based-positions2/offices/e/ee/opportunities/job-opportunities/school-based-positions15/special-education-classroom-assistant#TZkY0TviWsTuC8p-TbTs5A

Is this a JD Advantage jerb? I have experience in legal settings working with at-risk youth.

There doesn't seem to be anything at all suggesting a JD would be an advantage, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't apply if it's something you're interested in.


I'm interested in K-12 teaching if my C&F sh*t doesn't work out. Thinking of working as a TA for 2-3 years before taking the plunge into teaching.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:53 pm

Has anyone thought of doing Peace Corps after lawl school? Is this categorically a bad idea?

EvelynS
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby EvelynS » Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:54 pm

Finally came to terms with myself, I am officially in the vale. Feel pretty terrible. I really want to practice transactional law, especially in M&A, PE, or Hedge Fund practices, but it seems like this can only happen if I work for a firm. I go to T10, struck out of 2L and 3L OCIs, probably below median grades (not at the very bottom though). I applied to law firms with no result whatsoever (what a shocker!). I understand that my situation is not the worst, but still, having no job when all of your classmates talk about theirs and expect you to talk about your job does not make me feel any better. It is just depressing.

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:23 pm

Long time Valer who is feeling pretty optimistic. I scored a lunch with a managing partner yesterday at this networking event. His assistant was there and she gave me her card. Should I email the attorney and cc the assistant or other way around?

Keep grinding everyone.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:47 pm

Are JDs a negative for paralegal/legal secretary type positions?

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rinkrat19
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby rinkrat19 » Tue Feb 24, 2015 8:03 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Are JDs a negative for paralegal/legal secretary type positions?

I think common wisdom is that most employers will be reluctant to hire such an overqualified paralegal/assistant/secretary because they assume you'll be leaving as soon as you get a real lawyer job. I'd also speculate that they might worry that you'd think you're "too good" to work under equally educated (and potentially younger) attorneys and might cause problems in the office.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Feb 24, 2015 8:30 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Pleasye wrote:This process definitely sucks and being unemployed and not knowing wtf is going to happen sucks, but February of 3L year is not "time to give up."

Yeah, you should wait another year when you're in my position before you decide you're totally fucked.

If I don't find a job in 3-4 more months I'm gonna have to leave the law behind. Maybe pursue a career as a teacher or something.


Agreed. February 3L year is too early to quit.

2014 T25, top third, awards for moot court, secondary journal E-board -- looked into joining carpenters' union today (I don't know anything about carpentry). Realized it's another 4 years of training or something.

It's at this point you can decide you're totally fucked. Back to drinking and gambling.

mvp99
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby mvp99 » Wed Feb 25, 2015 12:48 am

hey someone here probably has posted this link already but I figured it wouldn't hurt to share it again..

https://www.usajobs.gov/JobSearch/Searc ... bility=all

Some JD required and JD advantage jobs in there...

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presh
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby presh » Wed Feb 25, 2015 12:53 am

mvp99 wrote:hey someone here probably has posted this link already but I figured it wouldn't hurt to share it again..

https://www.usajobs.gov/JobSearch/Searc ... bility=all

Some JD required and JD advantage jobs in there...

Fyi, your link is broken. Just a word of encouragement for anyone applying for gov jobs. I had a co-worker who applied seven times for the same agency before he was finally hired. Sometimes persistence really makes the difference.

aardvark87
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby aardvark87 » Wed Feb 25, 2015 2:22 am

BlueLotus wrote:Are JDs an advantage in HR jerbs?


Hey, old post, but I haven't lurked in a while.

I got an HR job, and while my JD itself probably wasn't an advantage, it definitely convinced them I was smart and knew how to get stuff done. I think one other guy in the office has an advanced degree. I still had to start at the bottom, but obviously it didn't hurt. Could be an interesting field if I stick with it.

PM if you'd like more details.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Wed Feb 25, 2015 9:54 am

rinkrat19 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Are JDs a negative for paralegal/legal secretary type positions?

I think common wisdom is that most employers will be reluctant to hire such an overqualified paralegal/assistant/secretary because they assume you'll be leaving as soon as you get a real lawyer job. I'd also speculate that they might worry that you'd think you're "too good" to work under equally educated (and potentially younger) attorneys and might cause problems in the office.


So I should leave the JD off when applying to such positions? Will it be tough to transition into a JD-required jerb if I have worked as a paralegal/legal assistant?

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JenDarby
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby JenDarby » Wed Feb 25, 2015 11:39 am

aardvark87 wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:Are JDs an advantage in HR jerbs?


Hey, old post, but I haven't lurked in a while.

I got an HR job, and while my JD itself probably wasn't an advantage, it definitely convinced them I was smart and knew how to get stuff done. I think one other guy in the office has an advanced degree. I still had to start at the bottom, but obviously it didn't hurt. Could be an interesting field if I stick with it.

PM if you'd like more details.

That's awesome, I think HR can definitely be an interesting field. IME JDs are at a minimum looked at favorably and can also be an advantage to supplement a lack of prior HR experience (I know a few people in HR with JDs and my SO is involved in the hiring process for HR employees at his company).

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 25, 2015 8:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Pleasye wrote:This process definitely sucks and being unemployed and not knowing wtf is going to happen sucks, but February of 3L year is not "time to give up."

Yeah, you should wait another year when you're in my position before you decide you're totally fucked.

If I don't find a job in 3-4 more months I'm gonna have to leave the law behind. Maybe pursue a career as a teacher or something.


Agreed. February 3L year is too early to quit.

2014 T25, top third, awards for moot court, secondary journal E-board -- looked into joining carpenters' union today (I don't know anything about carpentry). Realized it's another 4 years of training or something.

It's at this point you can decide you're totally fucked. Back to drinking and gambling.

You and me both.

T20, median, big-law no offer...I tutor for alcohol money.

jamesm722
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby jamesm722 » Wed Feb 25, 2015 8:43 pm

I feel like last semester and not barred is legal purgatory. No one wants to extends offers until you're barred.

Top 10%; T100
Secondary Journal E-board
Trial team
Military service
TA for IP program

I am considering taking a few more science courses so I can take the patent bar. I have done a good amount of patent claims drafting with a supervising patent attorney during the summer for work.

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Pleasye
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pleasye » Wed Feb 25, 2015 10:40 pm

jamesm722 wrote:I feel like last semester and not barred is legal purgatory.

SO much this.




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