The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Fri Oct 17, 2014 2:32 pm

Being proactive and getting help is usually seen as much better than going unmedicated/untreated.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Fri Oct 17, 2014 2:43 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:Being proactive and getting help is usually seen as much better than going unmedicated/untreated.


Yeah, I sure hope so. I wish so many state bars did not ask the mental health ?s, tho. Glad that there is advocacy in favor of removing such intrusive ?s.

http://www.abajournal.com/mobile/articl ... _about_the

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:33 pm

Hey guys,

Just asking for some genuine advice as I'm at my wit's end. I was a long time Valer, did not have a job at graduation (2013 grad), but landed a job at a midsize boutique in the east coast right after the bar. I worked there for 6 months but was let go for economic/restructuring reasons (was lucky enough to get a reference later stating this was the case). I passed the New York bar after graduation and just recently passed the bar of my home state.

I went to a T14 school, graduated with a GPA in the pretty low 3's (I know, not fantastic, but had a horrendous first semester GPA and worked my way slowly out of that hole over the course of law school). I am lucky enough to be able to live with my parents and not be worrying about rent, but it's been almost 8 months since I was laid off, and despite pounding the pavement and networking and following up, it seems either my grades still haunt me or come up (I've been pretty active in filling out the rest of my resume to avoid having them define me, particularly my 1L grades), or I get the same, "you went to a great school, something great will turn up" or "wow, you have great credentials, were not hiring, the market is bad, I don't know anyone who is hiring but you'll land on your feet" or "I'll pass your materials along to so and so and have you follow up", "you have great credentials, you just need experience, that's your biggest obstacle, when you have 2-3 years of experience you would be a great fit for our firm/company etc," and it just seems like it's all a circuitous route to nowhere.

I thought passing the bar of my home state, where I've been networking like mad during law school, and as soon as I knew I was moving out of the east coast and back home, I also networked like mad each trip back and via email, and have been doing so in the two months since I've been here, but it seems like passing the bar hasn't changed the game at all and is merely a gold star that doesn't mean much.

Even the things I have going for me, having gone to a reputable private school in the state that has a massive and strong network here, has not really done anything. I feel as though I have been doing everything right and just cannot seem to have anything stick or have anything lead to anything tangible or even turn into a soft lead. I really don't mean to sound entitled if that's how I am coming off, I really am not, I definitely do not have that sense of "I went to a top school, and even though I'm a K-JD I'm definitely awesome and deserve such and such job," I definitely don't have that, I just want to land something even at low pay while I can live at home and save on expenses, so that I can build up some experience and my resume and try to save as much as I can over the next few years and eventually use that to leverage into a higher paying and perhaps more fulfilling legal position that may be more closely aligned with the areas of practice I want to get into.

Like I said, sort of at my wit's end, especially after 7-8 months no job after having had a job for those 6 months, and trying to really fight the feeling of depression and trying to have some semblance of feeling like my law degree has enough worth to land something that pays a living wage and is something I at least somewhat enjoy doing. Any advice would be appreciated, I have pretty thick skin, even harsh constructive criticism would be greatly appreciated. Thank you again.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Fri Oct 17, 2014 9:43 pm

Job posted today for a great organization:

NATIONALITIES SERVICE CENTER
http://www.nationalitiesservice.org
Date Posted: 10/17/2014
Job Type: ATTORNEY
Schedule Type: Full Time

Practice Areas: Immigration, Litigation, Native American/Indian/Tribal Law

Job Description
History and Mission:

NSC is a non-profit organization that provides social, educational, and legal services to immigrants and refugees in the greater Philadelphia area. Our strength lies in the diversity of our clients and services. Since NSC's founding in 1921, our mission has been to help immigrants and refugees participate fully in American society. Each year, we help approximately 5,000 individuals from over 90 countries.

General Description:

As a member of NSC's Legal Services Department, the Staff Attorney will represent clients in immigration court hearings, appeals before the BIA and federal courts, and matters before the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) and U.S. Department of State. The Staff Attorney will conduct client consultations and determine appropriate legal strategies. The Staff Attorney will perform outreach and training to educate the community on immigration issues and NSC's services.

The Staff Attorney has internal contacts with the entire administrative and programmatic staff and external contact with clients, court officials, and the general community. This position has access to sensitive NSC information and is expected to handle such information with integrity and professionalism. This position has regular contact with members of the community and is expected to represent NSC in a professional manner.

The Staff Attorney reports directly to the Director of Legal Services and participates in department activities as necessary.

Primary Responsibilities:

Prepare cases for court or on appeal, including meeting and corresponding with clients and witnesses and preparing written motions and briefs.
Perform legal research and use independent judgment and decision-making to determine appropriate strategy for court cases, appellate cases, and applications to administrative agencies.
Represent clients before the immigration court.
Prepare administrative filings, including affirmative filings with USCIS, Customs and Border Protection (CBP), Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), and U.S. Department of State (DOS), attend administrative interviews before government agencies, respond to requests for evidence, and meet with clients to prepare applications and responses.
Attend and participate in weekly legal services department staff meetings and case review meetings.
Meet with potential clients for consultation appointments, determine appropriate course of action, and prepare initial case files.
Perform general office administration duties.
Perform community outreach and training activities as directed.
Supervise and direct the work of legal assistants, interns, and volunteers.
Maintain case files in complete, professional manner in accordance with NSC procedures and legal requirements.
Adhere to all applicable legal and ethical standards.
Maintain regular communication with clients in accordance with applicable ethical standards and best practices.
Qualifications
Juris doctor and current license to practice law.
Bilingual skills are preferred.
Knowledge of issues within the immigrant and refugee community is required.
Applicant must be willing to work as a team member and have excellent interpersonal and cross-cultural communication skills.
Non-Essential Functions:
Attend relevant workshops or join professional groups as necessary to maintain professional knowledge and licensure.
Adhere to NSC's confidentiality guidelines and ensure the appropriate handling of sensitive information.
Facilitate and attend relevant staff meetings to promote communication and execution of goals.
Complete special projects specific to the function of the department or as needed as directed by the Director of Legal Services.
Other duties as assigned within the scope of position expectations.
Knowledge, Skills, and Abilities:
Understanding of NSC Legal Services Department goals and objectives and ability to work and contribute as part of a larger team.
Knowledge of immigration law and procedures, legal ethics, and interrelationship of immigration law and other areas of law such as criminal and family.
Ability to perform legal research and understand the law and relevant procedures in order to develop a strategy and/or argument that is persuasive.
Ability to present an argument and advocate for and influence others in court.
Ability to manage multiple tasks by carefully setting priorities, meeting deadlines, and scheduling time efficiently.
Basic understanding of computer operations and ability to use a variety of common software programs including Microsoft Office.
Ability to effectively communicate in person, by phone, or in writing with individuals of multi-cultural backgrounds.
Ability to organize tasks in an efficient manner and follow-up and follow-through with strong attention to detail in a fast-paced environment.
Ability to work with other people through a cooperative effort.
Strong interpersonal skills as demonstrated by compassionate, courteous, cordial, cooperative, and professional interaction with diverse groups of co-workers, program members, social services agencies, social workers, and the community.
Adhere to all NSC policies and procedures.
Attend all NSC in-services as required.
Physical Demands:
The physical demands described here are representative of those that must be met by an employee to successfully perform the essential functions of this job. Reasonable accommodations may be made to enable individuals with disabilities to perform the essential functions.
While performing the duties of this job, the employee will frequently stand; walk; sit; use hands to finger, handle, or feel objects, tools or equipment; reach with hands and arms; balance; talk or hear. The employee will occasionally climb stairs; stoop; kneel; crouch or crawl; taste or smell.
The employee must occasionally lift and/or move up to 25 pounds.
Operate related office equipment and use necessary tools.
Specific vision abilities required by the job include frequent reading and close vision; distance vision; color vision; peripheral vision; depth perception; and the ability to adjust focus.
Work Environment:
The work environment characteristics described here are representative of those that must be met by an employee to successfully perform the essential functions of this job. Reasonable accommodations may be made to enable individuals with disabilities to perform the essential functions.
The noise level in the work environment is usually moderate.
Although work is primarily indoors, you will be required to travel outside to client and community locations.
Travel in and around NSC's service delivery area to support delivery of resettlement services to clients.
Position may require occasional trips to attend conferences seminars, and meetings.
Certain visits or work related appointments might be scheduled outside of traditional work hours as necessary.
Nothing in this position description restricts management's right to assign or reassign duties and responsibilities to this job at any time.
Language(s): Bilingual skills are preferred.

Application Instructions:
Please email detailed letter of interest and résumé to jobs@nscphila.org

Applications deadline is October 24, 2014. NSC does not discriminate in employment because of age, sex, race, religion, national origin, and sexual orientation or for any reason not relevant to the qualifications of the position.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Sat Oct 18, 2014 8:45 am

For those who dig the rural life:

Position: Staff Attorney at Legal Aid of WV

Date Posted: Oct 16, 2014
Application Deadline: Oct 29, 2014
Office Location: Logan
Employment with LAWV provides you with a great opportunity to improve your community and your quality of life at the same time. EOE qualified women, minorities and people with disabilities are encouraged to apply. Additional benefit and Program information is available below.

To Apply:
Send your resume and cover letter to jobs@lawv.net. Please note the position you are applying for in the subject line.

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Kronk
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Kronk » Sat Oct 18, 2014 9:45 am

BlueLotus wrote:For those who dig the rural life:

Position: Staff Attorney at Legal Aid of WV

Date Posted: Oct 16, 2014
Application Deadline: Oct 29, 2014
Office Location: Logan
Employment with LAWV provides you with a great opportunity to improve your community and your quality of life at the same time. EOE qualified women, minorities and people with disabilities are encouraged to apply. Additional benefit and Program information is available below.

To Apply:
Send your resume and cover letter to jobs@lawv.net. Please note the position you are applying for in the subject line.


b/c if you're a minority, the place you want to be is rural west virginia

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Holly Golightly
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Holly Golightly » Sat Oct 18, 2014 11:00 am

West Virginia isn't as bad as its rep.

QuickQuestionAsker88
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby QuickQuestionAsker88 » Sun Oct 19, 2014 5:31 pm

Just wondering if anyone had any advice.

I'm a 3L at a T10, my grades are a little under median and I just did a callback with a small firm with one position open. About half of the partners went to my law school, and I'm the only one from my law school interviewing with the firm. Other than having a reference call on my behalf and pretend I didn't ask him to (which I already did and may have contributed to me landing the callback), is there anything I can do now that the thank you notes are in to maximize my chances of getting an offer?

Any advice would be appreciated - I just hate the waiting game.

Also, isn't it a bad sign that exactly none of the 6 partners I met with responded to my thank you notes over the 2 sets of interviews?

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TheFutureLawyer
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby TheFutureLawyer » Sun Oct 19, 2014 6:47 pm

Kronk wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:For those who dig the rural life:

Position: Staff Attorney at Legal Aid of WV

Date Posted: Oct 16, 2014
Application Deadline: Oct 29, 2014
Office Location: Logan
Employment with LAWV provides you with a great opportunity to improve your community and your quality of life at the same time. EOE qualified women, minorities and people with disabilities are encouraged to apply. Additional benefit and Program information is available below.

To Apply:
Send your resume and cover letter to jobs@lawv.net. Please note the position you are applying for in the subject line.


b/c if you're a minority, the place you want to be is rural west virginia


lol at "EOE qualified [applicants]..." Makes no sense; EOE stands for Equal Opportunity Employer.

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minnbills
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby minnbills » Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:23 pm

QuickQuestionAsker88 wrote:Also, isn't it a bad sign that exactly none of the 6 partners I met with responded to my thank you notes over the 2 sets of interviews?


Nobody ever responds to thank you notes - don't worry about it.

You've done your work. The best thing for you is to sit back and let the dice fall.

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twenty 8
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby twenty 8 » Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:47 pm

minnbills wrote:
QuickQuestionAsker88 wrote:Also, isn't it a bad sign that exactly none of the 6 partners I met with responded to my thank you notes over the 2 sets of interviews?


Nobody ever responds to thank you notes - don't worry about it.

You've done your work. The best thing for you is to sit back and let the dice fall.

180

As an OCI screener, I never responded to thank you emails. I wasn't a primary on callbacks but doubtful if I would have responded.

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skrubba5025
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby skrubba5025 » Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:35 am

minnbills wrote:
QuickQuestionAsker88 wrote:Also, isn't it a bad sign that exactly none of the 6 partners I met with responded to my thank you notes over the 2 sets of interviews?


Nobody ever responds to thank you notes - don't worry about it.

You've done your work. The best thing for you is to sit back and let the dice fall.



I was working myself up over not hearing back after sending my thank you notes. Glad to see that no response is typical.

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spleenworship
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby spleenworship » Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:36 pm

I realize I'm late to the latest party regarding mental health treatment, and I also realize that I have harped on this quite a bit over the past six months or so, but I just like to say again that therapy and medication was the best damn thing that ever happened to me. If anybody in here needs help, don't feel ashamed... Just get the help.

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crumpetsandtea
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby crumpetsandtea » Mon Oct 20, 2014 11:50 pm

JK
Last edited by crumpetsandtea on Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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worldtraveler
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby worldtraveler » Tue Oct 21, 2014 3:39 am

If anyone wants to teach law in a foreign country, send me a PM. Very prestige-whorish job though so unfortunately T10 applicants only. Current 3Ls or recent grads.

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minnbills
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby minnbills » Tue Oct 21, 2014 8:40 am

Don't really have advice but good luck! You will kill it!!!!
Last edited by minnbills on Tue Oct 21, 2014 10:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

sandcastle45
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby sandcastle45 » Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:25 am

Deleted
Last edited by sandcastle45 on Wed Oct 22, 2014 9:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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unc0mm0n1
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby unc0mm0n1 » Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:40 am

TheFutureLawyer wrote:
Kronk wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:For those who dig the rural life:

Position: Staff Attorney at Legal Aid of WV

Date Posted: Oct 16, 2014
Application Deadline: Oct 29, 2014
Office Location: Logan
Employment with LAWV provides you with a great opportunity to improve your community and your quality of life at the same time. EOE qualified women, minorities and people with disabilities are encouraged to apply. Additional benefit and Program information is available below.

To Apply:
Send your resume and cover letter to jobs@lawv.net. Please note the position you are applying for in the subject line.


b/c if you're a minority, the place you want to be is rural west virginia


lol at "EOE qualified [applicants]..." Makes no sense; EOE stands for Equal Opportunity Employer.


I think they are just missing a period after EOE. Either way thanks for posting the position Blue Lotus.

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unc0mm0n1
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby unc0mm0n1 » Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:42 am

worldtraveler wrote:If anyone wants to teach law in a foreign country, send me a PM. Very prestige-whorish job though so unfortunately T10 applicants only. Current 3Ls or recent grads.


A friend of mine does this in Beijing. He seems to like it.

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 21, 2014 12:36 pm

Hi Vale! I'm a 3L so I think I qualify.

(Anonymous because I'm pretty sure my young attorney supervisors have TLS accounts.)

I wanted to see what you guys thought about this situation. As the title said, is it still beneficial to me long term to do a judicial externship as a 3L in my last semester? I graduate May 2015, so I would only look for positions that let me work less than full time since I still have to take at least one class.

I'm currently working in a small (less than 10 people) medical malpractice/commercial torts firm. By some stroke of luck, I seem to have charmed the boss enough that he's made vague references to hiring me, but nowhere near anything finalized. I find med mal interesting, but it's not something I want to be pidgeon-holed into this early in my career.

On the other hand, I'm hesitant to leave this boss because my stats are terrible and I have no idea how he hired me in the first place or why he likes me. I'm still slightly lower than median at a T-20 school, but I was bottom 10% after first semester 1L so there is a slight bump (median is probably around 3.4 by now). I've worked every semester since 1L, with the job prior to my current firm being a part time internship at the DA's office.

My eventual goal is to get in-house (haha, like the majority of law students), and I don't mind whether I work litigation or transactional first to get there. I have moderate debts; final loan total will be around 65k.

EDIT: I have a bankruptcy court interview this week-should I take it if I get the offer?

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baal hadad
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby baal hadad » Tue Oct 21, 2014 1:06 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hi Vale! I'm a 3L so I think I qualify.

(Anonymous because I'm pretty sure my young attorney supervisors have TLS accounts.)

I wanted to see what you guys thought about this situation. As the title said, is it still beneficial to me long term to do a judicial externship as a 3L in my last semester? I graduate May 2015, so I would only look for positions that let me work less than full time since I still have to take at least one class.

I'm currently working in a small (less than 10 people) medical malpractice/commercial torts firm. By some stroke of luck, I seem to have charmed the boss enough that he's made vague references to hiring me, but nowhere near anything finalized. I find med mal interesting, but it's not something I want to be pidgeon-holed into this early in my career.

On the other hand, I'm hesitant to leave this boss because my stats are terrible and I have no idea how he hired me in the first place or why he likes me. I'm still slightly lower than median at a T-20 school, but I was bottom 10% after first semester 1L so there is a slight bump (median is probably around 3.4 by now). I've worked every semester since 1L, with the job prior to my current firm being a part time internship at the DA's office.

My eventual goal is to get in-house (haha, like the majority of law students), and I don't mind whether I work litigation or transactional first to get there. I have moderate debts; final loan total will be around 65k.

EDIT: I have a bankruptcy court interview this week-should I take it if I get the offer?

W your terrible stats I would not leave a job that has a possibility of hiring you for an extern ship w no possibility of ft employ

Yeah sorry med mals not what you want to do but you are in no position to be picky now

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 21, 2014 6:16 pm

Anon who posted about externships.

Alright, I thought so!

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 21, 2014 8:34 pm

In the last week I got rejected from a fedgov job and a biglaw staff attorney job where I was one of the final 3 candidates for each position. Can't help but laugh at how ridiculous this is.

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minnbills
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby minnbills » Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:04 pm

Anonymous User wrote:EDIT: I have a bankruptcy court interview this week-should I take it if I get the offer?


Would you be willing to anon-post or pm me the judge's name?

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crumpetsandtea
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby crumpetsandtea » Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:50 pm

minnbills wrote:Don't really have advice but good luck! You will kill it!!!!

Thanks minnbills <3 <3 <3 I really, really appreciate the support. Kinda freaking out (I wasn't expecting the 2nd round interview b/c i interviewed with them originally in early august and assumed they weren't interested after a month+ passed with no word).

Do you mind deleting my quote from your post though? I'm paranoid hahah sorry




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