The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Oct 06, 2014 12:21 pm

Anyone here going through the WA State AGO hiring process? If so, have you heard anything about the selection for the Final Round?

I know it is supposed to take place next week, so I am guessing we should be hearing something soon.

Thanks

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Mon Oct 06, 2014 3:15 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
$30k is totally normal for entry-level attorneys. I mean, look at this thread. There are dozens, if not hundreds, of people who will apply for that position.


+1. I just got an interview with a legal aid org on a Native American reservation in NM/AZ that pays $32,500. And I am so stoked about the possibility of working there!

Congratulations and good luck! But the position you're describing is public interest and expected to be at the low end of the pay grade, and is eligible for student loan forgiveness, etc. The $30,000 offer in the OP was a for-profit crim. law firm--and it is NOT normal in the market they're hiring for. I'm just not sure how any person in the market this position was located would live on $30k with student loans if not living in a tent.


True, true, if selected I would cop dat PSLF.

Still, anything sub-$40K is rough just about anywhere, public or private sector.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:07 pm

Is 30-40k normal for private immigration firms? Immigration clients are not very wealthy (except corporations wanting business immigration assistance). So I'm guessing 30-40 is average for most immigration firms that aren't solos.

But now, almost anything is good. Helluva lot better than being unemployed, anyway.

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hous
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby hous » Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:08 am

Anonymous User wrote:Is 30-40k normal for private immigration firms? Immigration clients are not very wealthy (except corporations wanting business immigration assistance). So I'm guessing 30-40 is average for most immigration firms that aren't solos.

But now, almost anything is good. Helluva lot better than being unemployed, anyway.


It doesn't sound normal, but I don't have experience with that area of law. 40k for private seems just a little low to me because there is no possibility of loan forgiveness. 45k+ seems better but honestly, if you don't take the job someone else will and you may be jobless for awhile.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 07, 2014 8:51 am

Anonymous User wrote:Is 30-40k normal for private immigration firms? Immigration clients are not very wealthy (except corporations wanting business immigration assistance). So I'm guessing 30-40 is average for most immigration firms that aren't solos.

But now, almost anything is good. Helluva lot better than being unemployed, anyway.


Not normal. If you take it, be very careful. There are a LOT OF REALLY CRAPPY immigration firms out there and if they're ripping you off like this; they're likely doing the same to their clients. You'll have to do a lot of self-learning to make sure you don't fall into their bad habits.

I recommend an AILA membership, their cheap intro to immigration book package and quick network building through them--so that you are able to surpass your surroundings.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 08, 2014 1:06 am

After getting no-offered, I'm now in the surreal situation where my only interview is with DOJ honors. It's a great opportunity, but the impossibility of getting into the program combined with the added job pressure is freaking me out. Blah. I dunno how everything fell apart so quickly.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 08, 2014 8:51 am

Anonymous User wrote:After getting no-offered, I'm now in the surreal situation where my only interview is with DOJ honors. It's a great opportunity, but the impossibility of getting into the program combined with the added job pressure is freaking me out. Blah. I dunno how everything fell apart so quickly.


Kill that interview! DOJ Honors was my dream job :( didn't get an interview. Good luck!

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby TooOld4This » Wed Oct 08, 2014 9:38 am

Anonymous User wrote:After getting no-offered, I'm now in the surreal situation where my only interview is with DOJ honors. It's a great opportunity, but the impossibility of getting into the program combined with the added job pressure is freaking me out. Blah. I dunno how everything fell apart so quickly.


Take a breath and regroup. It sounds like this is the opportunity you really want.

You don't want to seem desperate in your interview. You do want to be committed. Make sure you know why you want the component you are interviewing with. Think of things in your experience you can tie in, but don't stretch credibility. Fed jobs tend to have a much lower tolerance for BS -- because of the hiring schedule, and a perception that they can be "easy" jobs (DOJ suffers less from the latter), there can be a heightened alert for people who have no other options or don't really want to work. You need to not only say the right things, but also be sincere (and expect that you may be pushed to substantiate what you say).

Make sure that you are able to talk about everything on your resume and writing sample substantively. Interviews are much more likely to be behavioral/situational than firm interviews you went through. Maybe do some research online for those types of questions and think of some answers you might give. If they ask you to engage on a legal issue, don't sidestep. You can admit that you aren't familiar with the issue, but try to give them some sense of your reasoning skills.

I don't know the circumstances of your no-offer, but think about how you want to handle it if it does come up.

Good luck!

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:07 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Anyone here going through the WA State AGO hiring process? If so, have you heard anything about the selection for the Final Round?

I know it is supposed to take place next week, so I am guessing we should be hearing something soon.

Thanks



They started extending invitations for final round interviews today by phone. There will be 12 in total for 5 jobs. Good luck!!

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 08, 2014 10:19 pm

TooOld4This wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:After getting no-offered, I'm now in the surreal situation where my only interview is with DOJ honors. It's a great opportunity, but the impossibility of getting into the program combined with the added job pressure is freaking me out. Blah. I dunno how everything fell apart so quickly.


Take a breath and regroup. It sounds like this is the opportunity you really want.

You don't want to seem desperate in your interview. You do want to be committed. Make sure you know why you want the component you are interviewing with. Think of things in your experience you can tie in, but don't stretch credibility. Fed jobs tend to have a much lower tolerance for BS -- because of the hiring schedule, and a perception that they can be "easy" jobs (DOJ suffers less from the latter), there can be a heightened alert for people who have no other options or don't really want to work. You need to not only say the right things, but also be sincere (and expect that you may be pushed to substantiate what you say).

Make sure that you are able to talk about everything on your resume and writing sample substantively. Interviews are much more likely to be behavioral/situational than firm interviews you went through. Maybe do some research online for those types of questions and think of some answers you might give. If they ask you to engage on a legal issue, don't sidestep. You can admit that you aren't familiar with the issue, but try to give them some sense of your reasoning skills.

I don't know the circumstances of your no-offer, but think about how you want to handle it if it does come up.

Good luck!



to doj honors person, get this--i got rejected for my STATE TRIAL COURT position the day before my interview for my Fed D. Court position (only fed clerkship interview i got). i did everything I could to not let the state trial court rejection ,as confusing as it was, throw me off. ended up nailing fed d court interview and getting the job. i ended up writing back to the state trial court people, pretending that i never heard about my rejection, and telling them about my d court clerkship and how i had to withdraw as a result.

moral of the story is to just PUT IT OUT OF YOUR MIND and think about how awesome it'll be if u get doj honors

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Oct 08, 2014 11:27 pm

I just don't know what to do anymore. :cry:

I really need a shoulder to cry on. I don't even have any friends here.

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Pleasye
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pleasye » Wed Oct 08, 2014 11:29 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I just don't know what to do anymore. :cry:

I really need a shoulder to cry on. I don't even have any friends here.

<3

A lot of us are lost as well so you're in good company here. You can always post/PM if you need to talk.

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crumpetsandtea
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby crumpetsandtea » Wed Oct 08, 2014 11:36 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I just don't know what to do anymore. :cry:

I really need a shoulder to cry on. I don't even have any friends here.

*HUG* You can PM me if you want. I'm so sorry, I know it's a horrible thing to go through, and not having a support network makes it much worse. I hope things get better for you.

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baal hadad
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby baal hadad » Wed Oct 08, 2014 11:55 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I just don't know what to do anymore. :cry:

I really need a shoulder to cry on. I don't even have any friends here.

Shoot me a pm bro/sis

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 09, 2014 3:26 am

Anonymous User wrote:
TooOld4This wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:After getting no-offered, I'm now in the surreal situation where my only interview is with DOJ honors. It's a great opportunity, but the impossibility of getting into the program combined with the added job pressure is freaking me out. Blah. I dunno how everything fell apart so quickly.


Take a breath and regroup. It sounds like this is the opportunity you really want.

You don't want to seem desperate in your interview. You do want to be committed. Make sure you know why you want the component you are interviewing with. Think of things in your experience you can tie in, but don't stretch credibility. Fed jobs tend to have a much lower tolerance for BS -- because of the hiring schedule, and a perception that they can be "easy" jobs (DOJ suffers less from the latter), there can be a heightened alert for people who have no other options or don't really want to work. You need to not only say the right things, but also be sincere (and expect that you may be pushed to substantiate what you say).

Make sure that you are able to talk about everything on your resume and writing sample substantively. Interviews are much more likely to be behavioral/situational than firm interviews you went through. Maybe do some research online for those types of questions and think of some answers you might give. If they ask you to engage on a legal issue, don't sidestep. You can admit that you aren't familiar with the issue, but try to give them some sense of your reasoning skills.

I don't know the circumstances of your no-offer, but think about how you want to handle it if it does come up.

Good luck!



to doj honors person, get this--i got rejected for my STATE TRIAL COURT position the day before my interview for my Fed D. Court position (only fed clerkship interview i got). i did everything I could to not let the state trial court rejection ,as confusing as it was, throw me off. ended up nailing fed d court interview and getting the job. i ended up writing back to the state trial court people, pretending that i never heard about my rejection, and telling them about my d court clerkship and how i had to withdraw as a result.

moral of the story is to just PUT IT OUT OF YOUR MIND and think about how awesome it'll be if u get doj honors


I had almost the exact same thing happen to me. I had a long interview process for a career position at a state court. Months went by before they finally sent me a rejection letter. I was really bummed because they called my references, who told me it seemed like I had gotten the job. They went with someone with 10 years of experience instead of me, a then-new grad, so I'm not sure wtf was going on.

2 weeks later I got a Fed. D. Ct. interview. It was the only one I had gotten from probably 200 applications for D. Ct. clerkships. I nailed the interview and was offered the job the next day.

Good luck.

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minnbills
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby minnbills » Thu Oct 09, 2014 5:06 pm

Got a rejection from my first clerkship interview today. I have two more interviews coming up the pipeline. I want one of these fucking jobs so bad right now.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Thu Oct 09, 2014 5:12 pm

Got dinged by my dream PD's office. Someone pass the Svedka and Natty, please?

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crumpetsandtea
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby crumpetsandtea » Thu Oct 09, 2014 6:46 pm

BlueLotus wrote:Got dinged by my dream PD's office. Someone pass the Svedka and Natty, please?

Oh NOOOO ): I'm so so sorry. I am sending ALL the booze to you virtually. If you need someone to talk to, feel free to PM me.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:21 pm

crumpetsandtea wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:Got dinged by my dream PD's office. Someone pass the Svedka and Natty, please?

Oh NOOOO ): I'm so so sorry. I am sending ALL the booze to you virtually. If you need someone to talk to, feel free to PM me.


Thanks for the love. Although it stung given my strong ties to the city, it was not unexpected as my experience is largely civil legal aid.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 09, 2014 11:08 pm

Because I hate myself I just spent 20 minutes looking at the linkedin/firm profiles of all of my classmates (basically all of them) who just started their $$ jobs ... everyone is employed and has moved on, but here I am, in the same place, with no end in sight.

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spleenworship
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby spleenworship » Fri Oct 10, 2014 8:50 am

People who have already passed the bar, speak fluent or near fluent/very conversational Spanish, and had good grades in law school: PM me if you'd like info on a job that starts ASAP. Experience in immigration law a huge plus, but not strictly necessary.

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spleenworship
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby spleenworship » Fri Oct 10, 2014 8:51 am

Also, sorry lotus and minnbils

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Fri Oct 10, 2014 10:58 am

Anonymous User wrote:I just don't know what to do anymore. :cry:

I really need a shoulder to cry on. I don't even have any friends here.


You are in good company. Many of us Valers have been in the deep, dark depths that you are in right now. Please feel free to PM me if you ever need to vent, a shoulder to cry on, etc.

Also, don't hesitate to get therapy. It has helped a number of folks on here to cope with the Vale and other personal struggles. No C&F committee will ever ding anyone just for seeking help (as far as I know).

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spleenworship
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby spleenworship » Fri Oct 10, 2014 12:54 pm

BlueLotus wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I just don't know what to do anymore. :cry:

I really need a shoulder to cry on. I don't even have any friends here.


You are in good company. Many of us Valers have been in the deep, dark depths that you are in right now. Please feel free to PM me if you ever need to vent, a shoulder to cry on, etc.

Also, don't hesitate to get therapy. It has helped a number of folks on here to cope with the Vale and other personal struggles. No C&F committee will ever ding anyone just for seeking help (as far as I know).


C&F seemed relieved that I'd sought help (was in C&F hearing for tangentially related matter to my depression).

Getting therapy and Wellbutrin was the best choice I've ever made in my life, apart from marrying my wife and knocking her up. It made the temainder of LS and the job search tolerable. I highly recommend getting help or anyone experiencing perfectly understandable anxiety and depression related to being in the vale.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Oct 10, 2014 1:39 pm

Delete
Last edited by Anonymous User on Thu Oct 23, 2014 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.




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