The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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Mal Reynolds
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Mal Reynolds » Mon Sep 01, 2014 7:52 pm

vandalvideo wrote:
Mal Reynolds wrote:
vandalvideo wrote:I'm more interested in how people make room for interests on their resume. After thesis topics, bar admissions, experience, and education there isn't much room left in a one page resume if any. Or is the conventional wisdom of a one page resume obsolete?


One line is extraordinarily easy to fit on a one page resume. You must not be very good at word processing.

Ok, so redraft of question; Is the comparative value of the interest section worth ditching one job experience? After listing four or five positions I simply do not have room on my resume for an interest section. Even with the text being single spaced and the header separations being multiple-spaced 1.5. with thin margins. My current setup is Residence info -> Bar exam status -> EXPERIENCE -> 4-5 positions with three sentences each -> Education -> UG and JD -> Thesis Topics. And bam, I am at one page.



1.5 inch margins? Lol

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vandalvideo
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby vandalvideo » Mon Sep 01, 2014 7:54 pm

Mal Reynolds wrote:
1.5 inch margins? Lol


No thats the after paragraph line spacing? I have default margins. (Almost none)

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LeDique
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby LeDique » Mon Sep 01, 2014 7:54 pm

I'm taking a shot in the dark here, but it sounds like your UG section is too big then. But really, just with messing with the formatting, you should be able to add one line.

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JohannDeMann
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby JohannDeMann » Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:00 pm

i never had an interests section, and i dont think it hurt me. but i see the appeal in them too. it depends on your resume and what job you're looking for. the 5 jobs you list with 3 sentence descriptions ... are they all relevant somehow? are you a 3L?

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:46 pm

Bar exam status doesn't need its own line. My bar admission number is part of the header with my address/contact info. Also, do all of your experiences need three lines each? What size/font are you using?

(That said, I used a 2 pp resume, but I'm also nearing that time in life when life isn't worth living anymore, so I had a few more years to cover.)

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:50 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:Bar exam status doesn't need its own line. My bar admission number is part of the header with my address/contact info. Also, do all of your experiences need three lines each? What size/font are you using?

(That said, I used a 2 pp resume, but I'm also nearing that time in life when life isn't worth living anymore, so I had a few more years to cover.)


Did you use a 2 pp. resume for fellowships or for regular jobs? My CSO recommended that I use the 2 pager for fellowships (because they want to see a long and demonstrated history of commitment to public service) and the 1 pager with just legal experience for staff attorney/PD positions.

I'm only 26, so the 2 pager (which is in 10 pt. font) maybe pushing it, even for EJW type fellowships.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:53 pm

I didn't apply for fellowships, so just normal jobs. (Ironically, I think now that I've been working for a couple of years I'd be more likely to use a 1-pager - I'd ditch a lot of info about pre-LS/LS jobs.)

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vandalvideo
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby vandalvideo » Mon Sep 01, 2014 9:43 pm

JohannDeMann wrote:i never had an interests section, and i dont think it hurt me. but i see the appeal in them too. it depends on your resume and what job you're looking for. the 5 jobs you list with 3 sentence descriptions ... are they all relevant somehow? are you a 3L?

Post-fellowship 2013 grad entering the running for firm jobs. I had an externship for each semester of law school and two post graduation positions; one fellowship and one solo practitioner apprenticeship. Also including my clinic experience as a separate job listing. I am leaving certain positions out at this point and don't have any honors listed for education. Still in the vale, trying to tweak my resume.

Thanks to A. Mouse though. Thought Bar admissions required its own line.

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Bikeflip
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Mon Sep 01, 2014 11:37 pm

Change your font to Garamond & cut a sentence from your oldest job or shortest job. That should give you a line.

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Druid
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Druid » Mon Sep 01, 2014 11:43 pm

Good point. PSA if you're not doing Garamond already get the fuck on it.

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Gefuehlsecht
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Gefuehlsecht » Tue Sep 02, 2014 4:56 am

Mal Reynolds wrote:
Gefuehlsecht wrote:
A. Nony Mouse wrote:He might be thinking animal rescue = PETA.


No, he isn't. But a potential interviewer might think all kinds of things. Not everybody loves cute puppies. I just don't see the point of giving biased people a reason.


(Idiot)


Ok!

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JohannDeMann
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby JohannDeMann » Tue Sep 02, 2014 5:42 am

vandalvideo wrote:
JohannDeMann wrote:i never had an interests section, and i dont think it hurt me. but i see the appeal in them too. it depends on your resume and what job you're looking for. the 5 jobs you list with 3 sentence descriptions ... are they all relevant somehow? are you a 3L?

Post-fellowship 2013 grad entering the running for firm jobs. I had an externship for each semester of law school and two post graduation positions; one fellowship and one solo practitioner apprenticeship. Also including my clinic experience as a separate job listing. I am leaving certain positions out at this point and don't have any honors listed for education. Still in the vale, trying to tweak my resume.

Thanks to A. Mouse though. Thought Bar admissions required its own line.


My take on interests is they are a good thing to have if you have nothing better to put on there. If you have lots of legal experience, I'd leave the legal experience. But for most 2ls applying for SA they just don't have any experience relevant enough to fill a whole page and therefore interests is good because it provides something to talk about. It sounds like you have a lot of relevant experience so I'd leave that. But again that's me. There's no right answer here - just what are you more comfortable doing.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Tue Sep 02, 2014 6:57 am

Once I graduate, do I put Experience first and then Education? I've seen some resumes like this.

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:32 am

2014 grad, posted in here anon several times as I came very close to several positions (one had me down to the final 2 but picked the other guy). Took the bar and had to move back in with my parents, which has been a...shall we say humbling experience as they picked up right where they left off when I left home as a teenager with curfews, spying on my phone calls and nagging me about making my bed. But not for long...I'm FINALLY out of the vale. State job, crappy pay but enough to get the hell out of my parents house and lots of trial experience relatively quickly. I'm completely over the moon and I've been on cloud nine ever since.

But now I'm paralyzed with fear that I failed the bar, as it was made very clear the offer is 100% conditional on bar passage and I will be fired if I fail. I didn't think it went that bad at the time, but finally getting everything I wanted and worked so hard for only to fail and have it all yanked away is terrifying. I know there's nothing I can do about it now but ever since I got the offer I've been replaying the test over and over in my head worrying about every answer I wasn't sure of. Has anyone else been in this boat?

Puttanesca
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Puttanesca » Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:57 am

Anonymous User wrote:2014 grad, posted in here anon several times as I came very close to several positions (one had me down to the final 2 but picked the other guy). Took the bar and had to move back in with my parents, which has been a...shall we say humbling experience as they picked up right where they left off when I left home as a teenager with curfews, spying on my phone calls and nagging me about making my bed. But not for long...I'm FINALLY out of the vale. State job, crappy pay but enough to get the hell out of my parents house and lots of trial experience relatively quickly. I'm completely over the moon and I've been on cloud nine ever since.

But now I'm paralyzed with fear that I failed the bar, as it was made very clear the offer is 100% conditional on bar passage and I will be fired if I fail. I didn't think it went that bad at the time, but finally getting everything I wanted and worked so hard for only to fail and have it all yanked away is terrifying. I know there's nothing I can do about it now but ever since I got the offer I've been replaying the test over and over in my head worrying about every answer I wasn't sure of. Has anyone else been in this boat?


Congrats on the job! My offer is also conditional on bar passage. I occasionally think about the possibility of failing, and there's a decent portion of people who fail in my jurisdiction (around 25%). Early on though, I decided that I was not going to worry about it because worrying about it was not going to change the result. I keep trying to remind myself that percentage wise, most people pass (and that my school has a 90+% pass rate). I also have blocked out most of the questions from my mind, so fortunately I cannot replay the questions and answers in my head.

In all likelihood, you passed. Just focus on other things for now: exercise, spend time with friends (even your parents), find a part-time job, etc. I know living with your parents is not always the most fun, but at least you have that option in the unlikely event that you didn't pass. Keep busy with other things and don't worry!

Chuck59
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Chuck59 » Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:14 am

I'm a 3L recent Vale member (no-offer from regional vault 2L SA). Top 50, regional school, law review, and a heavy lean towards corporate work on resume and transcripts. I don't want to give up on a dream of corporate work, but I'm scared that I am limiting myself too much.

Aside from just mass-mailing firms with corporate practices, what else can I be doing to increase my shot at the kind of work I want? I've never really considered clerkships, but I'm wondering if Corp. work is still possible from them. Is Gov Honors a place where I can jump ship to private again? Any outside the box ideas? Just not sure where to focus my energy.

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TheFutureLawyer
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby TheFutureLawyer » Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:56 am

BlueLotus wrote:Once I graduate, do I put Experience first and then Education? I've seen some resumes like this.


I've read that's what you do once you've been employed post-jd for 3-5 years. Until then, lawl school is still the most important item on your resume and should be the first thing they see.

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baal hadad
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby baal hadad » Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:04 pm

Chuck59 wrote:I'm a 3L recent Vale member (no-offer from regional vault 2L SA). Top 50, regional school, law review, and a heavy lean towards corporate work on resume and transcripts. I don't want to give up on a dream of corporate work, but I'm scared that I am limiting myself too much.

Aside from just mass-mailing firms with corporate practices, what else can I be doing to increase my shot at the kind of work I want? I've never really considered clerkships, but I'm wondering if Corp. work is still possible from them. Is Gov Honors a place where I can jump ship to private again? Any outside the in
I to box ideas? Just not sure where to focus my energy.

Corp focus is hard

There's not a lot of real corp boutiques

I'd focus on networking w corporate practitioners and clerkship

Govt doesn't have a lot of real corporate opportunities

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 02, 2014 7:28 pm

Dumb question, but does South Asian count as diverse? Should I put that I am a member of SALSA on my resume even tho I haven't done much for the club?

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baal hadad
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby baal hadad » Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:04 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Dumb question, but does South Asian count as diverse? Should I put that I am a member of SALSA on my resume even tho I haven't done much for the club?

You're diverse but not the diversity they're looking for

It won't hurt so just put it down

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:40 pm

Should I be mass mailing at a crazy pace like 2Ls would be doing at this time of the year?

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deadpanic
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby deadpanic » Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:48 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Should I be mass mailing at a crazy pace like 2Ls would be doing at this time of the year?


It probably won't prove beneficial. But what has been said on here many times is what else are you going to do? So, yes.

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baal hadad
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby baal hadad » Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:54 pm

deadpanic wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Should I be mass mailing at a crazy pace like 2Ls would be doing at this time of the year?


It probably won't prove beneficial. But what has been said on here many times is what else are you going to do? So, yes.

Pretty much this

I'd try to network and what not in addition though

mirage1287
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby mirage1287 » Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Should I be mass mailing at a crazy pace like 2Ls would be doing at this time of the year?


Try to clerk at a firm during your 3L. It'll expand your network and you'll gain more substantive experience to put on your resume.

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JenDarby
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby JenDarby » Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:26 pm

mirage1287 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Should I be mass mailing at a crazy pace like 2Ls would be doing at this time of the year?


Try to clerk at a firm during your 3L. It'll expand your network and you'll gain more substantive experience to put on your resume.

I think internships/jobs of any legal sort are really important during 3L if you don't have a position lined up.

My 2L summer position was never intended to last beyond the summer but I stayed there in the fall and then the spring, and now I'm still there after graduation.

"Worst" case scenario you get experience and network, and best case scenario it converts into full time employment.




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