The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Aug 28, 2014 7:42 pm

Nice. Recruiter left me a voicemail to say we have an update about a job I am in the final three for at 5 o'clock on a holiday weekend. Couldn't get her when I called back. Just fucking tell me yes or no.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Thu Aug 28, 2014 9:04 pm

How "ties" conscious are PI jerbs? I am looking at postgrad fellowships in states I've never lived, worked, or gone to school in. Will I get grilled like firms do?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby worldtraveler » Thu Aug 28, 2014 9:32 pm

BlueLotus wrote:How "ties" conscious are PI jerbs? I am looking at postgrad fellowships in states I've never lived, worked, or gone to school in. Will I get grilled like firms do?


Even more so if it's something like legal aid. If it's a unicorny impact lit kind of thing, then no.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby minnbills » Thu Aug 28, 2014 9:51 pm

worldtraveler wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:How "ties" conscious are PI jerbs? I am looking at postgrad fellowships in states I've never lived, worked, or gone to school in. Will I get grilled like firms do?


Even more so if it's something like legal aid. If it's a unicorny impact lit kind of thing, then no.


I don't agree with this at all. At my office it's mostly out of state people.

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Holly Golightly
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Holly Golightly » Fri Aug 29, 2014 1:09 am

minnbills wrote:
worldtraveler wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:How "ties" conscious are PI jerbs? I am looking at postgrad fellowships in states I've never lived, worked, or gone to school in. Will I get grilled like firms do?


Even more so if it's something like legal aid. If it's a unicorny impact lit kind of thing, then no.


I don't agree with this at all. At my office it's mostly out of state people.

haha and I thought they did matter for my impact lit job.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby seahawks2014 » Fri Aug 29, 2014 2:06 am

This jerb stuff is awful. Its been one month since the bar and I only managed to snag one biglaw face to face interview. T6 grad and ivy undergrad (cum laude). Post 2L EIW I decided to attack grades. I got a sick GPA (3.5) for the last 3 semesters of law school and still nothing. Sucked at interviewing, got an interview coach and ironed my issues out. Now there are barely any jobs to apply to. Just frustrated as fuck atm. Any tips on what I could be doing more of??? I feel like I worked my ass off through undergrad and law school to sit on the couch all day browsing the web for jobs to apply to. Everyone says wait until bar results come out, but I don't feel like I def passed the bar so thats a scary thing to wait on. Had to rant a bit, this is turrble.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pretzel_Logic » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:58 am

seahawks2014 wrote:This jerb stuff is awful. Its been one month since the bar and I only managed to snag one biglaw face to face interview. T6 grad and ivy undergrad (cum laude). Post 2L EIW I decided to attack grades. I got a sick GPA (3.5) for the last 3 semesters of law school and still nothing. Sucked at interviewing, got an interview coach and ironed my issues out. Now there are barely any jobs to apply to. Just frustrated as fuck atm. Any tips on what I could be doing more of??? I feel like I worked my ass off through undergrad and law school to sit on the couch all day browsing the web for jobs to apply to. Everyone says wait until bar results come out, but I don't feel like I def passed the bar so thats a scary thing to wait on. Had to rant a bit, this is turrble.


Feel free to jump my case for this, but I'm hearing a little bit of "why did this happen to me, I did so well and I did everything right?!" Well...you probably did, and maybe still are, but this market has no room for special snowflake syndrome. There's a very careful balance between confidence you're a great candidate and can do the job and entitlement about why you shouuld have one, if that makes any sense. Don't wait on bar results, keep hustling to what is out there now. Cold apply to jobs that aren't listed, I got a number of interviews that way. Are you networking? Clerking anywhere? Volunteering?

Good luck bro. I hope you find something ASAP.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:08 am

Recent grad, interviewing for a contract attorney position at a biglaw firm in DC next week. Its in a really niche area which I have experience in from working during law school. It's not through an agency, it was posted directly on their website. The job posting doesn't say much, but does say competitive salary, excellent benefits, and stable schedule.

Any ideas on what the nature of such a position is? I'm not sure how much I should expect in terms of pay, stability, length of the position, etc. From what I hear, a contract attorney can be anything from a one month doc review gig to a relatively long, non-horrible term position. This specific practice doesn't involve much litigation, so I'm not sure how much potential there is for large scale doc review.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby spleenworship » Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:40 am

minnbills wrote:
worldtraveler wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:How "ties" conscious are PI jerbs? I am looking at postgrad fellowships in states I've never lived, worked, or gone to school in. Will I get grilled like firms do?


Even more so if it's something like legal aid. If it's a unicorny impact lit kind of thing, then no.


I don't agree with this at all. At my office it's mostly out of state people.



I think, like all PI stuff, it's pretty regional. 90% of the PI people in my state come from my state or one of the five states that border us. Also, I do know that not having ties lost me interviews at NH PD because they couldn't believe I'd want to leave the southwest and move all the way to New England.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:46 am

spleenworship wrote:
minnbills wrote:
worldtraveler wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:How "ties" conscious are PI jerbs? I am looking at postgrad fellowships in states I've never lived, worked, or gone to school in. Will I get grilled like firms do?


Even more so if it's something like legal aid. If it's a unicorny impact lit kind of thing, then no.


I don't agree with this at all. At my office it's mostly out of state people.



I think, like all PI stuff, it's pretty regional. 90% of the PI people in my state come from my state or one of the five states that border us. Also, I do know that not having ties lost me interviews at NH PD because they couldn't believe I'd want to leave the southwest and move all the way to New England.


I attend one of the Boston T30s and am applying to jobs in VT and Maine. Is that sufficiently close even though I've never worked or lived in those states?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby jarofsoup » Fri Aug 29, 2014 12:24 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Recent grad, interviewing for a contract attorney position at a biglaw firm in DC next week. Its in a really niche area which I have experience in from working during law school. It's not through an agency, it was posted directly on their website. The job posting doesn't say much, but does say competitive salary, excellent benefits, and stable schedule.

Any ideas on what the nature of such a position is? I'm not sure how much I should expect in terms of pay, stability, length of the position, etc. From what I hear, a contract attorney can be anything from a one month doc review gig to a relatively long, non-horrible term position. This specific practice doesn't involve much litigation, so I'm not sure how much potential there is for large scale doc review.


PM me the firm. I think I know the position you are talking about. I think its one of these new non-partnership year long positions where they are trying to take on entry-level candidates outside of the summer program.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby worldtraveler » Fri Aug 29, 2014 1:53 pm

BlueLotus wrote:
I attend one of the Boston T30s and am applying to jobs in VT and Maine. Is that sufficiently close even though I've never worked or lived in those states?


I think that's close enough. But in general though given that there are legal aid/PD and similar places in every state, and all of them pretty much do the same thing, you can probably expect a "why this city/office" question.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby seahawks2014 » Fri Aug 29, 2014 3:49 pm

Pretzel_Logic wrote:Feel free to jump my case for this, but I'm hearing a little bit of "why did this happen to me, I did so well and I did everything right?!" Well...you probably did, and maybe still are, but this market has no room for special snowflake syndrome. There's a very careful balance between confidence you're a great candidate and can do the job and entitlement about why you shouuld have one, if that makes any sense. Don't wait on bar results, keep hustling to what is out there now. Cold apply to jobs that aren't listed, I got a number of interviews that way. Are you networking? Clerking anywhere? Volunteering?

Good luck bro. I hope you find something ASAP.


I am clerking a few days every week with a solo that I have worked with for the past two years. I have been applying to postings on symplicity mainly because those have the best hit ratio. Networking and mass mailing are something I need to get on ASAP. But thanks for the advice and encouragement, pretty spot on. Sometimes a man just feels down as fuck tho in this job hunt shit. Good luck to all.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Aug 29, 2014 7:54 pm

The job search is killing me. When I interview for jobs I have the required experience for they hire someone who doesn't. When I interview for a job where I don't have all the experience (but interview really well) they hire someone with more experience than me. This rejection is so painful. I know this market is fucked but I did everything right: went to a T14, fixed my interviewing problems, got good work experience. Yet I can't get an offer to save my life.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby spleenworship » Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:15 pm

Anonymous User wrote:The job search is killing me. When I interview for jobs I have the required experience for they hire someone who doesn't. When I interview for a job where I don't have all the experience (but interview really well) they hire someone with more experience than me. This rejection is so painful. I know this market is fucked but I did everything right: went to a T14, fixed my interviewing problems, got good work experience. Yet I can't get an offer to save my life.

Just keep going one step after another. I hear you though. I've been there.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Sat Aug 30, 2014 7:44 am

What is the max length a writing sample should be if the employer does not specify?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Chuck59 » Sat Aug 30, 2014 8:48 am

I'm sure this question is answered somewhere in the 291 pages here, but I was looking for some insight on the "what to do now" question.

Is there any sort of timeline for 3Ls that I'm not aware of? Should I mass mail everywhere and play the alumni-networking game second? Or are firms still bogged down in 2Ls right now and I should send out those networking feelers now?

I'm just curious what the "typical" 3L year looks like for the Vale.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby jarofsoup » Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:44 am

Chuck59 wrote:I'm sure this question is answered somewhere in the 291 pages here, but I was looking for some insight on the "what to do now" question.

Is there any sort of timeline for 3Ls that I'm not aware of? Should I mass mail everywhere and play the alumni-networking game second? Or are firms still bogged down in 2Ls right now and I should send out those networking feelers now?

I'm just curious what the "typical" 3L year looks like for the Vale.



You should probably intern somewhere if you have not done so. Also keep hustling and reaching out to employers. And of course network.

Consider getting a part time job as a law clerk at a firm nearby.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Druid » Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:47 am

BlueLotus wrote:What is the max length a writing sample should be if the employer does not specify?


5-7 is probably ideal. 10 max.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 30, 2014 10:22 am

jarofsoup wrote:You should probably intern somewhere if you have not done so. Also keep hustling and reaching out to employers. And of course network.

Consider getting a part time job as a law clerk at a firm nearby.

diff anon but thx @jar for the advice... I too, am on the hunt for some sort of internship and it's nice to hear this echoed ITT. spent all day yesterday searching and applying for semester jobs, internships, externships, and full-time post-LS employment... I can't wait to get out of the Vale!

Eta: to those that got a job during 3L (former Valers) please fill out your stats here... I hope that the info you provide helps us Valers realize that all types of job offers are given at varying times during 3L (especially since I feel like opportunities are quickly fading away as the days/weeks pass).

TYIA.

- groot

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 30, 2014 2:54 pm

is stating you're a member of a religious group on your resume a red flag (i.e. jewish law students association, buddhism club, etc.)?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 30, 2014 2:55 pm

How is this for an interests section? Is it too "blah"?
"• Kayaking, hiking, bicycling, birding, beachcombing, animal rescue, salsa dancing, digital photography, and Scrabble"

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LeDique
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby LeDique » Sat Aug 30, 2014 3:14 pm

Anonymous User wrote:How is this for an interests section? Is it too "blah"?
"• Kayaking, hiking, bicycling, birding, beachcombing, animal rescue, salsa dancing, digital photography, and Scrabble"


It's a little long. I'd go to "Kayaking, hiking [specific kind of hike] OR [specific kind of] biking, birding, salsa dancing, and Scrabble." This might be CO-biased tho, but if I just saw "hiking, biking" on a resume here I'd be like "great you live in Colorado" and want more as a conversation starter/to ask you about. The more specific, especially the more interesting it sounds, the better.

If you volunteer with animal rescue & shelters, put that under a separate "community involvement" type line.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 30, 2014 3:22 pm

LeDique wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:How is this for an interests section? Is it too "blah"?
"• Kayaking, hiking, bicycling, birding, beachcombing, animal rescue, salsa dancing, digital photography, and Scrabble"


It's a little long. I'd go to "Kayaking, hiking [specific kind of hike] OR [specific kind of] biking, birding, salsa dancing, and Scrabble." This might be CO-biased tho, but if I just saw "hiking, biking" on a resume here I'd be like "great you live in Colorado" and want more as a conversation starter/to ask you about. The more specific, especially the more interesting it sounds, the better.

If you volunteer with animal rescue & shelters, put that under a separate "community involvement" type line.

I agree. shorten or add specificity to make a greater connection
i.e., Kayaking the Potomac River, hiking the Appalachian Trail, beach combing, digital photography, and Scrabble

- groot

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 30, 2014 3:27 pm

is it credited to apply to gov't positions during the weekend when the application only asks applicants to send an email/attachments to atty_recruiting @ blahblah.gov and not via online application such as usajobs? or should i wait until the work-week? i don't want to have my app overlooked.

- groot




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