The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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jessuf
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby jessuf » Fri Aug 15, 2014 12:45 am

LeDique wrote:Well everyone, I just got a job offer in my desired practice area, with a very well respected attorney. I know his current associate who I will be replacing, and she seems to have liked her job when I talked to her before interviewing. Going to talk to her one more time before I accept, but it looks good.

I negotiated an extra 5k/yr in salary before I even had the offer tho, loool (pay is still shit)

Congrats!!!!!!

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Pleasye
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pleasye » Fri Aug 15, 2014 1:15 pm

Congrats dique!


And I belong here so I might as well post.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Aug 15, 2014 3:07 pm

BlueLotus wrote:Registration for the EJW Conference and Career Fair opened yesterday. Any of you Valers planning on going?


Question: if you're interested in doing EJW, does anyone know if it would it hurt your chances of getting a fellowship if you don't go to this fair? I live pretty far...

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Druid
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Druid » Fri Aug 15, 2014 3:08 pm

Fellowships are hard enough to get as it is. Why hamstring yourself?

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jessuf
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby jessuf » Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:59 pm

I had one of the best interviews of my life a few weeks ago and really wanted the job. Found out the other day that it was filled by looking at the job posting. I'm frustrated that no one bothered to e-mail me or send me a form letter to reject me. I've been rejected an insane number of times the past few years, but this one left me feeling a bit depressed.

Also I never took the bar in July and still can't figure out what state I'm should be taking it in.

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TheFutureLawyer
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby TheFutureLawyer » Sat Aug 16, 2014 12:42 am

Jessuf wrote:I had one of the best interviews of my life a few weeks ago and really wanted the job. Found out the other day that it was filled by looking at the job posting. I'm frustrated that no one bothered to e-mail me or send me a form letter to reject me. I've been rejected an insane number of times the past few years, but this one left me feeling a bit depressed.

Also I never took the bar in July and still can't figure out what state I'm should be taking it in.


That's rough. Fuck those guys.


Is there a specific reason you can't figure out where you wanna take the bar? You consider taking the California or New York bar in the mean time? It would at least give you a lot more options than if you stayed unbarred.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:02 am

Congrats Dique!

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby sgoodman » Sat Aug 16, 2014 10:42 am

...
Last edited by sgoodman on Mon Jan 04, 2016 9:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 16, 2014 12:16 pm

sgoodman wrote:This is probably a silly question but I'll ask anyways. Should you always put your class rank on your resume if you are above median? I have a 3.5 which puts me in the top 1/3, but CSO told me to leave the ranking off because my GPA "looks better" than my ranking suggests, whatever that means. I'm assuming it has to do with grade inflation because a 3.5 at other schools in my area would put you in top 20% rather than 33%. I'm against the idea because I think firms would assume that your ranking isn't good if you don't put it on your resume.

I figure it is kind of irrelevant because if the firm cares about class rank they will specifically ask for it, but thought I would see what some of you think.


I was told to put GPA or class rank, not both. For example, I use rank because I'm 12% with a 3.45 at my school, and rank looks better than the GPA in my case. Your GPA of 3.5 is higher than mine, but my class rank would be higher. I'd use your GPA as well.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby NorCalLaw » Sat Aug 16, 2014 6:35 pm

sgoodman wrote:This is probably a silly question but I'll ask anyways. Should you always put your class rank on your resume if you are above median? I have a 3.5 which puts me in the top 1/3, but CSO told me to leave the ranking off because my GPA "looks better" than my ranking suggests, whatever that means. I'm assuming it has to do with grade inflation because a 3.5 at other schools in my area would put you in top 20% rather than 33%. I'm against the idea because I think firms would assume that your ranking isn't good if you don't put it on your resume.

I figure it is kind of irrelevant because if the firm cares about class rank they will specifically ask for it, but thought I would see what some of you think.


I think it depends on where you're applying. If they're likely to be knowledgeable regarding the curve at your school, you might want to put the rank in. I think a lot of people assume that grade inflation is widespread.

That said, even grade-inflated, 3.5 does sound better than top 1/3, so I think leaving it off could help out in this case. You always run the risk of an employer scanning resumes for ranking and skipping you if they don't see it, though.

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Holly Golightly
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Holly Golightly » Sat Aug 16, 2014 8:05 pm

To me, top third sounds better than 3.5. But I went to NU, a that may be my grade inflation talking.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby hiima3L » Sat Aug 16, 2014 9:36 pm

sgoodman wrote:This is probably a silly question but I'll ask anyways. Should you always put your class rank on your resume if you are above median? I have a 3.5 which puts me in the top 1/3, but CSO told me to leave the ranking off because my GPA "looks better" than my ranking suggests, whatever that means. I'm assuming it has to do with grade inflation because a 3.5 at other schools in my area would put you in top 20% rather than 33%. I'm against the idea because I think firms would assume that your ranking isn't good if you don't put it on your resume.

I figure it is kind of irrelevant because if the firm cares about class rank they will specifically ask for it, but thought I would see what some of you think.


3.5 was top 10% or so at mine. I would totally leave ranking off if I had a 3.5.

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Druid
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Druid » Sat Aug 16, 2014 10:18 pm

hiima3L wrote:
sgoodman wrote:This is probably a silly question but I'll ask anyways. Should you always put your class rank on your resume if you are above median? I have a 3.5 which puts me in the top 1/3, but CSO told me to leave the ranking off because my GPA "looks better" than my ranking suggests, whatever that means. I'm assuming it has to do with grade inflation because a 3.5 at other schools in my area would put you in top 20% rather than 33%. I'm against the idea because I think firms would assume that your ranking isn't good if you don't put it on your resume.

I figure it is kind of irrelevant because if the firm cares about class rank they will specifically ask for it, but thought I would see what some of you think.


3.5 was top 10% or so at mine. I would totally leave ranking off if I had a 3.5.


Agree.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Aug 16, 2014 10:20 pm

Question: how have you put that your admitted to the bar on your resume?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Druid » Sat Aug 16, 2014 10:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Question: how have you put that your admitted to the bar on your resume?


Bar Admissions section under your experience section, and then a line under that that says something like "Admitted to practice in Florida and New York."

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baal hadad
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby baal hadad » Sun Aug 17, 2014 3:14 am

Druid wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Question: how have you put that your admitted to the bar on your resume?


Bar Admissions section under your experience section, and then a line under that that says something like "Admitted to practice in Florida and New York."

Whatever you do, make sure that it's very obvious from just glancing at your resume that you are admitted to the bar. Because so much hiring after graduation is based on immediate need, you need to make sure that people you give your resume to know that you can start immediately

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TheFutureLawyer
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby TheFutureLawyer » Sun Aug 17, 2014 10:56 am

Y'all think it's worth it to put "Awaiting State Bar Examination Results"?

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Tanicius
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Tanicius » Sun Aug 17, 2014 11:25 am

TheFutureLawyer wrote:Y'all think it's worth it to put "Awaiting State Bar Examination Results"?


I prefer "Recently took bar exam like a bawss and confidently awaits record-setting results."

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby crumpetsandtea » Sun Aug 17, 2014 3:44 pm

I'm with HGL here, so it must be the NU grade inflation talking. I had no idea that a 3.5 was top 10% at some schools, holy shit. It's like, below median after 2L year @ NU I think.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 17, 2014 3:46 pm

Druid wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
numbertwo88 wrote:
This kind of terrifies me but congratulations on the job! 3 offers is actually really amazing; your hard work was worth it.


I should have clarified that 2 out of 3 of those offers were so shady I couldn't accept them, even though I was desperate.

I learned a lot of important information about the hiring process throughout this ordeal. When I have time later this week I'll start a thread about my search and what I learned, as guidance to those searching.


Thanks! Please link it here in case we miss it.


viewtopic.php?f=23&t=234720

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 17, 2014 4:27 pm

Longtime lurker, first time poaster to this thread. Thread kept me warm at night as a 3L amongst often oblivious striver peers.

2014 grad, out of the vale. Government gig with legit 40-45 hour workweek and nice pay + benefits + apparent job security. Office seems like chill, decent folk. In my target city.

Best of luck to those still looking.

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06102016
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby 06102016 » Sun Aug 17, 2014 4:35 pm

..

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pretzel_Logic » Mon Aug 18, 2014 1:14 pm

crumpetsandtea wrote:I'm with HGL here, so it must be the NU grade inflation talking. I had no idea that a 3.5 was top 10% at some schools, holy shit. It's like, below median after 2L year @ NU I think.


lol, definitely grade inflation. My school curved to a 3.0.

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crumpetsandtea
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby crumpetsandtea » Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:07 pm

Pretzel_Logic wrote:
crumpetsandtea wrote:I'm with HGL here, so it must be the NU grade inflation talking. I had no idea that a 3.5 was top 10% at some schools, holy shit. It's like, below median after 2L year @ NU I think.


lol, definitely grade inflation. My school curved to a 3.0.

Damnnnnnnnnn. That's crazy. NU doesn't rank either, I guess I never realized how beneficial that is.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:26 pm

slackademic wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Longtime lurker, first time poaster to this thread. Thread kept me warm at night as a 3L amongst often oblivious striver peers.

2014 grad, out of the vale. Government gig with legit 40-45 hour workweek and nice pay + benefits + apparent job security. Office seems like chill, decent folk. In my target city.

Best of luck to those still looking.

Congratulations.

How did you find this position and what was your strategy when applying?

Did you have any relevant prior experience?

Also if you are comfortable doing so, please pm me. Very interested in this.

Again, congrats.


Thanks. I feel like I've died and woken up a boomer. Just with more debt.

Finding the position was mostly a stroke of luck and I don't have any advice on how to replicate it (wish I did). I didn't know of, or find, a stream of these types of jobs going in and some of the favorable benefits/terms I've only realized post-interview. Can't be much more help, unfortunately. It was a publicly listed position on a state website and I didn't have an in. The sort of thing that almost never results in a job. I do suspect the applicant pool wasn't as extensive as it might have been but I'm not sure of the total number of applications.

- Yes, public service background and public service course selection. I didn't have a direct tie to the office in which I was hired and my experience wasn't specifically on point. No private firm experience. FWIW, t10 school with above median grades.

- My application stressed my commitment to public service and my general experience in litigation. During the interview, it did seem that the prior background in public service, defined broadly, was a prerequisite.

- During the interview, I tried to make it clear that I was pleasant to be around and that wanted to be there for the long haul.

- In the interview I was able to articulate a compelling tie to the region. I also had a compelling reason why I didn't go the local schools so that helped demonstrate that I wasn't off chasing prestige rainbows. I didn't address the issue in the cover letter because I didn't have a good way of conveying the ties.

- I also tried to give a persuasive answer, related to my work before and during law school, as to why I wanted to do the work of the office specifically and why I found what the office did compelling (i.e., I didn't view it is lesser than bigfed or bigfirm work). Obviously I didn't talk about the contrast directly but I was clear as to why I thought the work they did was important -- "this is where a lot of the real cases happen and are adjudicated" kind of stuff -- and why my background led me to them.

- One of my interviewers seemed to like my file and I suspect they fought for me. Why? Zero idea. Really was mostly luck from start to finish.

Came after a pretty harsh rejection from a job I really wanted.

Anyways, stay strong Valers. Too many qualified applicants for not enough jobs. This whole process has been ridiculous from start to provisional finish.




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