The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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worldtraveler
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby worldtraveler » Mon Feb 10, 2014 12:09 pm

Knox Ricksen in Oakland just made a posting for a newly barred attorney to work on medical malpractice claims.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 12:30 pm

Finally scored a doc review interview this Friday. It's with the placement agency so doing well won't necessarily put me right into a job, but it will at least get me on their list of people to contact when assignments come up. I hope it goes well as both of my parents have unrelated medical issues going on and the family really needs the money just to stay afloat.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 1:12 pm

Out of curiosity, does doc review also require good grades?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Finally scored a doc review interview this Friday. It's with the placement agency so doing well won't necessarily put me right into a job, but it will at least get me on their list of people to contact when assignments come up. I hope it goes well as both of my parents have unrelated medical issues going on and the family really needs the money just to stay afloat.



Hugs anon brah. Family issues + the Vale is a recipe for the ultimate depression.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:38 pm

Had dinner w/ my original study group at CLS a couple days ago, and just felt like a complete failure. They are all doing well at their firms and life, while I will be losing my fellowship in a month w/ no job prospects and may have to consider doc review work to get by till the end of my lease. It's almost impossible for me to associate w/ anyone from my law school, even people who I am good friends w/ and know me well enough b/c of how horribly pathetic I feel. Had a lot of trouble sleeping that night, and been really depressed lately as my deadline comes up for my fellowship grant. I'm essentially not suicidal atm compared to a month ago, but I keep having fantasies about it.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:40 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Had dinner w/ my original study group at CLS a couple days ago, and just felt like a complete failure. They are all doing well at their firms and life, while I will be losing my fellowship in a month w/ no job prospects and may have to consider doc review work to get by till the end of my lease. It's almost impossible for me to associate w/ anyone from my law school, even people who I am good friends w/ and know me well enough b/c of how horribly pathetic I feel. Had a lot of trouble sleeping that night, and been really depressed lately as my deadline comes up for my fellowship grant. I'm essentially not suicidal atm compared to a month ago, but I keep having fantasies about it.


If you're having thoughts of suicide, at least vent to the Vale. We can't do much for you, but we know what you're going through.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby rad lulz » Mon Feb 10, 2014 3:59 pm

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Last edited by rad lulz on Thu Sep 08, 2016 11:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby patogordo » Mon Feb 10, 2014 4:04 pm

If they're good friends they'll understand that being around them and hearing about their lives makes you feel shitty right now. The first and second times I dropped out of school I pretty much had to do the same thing and stopped hanging out with my friends (literally to the point where I joined the army and was afraid to tell them bc I felt like a failure, and didn't tell them until they found out from someone in my family like two weeks before I was leaving). It sucks but I'm still friends with all of them and they'll understand that you're just in a bad place right now and can't just pretend like everything is cool and hang out.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pretzel_Logic » Mon Feb 10, 2014 4:22 pm

Bikeflip wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Finally scored a doc review interview this Friday. It's with the placement agency so doing well won't necessarily put me right into a job, but it will at least get me on their list of people to contact when assignments come up. I hope it goes well as both of my parents have unrelated medical issues going on and the family really needs the money just to stay afloat.



Hugs anon brah. Family issues + the Vale is a recipe for the ultimate depression.


My entire family is kind of in the Vale right now, anon, so if you need to talk shoot me a pm. I know how much it sucks.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 7:37 pm

Pretty sure despite anon that I'm goin to out myself here, but I just need to get this off my chest.

I'm pretty sure I'm depressed. Like significantly and clinically so. I have so much trouble getting any work done for school or for work. My job is vital to me being able to stay in school and keep my mortgage afloat, yet I find I cannot even bring myself to stop TLSing or reading news stories instead of completing assignments. My school work suffers even more, and I frequently do everything half ass at the last minute. I have trouble waking up in the morning, and I often hope I will get sick so I don't have to go to work or school. I drink myself to sleep every night. Every night. It's the only way to sleep. I have 4-5 small panic attacks a day.

I know the solution: when I was quitting smoking last year I was on an antidepressant prescribed for smoking cessation. The side effect, lol, was that I was happy, non-anxious, and productive. All I have to do is go to student health and I could easily get the medication again and I bet I'd be fine.

Part of the depression and anxiety is fear of the future. I have two job interviews lined up... But whenever I think about how much is riding on them I get an anxiety attack. I can't focus for a long time afterwards on anything, either.

So why, you might ask, don't I just go get the antidepressant? Simple: I was also accepted into a JAG position. One for which, however, I still need multiple medical waivers. This prospect is important to me... But also uncertain, which causes more anxiety, and depression at the thought my dreams will be dashed. Thing is... If I go get diagnosed and medicated for my depression, I will absolutely not be able to get a waiver for that. They aren't allowing people with medicated depression in right now. And I don't blame them - their suivide rates have been through the roof lately. And while I am in no way suicidal, I can't blame them for being extra cautious.

So there is my catch 22. My depression and anxiety make it really hard for me to get a job (because nothing is more attractive to employers than a lazy, scatterbrained, anxious a-hole who can barely function)... But if I treat it I lose my chance at the one potential job offer I have and the dreams of decades I've held for that job.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:07 pm

Can you get therapy without the medication, anon? Or is that also not JAG kosher?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:10 pm

Bikeflip wrote:Can you get therapy without the medication, anon? Or is that also not JAG kosher?


Yeah. I mean, it would add another waiver to ask for (that might be granted, maybe). But I don't really think that's going to help as quickly as just taking the medication, which made me feel better in just a few short days. But yeah, it might help. Adding another waiver to ask for, however... That makes me want to vomit from stress.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby NYstate » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:15 pm

Can you just tell the doctor you need help with quitting smoking again? Do you have to disclose depression to get the medicine? Will that need a waiver?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:18 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Bikeflip wrote:Can you get therapy without the medication, anon? Or is that also not JAG kosher?


Yeah. I mean, it would add another waiver to ask for (that might be granted, maybe). But I don't really think that's going to help as quickly as just taking the medication, which made me feel better in just a few short days. But yeah, it might help. Adding another waiver to ask for, however... That makes me want to vomit from stress.


(Edit - nevermind, someone asked my question already while I was typing.)
Last edited by Anonymous User on Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:21 pm

NYstate wrote:Can you just tell the doctor you need help with quitting smoking again? Do you have to disclose depression to get the medicine? Will that need a waiver?


Interesting thought. It's only like, 30 days supply I think though... They don't want you on it too long for smoking cessation I think. I don't know if 30 days will be enough. I mean, I won't know about the waivers for as much as 6 months or more.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby NYstate » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:23 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
NYstate wrote:Can you just tell the doctor you need help with quitting smoking again? Do you have to disclose depression to get the medicine? Will that need a waiver?


Interesting thought. It's only like, 30 days supply I think though... They don't want you on it too long for smoking cessation I think. I don't know if 30 days will be enough. I mean, I won't know about the waivers for as much as 6 months or more.


Well if it helps you cope and do better in school and with interviews, just start with 30 days and see what happens.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:25 pm

The more I think about it, the only right thing to do seems to be to get myself treated and tell the truth to the recruiters, even I it means I can't serve because of it. It's both the ethical choice and the correct thing to do for myself.

Anyone disagree or see another angle I'm missing?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:53 pm

That is so incredibly hard - I really feel for you, anon.

I do think your mental health is more important, and it's possible that you might be able to go off the medication in time to start the program? I can also see the ethical issue about getting around their concern about enlisting people with medicated depression.

So yeah, I'd vote getting treatment. Even though it sucks that it puts you in this position. I hope everything works out.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Tasik32 » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:54 pm

Anonymous User wrote:The more I think about it, the only right thing to do seems to be to get myself treated and tell the truth to the recruiters, even I it means I can't serve because of it. It's both the ethical choice and the correct thing to do for myself.

Anyone disagree or see another angle I'm missing?


Anon, I can't really say what you should or should not do in this situation, but I was just reading through this forum and wanted to say that what you said is both brave and worth commendation. If you think it's the right thing to do for yourself, then I'd so go for it. In some ways, it gives you the opportunity to take back control.

Regardless of your choice, best of luck.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby NYstate » Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:02 pm

Anonymous User wrote:The more I think about it, the only right thing to do seems to be to get myself treated and tell the truth to the recruiters, even I it means I can't serve because of it. It's both the ethical choice and the correct thing to do for myself.

Anyone disagree or see another angle I'm missing?


It seems like you need help now, so there is no point in waiting for the future that may or may not happen with JAG anyway. That is my practical answer.

But I am not one to advise people on ethics. I don't see anything wrong with trying for a month or so and seeing how you improve and not disclosing right away. You are self-diagnosing here, maybe this is more a matter of anxiety and not depression? I don't know if that makes a difference to JAG. I wouldn't tell them anything until you absolutely have to. Maybe you will find something else before then. Don't get ahead of yourself.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:40 pm

NYstate wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:The more I think about it, the only right thing to do seems to be to get myself treated and tell the truth to the recruiters, even I it means I can't serve because of it. It's both the ethical choice and the correct thing to do for myself.

Anyone disagree or see another angle I'm missing?


It seems like you need help now, so there is no point in waiting for the future that may or may not happen with JAG anyway. That is my practical answer.

But I am not one to advise people on ethics. I don't see anything wrong with trying for a month or so and seeing how you improve and not disclosing right away. You are self-diagnosing here, maybe this is more a matter of anxiety and not depression? I don't know if that makes a difference to JAG. I wouldn't tell them anything until you absolutely have to. Maybe you will find something else before then. Don't get ahead of yourself.


Semi-suicidal anon from before. I also tried to apply for the Coast Guard JAG, and was auto dq b/c I was on medication. Felt really shitty and angry afterward (i didn't know it would be an issue beforehand, and also thought coast guard wouldn't care as much since not really being sent oversees to warzones, and wasn't planning on captaining a ship).

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Feb 10, 2014 11:11 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
NYstate wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:The more I think about it, the only right thing to do seems to be to get myself treated and tell the truth to the recruiters, even I it means I can't serve because of it. It's both the ethical choice and the correct thing to do for myself.

Anyone disagree or see another angle I'm missing?


It seems like you need help now, so there is no point in waiting for the future that may or may not happen with JAG anyway. That is my practical answer.

But I am not one to advise people on ethics. I don't see anything wrong with trying for a month or so and seeing how you improve and not disclosing right away. You are self-diagnosing here, maybe this is more a matter of anxiety and not depression? I don't know if that makes a difference to JAG. I wouldn't tell them anything until you absolutely have to. Maybe you will find something else before then. Don't get ahead of yourself.


Semi-suicidal anon from before. I also tried to apply for the Coast Guard JAG, and was auto dq b/c I was on medication. Felt really shitty and angry afterward (i didn't know it would be an issue beforehand, and also thought coast guard wouldn't care as much since not really being sent oversees to warzones, and wasn't planning on captaining a ship).


Second anon, non-suicidal: sorry to hear that man. Seriously, try and get help? Like I'm going to?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pretzel_Logic » Mon Feb 10, 2014 11:38 pm

Anonymous User wrote:The more I think about it, the only right thing to do seems to be to get myself treated and tell the truth to the recruiters, even I it means I can't serve because of it. It's both the ethical choice and the correct thing to do for myself.

Anyone disagree or see another angle I'm missing?


Anon, I'm so sorry to hear you're struggling with this. I have friends in the military who have PTSD/depression/major anxiety and they have dodged treatment because they're afraid of getting sidelined, and watching them suffer is just awful. Please, please put your mental health first. I know it feels like a surrender, but there is literally nothing more important than getting help for yourself. I've been through a couple major depressive episodes myself and it is just shitty from every perspective. Get the help you need; once you do that, it really will open your mind up and you'll feel so much less crappy. It was amazing once I emerged from that prison how much brighter everything felt. I've fought depression through barzam study and then through unemployment, and while I'm not in the pit right now, several of my family members are and my anxiety levels are through the roof. I'm doing everything I can do to keep it in check but I've had to reach out to get some support. And I only figured out how to do that because depression just about took me out in law school before I got help.

tl;dr please do what you need to do to help yourself and pm me if you need to talk.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:15 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
NYstate wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:The more I think about it, the only right thing to do seems to be to get myself treated and tell the truth to the recruiters, even I it means I can't serve because of it. It's both the ethical choice and the correct thing to do for myself.

Anyone disagree or see another angle I'm missing?


It seems like you need help now, so there is no point in waiting for the future that may or may not happen with JAG anyway. That is my practical answer.

But I am not one to advise people on ethics. I don't see anything wrong with trying for a month or so and seeing how you improve and not disclosing right away. You are self-diagnosing here, maybe this is more a matter of anxiety and not depression? I don't know if that makes a difference to JAG. I wouldn't tell them anything until you absolutely have to. Maybe you will find something else before then. Don't get ahead of yourself.


Semi-suicidal anon from before. I also tried to apply for the Coast Guard JAG, and was auto dq b/c I was on medication. Felt really shitty and angry afterward (i didn't know it would be an issue beforehand, and also thought coast guard wouldn't care as much since not really being sent oversees to warzones, and wasn't planning on captaining a ship).


Second anon, non-suicidal: sorry to hear that man. Seriously, try and get help? Like I'm going to?


Been and continuing to do so. Doesn't make the job situation any better though.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:19 am

Pretzel_Logic wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:The more I think about it, the only right thing to do seems to be to get myself treated and tell the truth to the recruiters, even I it means I can't serve because of it. It's both the ethical choice and the correct thing to do for myself.

Anyone disagree or see another angle I'm missing?


Anon, I'm so sorry to hear you're struggling with this. I have friends in the military who have PTSD/depression/major anxiety and they have dodged treatment because they're afraid of getting sidelined, and watching them suffer is just awful. Please, please put your mental health first. I know it feels like a surrender, but there is literally nothing more important than getting help for yourself. I've been through a couple major depressive episodes myself and it is just shitty from every perspective. Get the help you need; once you do that, it really will open your mind up and you'll feel so much less crappy. It was amazing once I emerged from that prison how much brighter everything felt. I've fought depression through barzam study and then through unemployment, and while I'm not in the pit right now, several of my family members are and my anxiety levels are through the roof. I'm doing everything I can do to keep it in check but I've had to reach out to get some support. And I only figured out how to do that because depression just about took me out in law school before I got help.

tl;dr please do what you need to do to help yourself and pm me if you need to talk.


Anon you were replying to here: I know. And I know it's wrong of me, but even though I know I'm right to get help, part of my brain is screaming: weakling! Loser! You should tough it out! What's wrong with you?

Doing my best to ignore that.




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