The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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ilovesf
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby ilovesf » Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:38 pm

I'm on the way to the biggest interview ever. I'm so nervous I feel like I'm going to puke. :( if I mess up it will be like I wasted the last year.

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BarbellDreams
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BarbellDreams » Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:40 pm

ilovesf wrote:I'm on the way to the biggest interview ever. I'm so nervous I feel like I'm going to puke. :( if I mess up it will be like I wasted the last year.


Good luck man. The easiest way to interview well is to think of it as simply meeting some nice people.

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Bikeflip
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:44 pm

BarbellDreams wrote:
ilovesf wrote:I'm on the way to the biggest interview ever. I'm so nervous I feel like I'm going to puke. :( if I mess up it will be like I wasted the last year.


Good luck man. The easiest way to interview well is to think of it as simply meeting some nice people.


+1 Do whatever you need to not psych yourself out. If that means go on to their firm profile age and mock their tastes in ties, do that.

(did that back in college for something. kinda worked, sadly :oops:)

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JenDarby
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby JenDarby » Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:57 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
JenDarby wrote:Yea I didn't know that. I don't think it necessarily applies to legal departments though. I work in the legal dept at a really huge place, but our group is still only 10 attorneys. They picked who to interview, not some computer system (I know this since we've talked about their process). I think it likely depends on the position and specific hiring processes of places.

Even if the practice group is picking who to interview, it's extremely unlikely that they see the resumes of everyone who applies. Unless you're applying directly to a hiring partner, HR almost certainly does a preliminary screening before presenting resumes to the practice group.

I never said they do see EVERY SINGLE RESUME. My company didn't use any form of computer screening process and a woman from HR was our final interviewer. She helped them look through resumes, but she did not screen based on target words. My only point was that the hiring for a generally pretty small legal group at a fortune 500 or other large company is going to be extremely different than the hiring of their general staff. There are 600 people in my office - the IT people's applications go through a super basic screening process, as do those in other support functions. Outside of that each group puts together a list of criteria they are looking for (not based on KEY WORDS) and then they work with HR to find people. Clearly if you don't meet basic criteria, the group won't even consider you, but if you do than it doesn't come down to saying things like "LEXIS" in your cover letter.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Nov 14, 2013 3:40 pm

So I've been networking a lot and nearly every single person tells me to change my resume. That's fine and I listen to the advice and revise my resume a lot. But everyone says totally different things. Does it even matter? Are little changes going to make much difference? Are they just giving me the lowest hanging fruit because they can't help me in other ways?

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kalvano
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby kalvano » Thu Nov 14, 2013 3:43 pm

Anonymous User wrote:So I've been networking a lot and nearly every single person tells me to change my resume. That's fine and I listen to the advice and revise my resume a lot. But everyone says totally different things. Does it even matter? Are little changes going to make much difference? Are they just giving me the lowest hanging fruit because they can't help me in other ways?



Everyone has different opinions. Have a non-legal friend look at your résumé, and if thy can figure out yor ranking, school, and sort of what you've done, it's probably good. The biggest thing is to be error-free and give all the information as concisely as possible.

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ilovesf
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby ilovesf » Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:04 pm

Bikeflip wrote:
BarbellDreams wrote:
ilovesf wrote:I'm on the way to the biggest interview ever. I'm so nervous I feel like I'm going to puke. :( if I mess up it will be like I wasted the last year.


Good luck man. The easiest way to interview well is to think of it as simply meeting some nice people.


+1 Do whatever you need to not psych yourself out. If that means go on to their firm profile age and mock their tastes in ties, do that.

(did that back in college for something. kinda worked, sadly :oops:)

Thanks :D I think it actually went really well. The dude interviewing me happened to know everyone I worked for last summer, so we were able to chit chat about that a lot and it set a good tone for the rest of the time.

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BarbellDreams
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BarbellDreams » Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:15 pm

ilovesf wrote:
Bikeflip wrote:
BarbellDreams wrote:
ilovesf wrote:I'm on the way to the biggest interview ever. I'm so nervous I feel like I'm going to puke. :( if I mess up it will be like I wasted the last year.


Good luck man. The easiest way to interview well is to think of it as simply meeting some nice people.


+1 Do whatever you need to not psych yourself out. If that means go on to their firm profile age and mock their tastes in ties, do that.

(did that back in college for something. kinda worked, sadly :oops:)

Thanks :D I think it actually went really well. The dude interviewing me happened to know everyone I worked for last summer, so we were able to chit chat about that a lot and it set a good tone for the rest of the time.


I once got a callback cause my interviewer asked if I knew an attorney from the firm I worked at. Not only did I know her but the writing sample I brought to the interview was a memo written to her and actually had her name on it. After I showed it to him and he saw her name already printed on and knew I wasn't just blowing smoke it kinda seemed like I could have told him that I hated puppies and he still would have given me the callback.

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Bikeflip
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:21 pm

kalvano wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So I've been networking a lot and nearly every single person tells me to change my resume. That's fine and I listen to the advice and revise my resume a lot. But everyone says totally different things. Does it even matter? Are little changes going to make much difference? Are they just giving me the lowest hanging fruit because they can't help me in other ways?



Everyone has different opinions. Have a non-legal friend look at your résumé, and if thy can figure out yor ranking, school, and sort of what you've done, it's probably good. The biggest thing is to be error-free and give all the information as concisely as possible.



This. I'd still take their suggestions into consideration if/when you give your resume to them or anyone connected to them.

For example, one of my buddies who graduated law school during the boom times said he doesn't continue to help people who don't take him, his time, or his advice seriously. The best way to piss him off was to no show, lie or not take his thoughts into consideration. He may sound like a dick, but he's a great resource. I think he's just been burned by going out on a limb for people. Once bitten, twice shy kinda guy.

That said, if you came back to my buddy and said, "I took your changes into consideration, but some other attorney said one thing you suggested isn't a good idea. Did you mean for me to do X instead of Y?" he'd gain a bunch of respect for you for being hungry and talking as many people as possible. Of course, some other attorney somewhere would be offended that you didn't take his entire word as gospel (and that dude probably would be a dick).

whatsyourdeal
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby whatsyourdeal » Thu Nov 14, 2013 5:04 pm

Bikeflip wrote:
kalvano wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So I've been networking a lot and nearly every single person tells me to change my resume. That's fine and I listen to the advice and revise my resume a lot. But everyone says totally different things. Does it even matter? Are little changes going to make much difference? Are they just giving me the lowest hanging fruit because they can't help me in other ways?



Everyone has different opinions. Have a non-legal friend look at your résumé, and if thy can figure out yor ranking, school, and sort of what you've done, it's probably good. The biggest thing is to be error-free and give all the information as concisely as possible.



This. I'd still take their suggestions into consideration if/when you give your resume to them or anyone connected to them.

For example, one of my buddies who graduated law school during the boom times said he doesn't continue to help people who don't take him, his time, or his advice seriously. The best way to piss him off was to no show, lie or not take his thoughts into consideration. He may sound like a dick, but he's a great resource. I think he's just been burned by going out on a limb for people. Once bitten, twice shy kinda guy.

That said, if you came back to my buddy and said, "I took your changes into consideration, but some other attorney said one thing you suggested isn't a good idea. Did you mean for me to do X instead of Y?" he'd gain a bunch of respect for you for being hungry and talking as many people as possible. Of course, some other attorney somewhere would be offended that you didn't take his entire word as gospel (and that dude probably would be a dick).


THIS. So, I tried to help a friend out waiting for bar results by giving him my old job. He interviewed, the job was his, but turned it down because it was less than ideal. Ok, I got it, shitlaw sucks, its not what you envisioned going to law school for, but in this economy, you take what you can get, especially if the job allows you to gain A LOT OF EXPERIENCE and GET PAID AT THE SAME TIME. When he turned it down, I was pissed. Never again.

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Pretzel_Logic
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pretzel_Logic » Thu Nov 14, 2013 5:20 pm

whatsyourdeal wrote:THIS. So, I tried to help a friend out waiting for bar results by giving him my old job. He interviewed, the job was his, but turned it down because it was less than ideal. Ok, I got it, shitlaw sucks, its not what you envisioned going to law school for, but in this economy, you take what you can get, especially if the job allows you to gain A LOT OF EXPERIENCE and GET PAID AT THE SAME TIME. When he turned it down, I was pissed. Never again.


:shock:

Honestly I had a friend do something similar, although I didn't get them the job. I tried to contain my WTF just because this individual was torn up about it, but...geez...

To the anon upthread, are they suggesting substantive changes or stylistic changes?

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Fri Nov 15, 2013 11:29 am

http://www.jdhunter.com/

URL makes it seem sketchy, and maybe it is, but there are a few decent postings there.


Heading to a medium-sized town (for my state) on Monday for a second interview with a company for a non-law job. They said they are very interested, and this round is to determine what group I would be fit in with. Sounds promising, even though the location isn't 100% perfect.

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Bikeflip
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:19 pm

chrisbru wrote:http://www.jdhunter.com/

URL makes it seem sketchy, and maybe it is, but there are a few decent postings there.



Focus

While there are no geographic limits on searches conducted by Legal Search Associates, Inc., most of our clients are in the Midwest, Southwest and Rocky Mountain States.

Regular contact is maintained with legal employers in Kansas City, St. Louis, Chicago, Milwaukee, Minneapolis, Denver, Des Moines, Phoenix, Dallas, Houston and Omaha. Occasional search assignments also arise in other cities in the Midwest and elsewhere.


Not bad for stuff in that area. TY TY bro.

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jessuf
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby jessuf » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:26 pm

A professor told me not to include my GPA on my résumé if its below a 3.75 (which is like top 5% here). I'm around a 3.6, and she said it was too low and to leave off.

Is this good advice? Won't people assume my GPA is bad if I don't include it?

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spleenworship
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby spleenworship » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:28 pm

Had a big interview. Fucked it up. Just totally failed to do anything I had ever learned in trial practice.

I feel like a huge failure and I just want to crawl in a hole and die. Instead I have to finish a motion for an employer in hopes that maybe I can get a good recommendation out of it.

Fuck me.

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:29 pm

Jessuf wrote:A professor told me not to include my GPA on my résumé if its below a 3.75 (which is like top 5% here). I'm around a 3.6, and she said it was too low and to leave off.

Is this good advice? Won't people assume my GPA is bad if I don't include it?


Id say this is bad advice.

ran12
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby ran12 » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:31 pm

Jessuf wrote:A professor told me not to include my GPA on my résumé if its below a 3.75 (which is like top 5% here). I'm around a 3.6, and she said it was too low and to leave off.

Is this good advice? Won't people assume my GPA is bad if I don't include it?


I think that's bad advice. Everything I've ever heard in law and b-school is that if you don't put your gpa down, it's b/c it's under 3.0. A 3.6 is a really good gpa. When's the last time your professor was in the real legal world or any professional world.

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spleenworship
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby spleenworship » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:31 pm

Jessuf wrote:A professor told me not to include my GPA on my résumé if its below a 3.75 (which is like top 5% here). I'm around a 3.6, and she said it was too low and to leave off.

Is this good advice? Won't people assume my GPA is bad if I don't include it?


I'd leave it on provided you follow it up with context (ie top 20% or whatever)

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Bikeflip
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:32 pm

chrisbru wrote:
Jessuf wrote:A professor told me not to include my GPA on my résumé if its below a 3.75 (which is like top 5% here). I'm around a 3.6, and she said it was too low and to leave off.

Is this good advice? Won't people assume my GPA is bad if I don't include it?


Id say this is bad advice.



This. I was told if it starts with a 3.xx, include it, or people will think it's horrific.

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Bikeflip
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:33 pm

spleenworship wrote:Had a big interview. Fucked it up. Just totally failed to do anything I had ever learned in trial practice.

I feel like a huge failure and I just want to crawl in a hole and die. Instead I have to finish a motion for an employer in hopes that maybe I can get a good recommendation out of it.

Fuck me.



Ouch. Hugs brother.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:34 pm

So sorry, spleen.

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jessuf
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby jessuf » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:34 pm

Okay, thanks. I will leave it. My school doesn't rank except for graduation honors, so I can't put any sort of rank on there.

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:43 pm

Jessuf wrote:Okay, thanks. I will leave it. My school doesn't rank except for graduation honors, so I can't put any sort of rank on there.


Can you do an "estimated" rank? A lot of CSO's or whatever will give a green light for saying "estimated top 20%" or something of the sort.

whatsyourdeal
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby whatsyourdeal » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:52 pm

Sorry to hear Spleen. Keep your head up, though, you never know what can happen buddy.

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kalvano
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby kalvano » Fri Nov 15, 2013 3:11 pm

Jessuf wrote:A professor told me not to include my GPA on my résumé if its below a 3.75 (which is like top 5% here). I'm around a 3.6, and she said it was too low and to leave off.

Is this good advice? Won't people assume my GPA is bad if I don't include it?


That's terrible advice.




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