The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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JazzOne
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby JazzOne » Thu Oct 10, 2013 4:13 pm

ragelion wrote:Ridiculous ninja edit.

I'm trying not to be snarky, especially to folks who are struggling in their job search. Been there.

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Pretzel_Logic
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pretzel_Logic » Thu Oct 10, 2013 4:14 pm

chrisbru wrote:This seems like silly logic to me - I thank them at the interview, and show my appreciation by responding to their requests for additional interviews and later, if they were to offer me, accepting their offer. What does a thank you note add to that? Not trying to be a dick, but I'm just thinking from the attorneys' positions... Why would I want to receive a thank you note after an interview?


Dude, we're job hunting. Logic is completely out of the equation right now.

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:07 pm

Pretzel_Logic wrote:
chrisbru wrote:This seems like silly logic to me - I thank them at the interview, and show my appreciation by responding to their requests for additional interviews and later, if they were to offer me, accepting their offer. What does a thank you note add to that? Not trying to be a dick, but I'm just thinking from the attorneys' positions... Why would I want to receive a thank you note after an interview?


Dude, we're job hunting. Logic is completely out of the equation right now.


This is an especially awesome post considering your username :)

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:18 pm

I received a call from a law firm's hr dept to schedule an interview with a partner, and she said she would send me a confirmation email with an employment application and eeo info attached. A day later, I still didn't receive the email. The interview is on Monday. Should I call the hr person to see what happened or just show up on Monday?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:33 pm

Anonymous User wrote:So I had a 3L OCI interview in August. Heard nothing for a month, sent a follow up in mid-September. Heard nothing for another 3 weeks, sent another follow up email a couple days ago. Still haven't gotten a reply.

So, what the fuck does this mean? I did read someone here has been dinged in the past week or so after sending in an app...

Any advice for me? Just sitting here rotting away...

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Lwoods
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Lwoods » Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I received a call from a law firm's hr dept to schedule an interview with a partner, and she said she would send me a confirmation email with an employment application and eeo info attached. A day later, I still didn't receive the email. The interview is on Monday. Should I call the hr person to see what happened or just show up on Monday?

Check your junk mail filter to make surest a not there first.
Call the HR person before 5 tonight if your timezone permits or just after 10am tomorrow morning. If you get voicemail, leave a message. If she doesn't call back / email, just show up to the interview as scheduled.

Sometimes HR folks get swamped.

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kalvano
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby kalvano » Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:53 pm

chrisbru wrote:
Pretzel_Logic wrote:
chrisbru wrote:Does everyone do thank yous? I've never sent a thank you before...


omg yes, I send handwritten ones but at least send an email or something dude.

and good luck with those prospects!


Really though? What's the point? Every actual attorney I've talked to says they don't care about thank yous and prefer not to get them.

Like, come on, I should thank you for taking the time to ask me questions to figure out if I'm the person you want for the opening that you need to fill?


Thank them for taking the time to interview you instead of billing hours. They probably don't much want to be doing it.

I always sent them because why not? It won't hurt you too. Worst case, they completely ignore it. Best case, it gives them a warm fuzzy and they like you more. Interviews are a sales game, and it doesn't hurt anything to take 5 minutes to type out something and send it. In my opinion, it's a professional thing to do, and sends a good message.

Regardless, sounds like you had a great day and best of luck, good sir.

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kalvano
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby kalvano » Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:56 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So I had a 3L OCI interview in August. Heard nothing for a month, sent a follow up in mid-September. Heard nothing for another 3 weeks, sent another follow up email a couple days ago. Still haven't gotten a reply.

So, what the fuck does this mean? I did read someone here has been dinged in the past week or so after sending in an app...

Any advice for me? Just sitting here rotting away...



It's a shitty situation. Not being dinged is good, but being "on hold" blows. My summer firm did that to me and it pissed me off no end. Just be professional, keep following up (maybe call instead of email) and keep pursuing other opportunities. You aren't rejected until you're rejected.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 10, 2013 8:09 pm

kalvano wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So I had a 3L OCI interview in August. Heard nothing for a month, sent a follow up in mid-September. Heard nothing for another 3 weeks, sent another follow up email a couple days ago. Still haven't gotten a reply.

So, what the fuck does this mean? I did read someone here has been dinged in the past week or so after sending in an app...

Any advice for me? Just sitting here rotting away...



It's a shitty situation. Not being dinged is good, but being "on hold" blows. My summer firm did that to me and it pissed me off no end. Just be professional, keep following up (maybe call instead of email) and keep pursuing other opportunities. You aren't rejected until you're rejected.

I think their utter lack of communication is what is annoying me the most.

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mr. wednesday
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby mr. wednesday » Thu Oct 10, 2013 8:46 pm

fish tacos wrote:What exactly will you be doing at the Big4? I assume if they came to your law school's OCI it must be at least tangentially related to law, enough so that if you keep up your bar admission and stay active in the local bar you can move out to a firm eventually. I assume it's nothing as "legal" as the in-house legal department, but you mentioned it would be tax and transactional related. So what is your job title? If it's anything close to law, I'd take it and not look back.

Plus if you really want to do tax law, there is the opportunity to work enough to pay down debts and save up, then go to one of the 1-2 decent tax LLM programs. I think you can even do NYU's at night one class at a time but I'm not 100% on that. So that gives you another opportunity to try to move from law-ish to law in 5 years or so.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:14 pm

mr. wednesday wrote:
fish tacos wrote:What exactly will you be doing at the Big4? I assume if they came to your law school's OCI it must be at least tangentially related to law, enough so that if you keep up your bar admission and stay active in the local bar you can move out to a firm eventually. I assume it's nothing as "legal" as the in-house legal department, but you mentioned it would be tax and transactional related. So what is your job title? If it's anything close to law, I'd take it and not look back.

Plus if you really want to do tax law, there is the opportunity to work enough to pay down debts and save up, then go to one of the 1-2 decent tax LLM programs. I think you can even do NYU's at night one class at a time but I'm not 100% on that. So that gives you another opportunity to try to move from law-ish to law in 5 years or so.


My roommate from college did the Law School to Big4 tax consulting route and he's a currently registered attorney. Don't know if that means anything or if you can lateral eventually.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby sparty99 » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:56 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I've been following this thread since the summer. I'm currently a 3L at a lower TT. I'm top 15%, e-board of secondary journal, specialty moot court, 4 years w/e before law school. I struck out at my school's small OCI. I hustled at 2L job fairs and had 3 CBs with big firms in different markets, but didn't get an offer. I worked balls my 2L summer working 2 state gov't internships to get experience. Then this fall I only got 1 interview from my school's tiny 3L OCI. Did the CB last week. Got the offer today.

The thing is that it's not a job practicing law. It's with a Big 4 accounting firm, secondary market. It's a market I have fairly strong interest in.

I have slightly over $100k in debt combined from UG and LS. It feels irresponsible to even consider turning the offer down in this job market given my school rank & stats.

But I came to law school because I want to practice law. My preliminary research indicates that it is really hard to switch from B4 to any size law firm. And I'm afraid I'm going to be pigeonholed into tax/transactional for the entire rest of my career, even if I successfully make the jump to a law firm in a few years. I'm interested in tax, which is why I applied in the first place. But I partially thought I had no chance at the job because I was so used to being rejected from everything.

The advice on this thread is the most grounded I've found in my 3+ years browsing this site. Thoughts?


OMG. TAKE THE DAMN JOB!!!! They are going to pay you money and Big 4 is good for the resume. People go from Big 4 to law firms. They also go from Big 4 to other, better places. You would be a fool not to take the job. At least take and keep looking.

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Borhas
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Borhas » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:02 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I've been following this thread since the summer. I'm currently a 3L at a lower TT. I'm top 15%, e-board of secondary journal, specialty moot court, 4 years w/e before law school. I struck out at my school's small OCI. I hustled at 2L job fairs and had 3 CBs with big firms in different markets, but didn't get an offer. I worked balls my 2L summer working 2 state gov't internships to get experience. Then this fall I only got 1 interview from my school's tiny 3L OCI. Did the CB last week. Got the offer today.

The thing is that it's not a job practicing law. It's with a Big 4 accounting firm, secondary market. It's a market I have fairly strong interest in.

I have slightly over $100k in debt combined from UG and LS. It feels irresponsible to even consider turning the offer down in this job market given my school rank & stats.

But I came to law school because I want to practice law. My preliminary research indicates that it is really hard to switch from B4 to any size law firm. And I'm afraid I'm going to be pigeonholed into tax/transactional for the entire rest of my career, even if I successfully make the jump to a law firm in a few years. I'm interested in tax, which is why I applied in the first place. But I partially thought I had no chance at the job because I was so used to being rejected from everything.

The advice on this thread is the most grounded I've found in my 3+ years browsing this site. Thoughts?


what's the starting salary?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:59 pm

fish tacos wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I've been following this thread since the summer. I'm currently a 3L at a lower TT. I'm top 15%, e-board of secondary journal, specialty moot court, 4 years w/e before law school. I struck out at my school's small OCI. I hustled at 2L job fairs and had 3 CBs with big firms in different markets, but didn't get an offer. I worked balls my 2L summer working 2 state gov't internships to get experience. Then this fall I only got 1 interview from my school's tiny 3L OCI. Did the CB last week. Got the offer today.

The thing is that it's not a job practicing law. It's with a Big 4 accounting firm, secondary market. It's a market I have fairly strong interest in.

I have slightly over $100k in debt combined from UG and LS. It feels irresponsible to even consider turning the offer down in this job market given my school rank & stats.

But I came to law school because I want to practice law. My preliminary research indicates that it is really hard to switch from B4 to any size law firm. And I'm afraid I'm going to be pigeonholed into tax/transactional for the entire rest of my career, even if I successfully make the jump to a law firm in a few years. I'm interested in tax, which is why I applied in the first place. But I partially thought I had no chance at the job because I was so used to being rejected from everything.

The advice on this thread is the most grounded I've found in my 3+ years browsing this site. Thoughts?



What exactly will you be doing at the Big4? I assume if they came to your law school's OCI it must be at least tangentially related to law, enough so that if you keep up your bar admission and stay active in the local bar you can move out to a firm eventually. I assume it's nothing as "legal" as the in-house legal department, but you mentioned it would be tax and transactional related. So what is your job title? If it's anything close to law, I'd take it and not look back.


OP here: Position title is Tax Consultant. First couple of years sitting in a cubicle, doing compliance (read: corporate tax returns).

Salary is lower than what most mid-law firms pay in my region. But I do know that there can be aggressive pay raises in the B4, so there is opportunity to catch up in 2-3 years.

A few people have suggested taking the job and reneging if I get something better. I'm honestly not sure how wise that is in a smaller community.

But I appreciate everyone's feedback tremendously.

rad lulz
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby rad lulz » Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:01 pm

Take the damn job

Of course it pays less than the mid law firms

But you're probably not gonna get that midlaw job

Big4 tax consulting is a good job

You know what they say about birds in the hand

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BarbellDreams » Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:15 pm

rad lulz wrote:Take the damn job

Of course it pays less than the mid law firms

But you're probably not gonna get that midlaw job

Big4 tax consulting is a good job

You know what they say about birds in the hand


This.

Dude asking has to be a 3L cause any graduate would have felt the pain of the Vale enough to have jumped at this offer by now.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pretzel_Logic » Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:48 pm

Bird in the hand, bro. Take the job--it's not like you can't ever leave, and especially if there's loans in the equation, dat job security is going to feel pretty legit in a year when you graduate (I'm assuming 3L).

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:19 am

Anonymous User wrote:
fish tacos wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I've been following this thread since the summer. I'm currently a 3L at a lower TT. I'm top 15%, e-board of secondary journal, specialty moot court, 4 years w/e before law school. I struck out at my school's small OCI. I hustled at 2L job fairs and had 3 CBs with big firms in different markets, but didn't get an offer. I worked balls my 2L summer working 2 state gov't internships to get experience. Then this fall I only got 1 interview from my school's tiny 3L OCI. Did the CB last week. Got the offer today.

The thing is that it's not a job practicing law. It's with a Big 4 accounting firm, secondary market. It's a market I have fairly strong interest in.

I have slightly over $100k in debt combined from UG and LS. It feels irresponsible to even consider turning the offer down in this job market given my school rank & stats.

But I came to law school because I want to practice law. My preliminary research indicates that it is really hard to switch from B4 to any size law firm. And I'm afraid I'm going to be pigeonholed into tax/transactional for the entire rest of my career, even if I successfully make the jump to a law firm in a few years. I'm interested in tax, which is why I applied in the first place. But I partially thought I had no chance at the job because I was so used to being rejected from everything.

The advice on this thread is the most grounded I've found in my 3+ years browsing this site. Thoughts?



What exactly will you be doing at the Big4? I assume if they came to your law school's OCI it must be at least tangentially related to law, enough so that if you keep up your bar admission and stay active in the local bar you can move out to a firm eventually. I assume it's nothing as "legal" as the in-house legal department, but you mentioned it would be tax and transactional related. So what is your job title? If it's anything close to law, I'd take it and not look back.


OP here: Position title is Tax Consultant. First couple of years sitting in a cubicle, doing compliance (read: corporate tax returns).

Salary is lower than what most mid-law firms pay in my region. But I do know that there can be aggressive pay raises in the B4, so there is opportunity to catch up in 2-3 years.

A few people have suggested taking the job and reneging if I get something better. I'm honestly not sure how wise that is in a smaller community.

But I appreciate everyone's feedback tremendously.


TAKE. THE. JOB.


I was a 3L with similar stats as you, but I went to a much better school. I only got one offer. What makes you think you'll be different?

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Fri Oct 11, 2013 12:51 pm

Bros,

My roommate and good friend was offered a great job this morning, and I'm super stoked for him. But it's with the same firm that offered me a callback yesterday less than 24 hours after my initial interview that I was super hopeful about.

I haven't heard anything about them canceling my callback, but now I'm nervous that they will just go through the motions even though there may not be a job to offer me :/

whatsyourdeal
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby whatsyourdeal » Fri Oct 11, 2013 12:54 pm

chrisbru wrote:Bros,

My roommate and good friend was offered a great job this morning, and I'm super stoked for him. But it's with the same firm that offered me a callback yesterday less than 24 hours after my initial interview that I was super hopeful about.

I haven't heard anything about them canceling my callback, but now I'm nervous that they will just go through the motions even though there may not be a job to offer me :/


don't want to keep your hopes up, but it ain't over til its over.

keep hustling, keep applying to other spots, go out tonight and take your mind off it a bit.

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:05 pm

whatsyourdeal wrote:
chrisbru wrote:Bros,

My roommate and good friend was offered a great job this morning, and I'm super stoked for him. But it's with the same firm that offered me a callback yesterday less than 24 hours after my initial interview that I was super hopeful about.

I haven't heard anything about them canceling my callback, but now I'm nervous that they will just go through the motions even though there may not be a job to offer me :/


don't want to keep your hopes up, but it ain't over til its over.

keep hustling, keep applying to other spots, go out tonight and take your mind off it a bit.


Oh, I wasn't anywhere near stopping applying. And we'll obviously be going out to celebrate his offer... But that makes it hard not to think about.

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spleenworship
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby spleenworship » Fri Oct 11, 2013 4:31 pm

Maybe they have several positions to fill?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:42 pm

chrisbru wrote:Bros,

My roommate and good friend was offered a great job this morning, and I'm super stoked for him. But it's with the same firm that offered me a callback yesterday less than 24 hours after my initial interview that I was super hopeful about.

I haven't heard anything about them canceling my callback, but now I'm nervous that they will just go through the motions even though there may not be a job to offer me :/


Had almost the EXACT thing happened to me. His interview was a week before mine. BigLaw usually is quick with offers, so they offered him a position before I interviewed. It was a small office, so I know my chances were slim to begin with. Sucked it up went on with the interview, and did my best because that's really all you can do. In the end I didn't get the gig. After the interview they sent a letter stating that they had already filled all their vacancies. Wish there was a happy ending. All you can do is go in there and kill it but be realistic at the same time. Either way I'm rooting for you. Good luck!

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Bigbub75
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bigbub75 » Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:43 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
chrisbru wrote:Bros,

My roommate and good friend was offered a great job this morning, and I'm super stoked for him. But it's with the same firm that offered me a callback yesterday less than 24 hours after my initial interview that I was super hopeful about.

I haven't heard anything about them canceling my callback, but now I'm nervous that they will just go through the motions even though there may not be a job to offer me :/


Had almost the EXACT thing happened to me. His interview was a week before mine. BigLaw usually is quick with offers, so they offered him a position before I interviewed. It was a small office, so I know my chances were slim to begin with. Sucked it up went on with the interview, and did my best because that's really all you can do. In the end I didn't get the gig. After the interview they sent a letter stating that they had already filled all their vacancies. Wish there was a happy ending. All you can do is go in there and kill it but be realistic at the same time. Either way I'm rooting for you. Good luck!


Anon by mistake.

stressed2010
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby stressed2010 » Sat Oct 12, 2013 3:30 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
fish tacos wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I've been following this thread since the summer. I'm currently a 3L at a lower TT. I'm top 15%, e-board of secondary journal, specialty moot court, 4 years w/e before law school. I struck out at my school's small OCI. I hustled at 2L job fairs and had 3 CBs with big firms in different markets, but didn't get an offer. I worked balls my 2L summer working 2 state gov't internships to get experience. Then this fall I only got 1 interview from my school's tiny 3L OCI. Did the CB last week. Got the offer today.

The thing is that it's not a job practicing law. It's with a Big 4 accounting firm, secondary market. It's a market I have fairly strong interest in.

I have slightly over $100k in debt combined from UG and LS. It feels irresponsible to even consider turning the offer down in this job market given my school rank & stats.

But I came to law school because I want to practice law. My preliminary research indicates that it is really hard to switch from B4 to any size law firm. And I'm afraid I'm going to be pigeonholed into tax/transactional for the entire rest of my career, even if I successfully make the jump to a law firm in a few years. I'm interested in tax, which is why I applied in the first place. But I partially thought I had no chance at the job because I was so used to being rejected from everything.

The advice on this thread is the most grounded I've found in my 3+ years browsing this site. Thoughts?



What exactly will you be doing at the Big4? I assume if they came to your law school's OCI it must be at least tangentially related to law, enough so that if you keep up your bar admission and stay active in the local bar you can move out to a firm eventually. I assume it's nothing as "legal" as the in-house legal department, but you mentioned it would be tax and transactional related. So what is your job title? If it's anything close to law, I'd take it and not look back.


OP here: Position title is Tax Consultant. First couple of years sitting in a cubicle, doing compliance (read: corporate tax returns).

Salary is lower than what most mid-law firms pay in my region. But I do know that there can be aggressive pay raises in the B4, so there is opportunity to catch up in 2-3 years.

A few people have suggested taking the job and reneging if I get something better. I'm honestly not sure how wise that is in a smaller community.

But I appreciate everyone's feedback tremendously.


TAKE. THE. JOB.


I was a 3L with similar stats as you, but I went to a much better school. I only got one offer. What makes you think you'll be different?





Definitely take the job. A girl from my school started at one of the Big 4 and within 8 months landed a big law gig in their tax department. I'm in the philadelphia market, sounds like the secondary market you're talking about. So yes there is hope that you'll be able to transition into law. I think firms are understanding that it's a ridiculous job market right now and quite honestly having ANY work experience whatsoever puts you ahead of 50% of law graduates who are struggling to even find their first jobs. We live in scary times.




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