The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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Gorki
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Gorki » Mon Sep 09, 2013 11:11 pm

Jessuf wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Anyone applying to the EJW fair in DC?

I applied to ~10 positions, then realized I have class that entire weekend and can't go.


Ask the prof, and if that fails go over the prof to the dean. Just make it clear that you will be filing an "unemployed" on the 9 month survey more likely than not if they are not flexible.

Some profs are so out of touch about missing class, but administration will bitchslap them back into their rightful submission if you work it right. Wish you the best.

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BlueLotus
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BlueLotus » Mon Sep 09, 2013 11:27 pm

Gorki wrote:
Jessuf wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Anyone applying to the EJW fair in DC?

I applied to ~10 positions, then realized I have class that entire weekend and can't go.


Ask the prof, and if that fails go over the prof to the dean. Just make it clear that you will be filing an "unemployed" on the 9 month survey more likely than not if they are not flexible.

Some profs are so out of touch about missing class, but administration will bitchslap them back into their rightful submission if you work it right. Wish you the best.


+1. Don't let some shitboomer profs prevent you from making the jerb hunt a priority. EJW has been a valuable experience for many TLS'ers (See: folks of the PD/Prosecution thread who have gotten a leg up thru table talk even if they weren't offered an interview)

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 10, 2013 4:53 am

I don't think I've ever felt so hopeless in my entire life. Not to mention, been this broke. My only hope lies in two government jobs that say are interested but are keeping me hanging. I pray every night before crying myself to sleep that one of those works out...

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:27 am

Another idea y'all might want to consider: law jobs in a foreign legal system. The UK (and many Commonwealth countries) have relatively simple conversion courses, so consider firing off training contract applications to places in the UK (especially if you're a citizen of an EU country and thus wouldn't need a work permit). The pay isn't as good (about 1/2-2/3 US biglaw, with a high COL in London), and it would probably mean 18-24 months more school (with the firm paying your fees - do NOT do this unless that's the case), but it's still better than the dole. UK hiring season ends later than US, so it's something to consider. Ideally, you would want to apply to the Christmas or Easter "vacation schemes" (2-3 week mini-SA gigs) first, but most firms consider direct training contract applications. Check out Chambers UK Student or the big London firms' websites for details.

sparty99
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby sparty99 » Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:42 am

Jessuf wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Anyone applying to the EJW fair in DC?

I applied to ~10 positions, then realized I have class that entire weekend and can't go.


You are kidding, right? You are going to let a lame 3L class prevent you from finding a potential job that will make you employed and put food on your table. This isn't up for debate. YOU GO. PERIOD.

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:47 am

So, there was a job bank posted a while ago from BYU (I think) that I've checked out a few times. I clicked on my saved link, and it appears to be gone now. Does anyone know if this is still an option? I'm trying to find job postings in Minneapolis :/

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:52 am

Anonymous User wrote:I don't think I've ever felt so hopeless in my entire life. Not to mention, been this broke. My only hope lies in two government jobs that say are interested but are keeping me hanging. I pray every night before crying myself to sleep that one of those works out...


I'm sorry bud. Been where you are. Keep your head up and keep grinding.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:59 am

So I have an interview with a staffing agency today.. for a position that has nothing to do with the law. The resume I submitted does not include my JD, legal experiences, etc, because I didn't want to be overqualified. For anyone else who has dealt with this, do you tell the interviewer what you've been doing the past three years? Even if they specifically ask?

It feels weirdly deceptive, and I'm wondering if a staffing agency can discover all this with a background check anyway. Should I just disclose?

Sad that it's come to this.

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TTH
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby TTH » Tue Sep 10, 2013 1:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:So I have an interview with a staffing agency today.. for a position that has nothing to do with the law. The resume I submitted does not include my JD, legal experiences, etc, because I didn't want to be overqualified. For anyone else who has dealt with this, do you tell the interviewer what you've been doing the past three years? Even if they specifically ask?

It feels weirdly deceptive, and I'm wondering if a staffing agency can discover all this with a background check anyway. Should I just disclose?

Sad that it's come to this.


It is sad that it's come to this. Sorry for your troubles, bro.

I wouldn't go out of your way to discuss it, especially if you left it off the rez. If you get asked a direct question about it, I suppose you could tell the truth.

Is the staffing agency trying to place you into a permanent position or a temp job? If it's temp, they probably won't care as much. If it's permanent, maybe they will. I suppose you could lie and say you had a baby three years ago, and as between you and your make believe SO, the two of you decided that you would be the one who stayed home.

I don't know what kind of background check would reveal you went to law school, unless they do a thorough check for like a security clearance or something. I assume you haven't been sworn in as an attorney yet, so any search of a state database for professional licenses shouldn't return anything, and the standard credit check type BG searches wouldn't reveal anything (other than your student loans maybe? Which I suppose would give it up).

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Borhas
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Borhas » Tue Sep 10, 2013 2:09 pm

Jessuf wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Anyone applying to the EJW fair in DC?

I applied to ~10 positions, then realized I have class that entire weekend and can't go.


You've been on tls long enough to know better

I got my job at EJW, it's competitive but it's one of the few ways to get non profit/gov gigs before graduation

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Bikeflip
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Tue Sep 10, 2013 2:20 pm

chrisbru wrote:So, there was a job bank posted a while ago from BYU (I think) that I've checked out a few times. I clicked on my saved link, and it appears to be gone now. Does anyone know if this is still an option? I'm trying to find job postings in Minneapolis :/



https://www.law2.byu.edu/Career_Services/jobbank/

Username: jobfind Password: EmployUs

Pokemon
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Pokemon » Tue Sep 10, 2013 2:35 pm

Love the password. It sounds so desperate... After its publication on TLS, administration will change it to employus...prettyplease

Gainfully Unemployed
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Gainfully Unemployed » Tue Sep 10, 2013 5:51 pm

Alright Valers, I need advice. I've found a job posting that I'm actually really interested in pursuing. The firm has around 50 attorneys with three offices on or around the border of my home state. Apparently they're hiring an entry-level attorney for each of their offices, to begin in 2014 (I'm currently a 3L). I go to a top 30 in a completely different region of the country, but I went to undergrad in my home state. I'm pretty sure I can sell my geographic connection just fine. Here's what I need to know:

1) The firm's call for applications includes the following: "Candidates with an interest in litigation or transactional practice, or both, are welcomed."

I'm wondering if I should specify in my cover letter that I'm interested in one or the other. Really, I'm interested in both - mainly because I just want a job, but also because I haven't really settled on a specific practice area. It seems like new attorneys at this firm go to meetings in both litigation and business practice groups (at least at first), but would it look bad to simply say that I'm interested in either?

2) I have an unconventional possible connection to the firm, and I'm wondering if I should try to exploit it. I was creeping through their webpage, and I discovered that I went to high school with one of their paralegals. I don't really know the girl - we're not even facebook friend - but I'm sure she'd recognize my name. Should I send her an email or something? Would that be totally creepy?

3) It seems like the bulk of this firms attorneys work in State A, but they do have one office in State B, where I grew up. The State B office is right on the border of the two states, and I'm pretty sure the firm's main office is right on the other side. I would prefer to work in the State B office, but I'm totally fine with either one. How should I convey this information in my application?

Any other advice y'all could give me would be great. I'm also wondering how competitive positions in middle-of-nowhere markets are. There aren't more than 80,000 people in any of the cities where this firm has an office.

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legalese_retard
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby legalese_retard » Tue Sep 10, 2013 6:01 pm

Gainfully Unemployed wrote:Alright Valers, I need advice. I've found a job posting that I'm actually really interested in pursuing. The firm has around 50 attorneys with three offices on or around the border of my home state. Apparently they're hiring an entry-level attorney for each of their offices, to begin in 2014 (I'm currently a 3L). I go to a top 30 in a completely different region of the country, but I went to undergrad in my home state. I'm pretty sure I can sell my geographic connection just fine. Here's what I need to know:

1) The firm's call for applications includes the following: "Candidates with an interest in litigation or transactional practice, or both, are welcomed."

I'm wondering if I should specify in my cover letter that I'm interested in one or the other. Really, I'm interested in both - mainly because I just want a job, but also because I haven't really settled on a specific practice area. It seems like new attorneys at this firm go to meetings in both litigation and business practice groups (at least at first), but would it look bad to simply say that I'm interested in either?

2) I have an unconventional possible connection to the firm, and I'm wondering if I should try to exploit it. I was creeping through their webpage, and I discovered that I went to high school with one of their paralegals. I don't really know the girl - we're not even facebook friend - but I'm sure she'd recognize my name. Should I send her an email or something? Would that be totally creepy?

3) It seems like the bulk of this firms attorneys work in State A, but they do have one office in State B, where I grew up. The State B office is right on the border of the two states, and I'm pretty sure the firm's main office is right on the other side. I would prefer to work in the State B office, but I'm totally fine with either one. How should I convey this information in my application?

Any other advice y'all could give me would be great. I'm also wondering how competitive positions in middle-of-nowhere markets are. There aren't more than 80,000 people in any of the cities where this firm has an office.


(1) If you are fine with either practice, say both.

(2) If her email address is on the firm's website, I see no harm in contacting her. If she doesn't remember you or doesn't respond, I see no foul.

(3) If the job posting expressly asks you to say what is your preferred office, you can provide them with your preference. If not, it is better to convey that info if you get an interview.

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a male human
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby a male human » Tue Sep 10, 2013 8:28 pm

a male human wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Anybody have success with following up? It only seems to hasten the rejection process.

I plan to call tomorrow morning. Will report back.

Called and left a message. Got an email a few hours later saying she doesn't "have any matters at the moment needing attention, although that can always change in the future." Ah, it was a letdown after waiting 10 days for a response. However, she did say the other partner has some work if I'm interested. It may not be in my area of interest, though.

Advice on working on something that could be tangentially related, possibly for free? Is having any legal experience worth it?

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BarbellDreams
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BarbellDreams » Tue Sep 10, 2013 10:01 pm

a male human wrote:
a male human wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Anybody have success with following up? It only seems to hasten the rejection process.

I plan to call tomorrow morning. Will report back.

Called and left a message. Got an email a few hours later saying she doesn't "have any matters at the moment needing attention, although that can always change in the future." Ah, it was a letdown after waiting 10 days for a response. However, she did say the other partner has some work if I'm interested. It may not be in my area of interest, though.

Advice on working on something that could be tangentially related, possibly for free? Is having any legal experience worth it?


If you have no other options and this isn't a huge time commitment I don't see why not. If you don't have anything by December that resume blank is gonna be a bitch.

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deadpanic
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby deadpanic » Tue Sep 10, 2013 10:30 pm

BarbellDreams wrote:
a male human wrote:
a male human wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Anybody have success with following up? It only seems to hasten the rejection process.

I plan to call tomorrow morning. Will report back.

Called and left a message. Got an email a few hours later saying she doesn't "have any matters at the moment needing attention, although that can always change in the future." Ah, it was a letdown after waiting 10 days for a response. However, she did say the other partner has some work if I'm interested. It may not be in my area of interest, though.

Advice on working on something that could be tangentially related, possibly for free? Is having any legal experience worth it?


If you have no other options and this isn't a huge time commitment I don't see why not. If you don't have anything by December that resume blank is gonna be a bitch.


Man...you're telling the truth, but you're stressing me out.

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BarbellDreams
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby BarbellDreams » Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:38 pm

deadpanic wrote:
Man...you're telling the truth, but you're stressing me out.


Haha, I'm stressing myself out. I'm keeping it together alright but I can't guarantee thats gonna last too long if I don't have something a month or two after bar results are out. I know 2 people who are already filing LLC paperwork for solo practices because there is simply nothing out there. I have about 60 apps out with zero interviews in the past month and a half and I have pretty strong stats/resume.

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TTH
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby TTH » Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:30 am

Hey Bros,

If my USAJOBS app has been "referred to selecting official," how good of a sign is that? Anyone know roughly how many apps get pushed forward to that step versus how many get calls for interviews?

lukertin
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby lukertin » Wed Sep 11, 2013 11:53 am

TTH wrote:Hey Bros,

If my USAJOBS app has been "referred to selecting official," how good of a sign is that? Anyone know roughly how many apps get pushed forward to that step versus how many get calls for interviews?

It means HR didn't reject your app on the basis of your not meeting qualifications. The guy who decides whether you get an interview is now looking at your resume and stuff. What happens next depends entirely on the agency and position.

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Wed Sep 11, 2013 12:05 pm

Bikeflip wrote:
chrisbru wrote:So, there was a job bank posted a while ago from BYU (I think) that I've checked out a few times. I clicked on my saved link, and it appears to be gone now. Does anyone know if this is still an option? I'm trying to find job postings in Minneapolis :/



https://www.law2.byu.edu/Career_Services/jobbank/

Username: jobfind Password: EmployUs


Thanks man, much appreciation.

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:04 pm

legalese_retard wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
sparty99 wrote:If you go to HYS, you should not worry.......Apply even outside law. A HYS degree is GOLDEN.


I hope you're right, dude, but I personally know at least 3 people from the class above mine who were unemployed upon (or at least very close to) graduation and they were, like me, very firm-centric. HYS definitely isn't as bulletproof as the world seems to believe. Thanks to those who suggested bankruptcy clerkships. They seem like at least a semi-viable option. As someone who knows next to nothing about clerkships, are bankruptcy/Delaware clerkships any more difficult than the average?


What markets are you targeting? Not sure if you have any interest in Texas, but Baker Botts in Austin is looking:

We are seeking an entry level corporate (M&A and capital
markets) associate. The ideal candidate will have attained a high
level of academic achievement. Outstanding offers from 2L
clerkships with firms with corporate departments will be also be
viewed favorably.
The position will start in the fall of 2014.

contact: Ms. Lindsey Kucharksi
Coordinator, Recruiting & Development
98 San Jacinto Boulevard Suite 1500 Austin, Texas 78701-4078
lindsey.kucharski@bakerbotts.com


I applied to this position as soon as I saw it posted here, and unfortunately just got a message back saying they are way past interviewing for this position. Kinda annoyed my school is not actively looking for job postings like this, just sitting on its laurels for firms to post on symplicity.

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:09 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
legalese_retard wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
sparty99 wrote:If you go to HYS, you should not worry.......Apply even outside law. A HYS degree is GOLDEN.


I hope you're right, dude, but I personally know at least 3 people from the class above mine who were unemployed upon (or at least very close to) graduation and they were, like me, very firm-centric. HYS definitely isn't as bulletproof as the world seems to believe. Thanks to those who suggested bankruptcy clerkships. They seem like at least a semi-viable option. As someone who knows next to nothing about clerkships, are bankruptcy/Delaware clerkships any more difficult than the average?


What markets are you targeting? Not sure if you have any interest in Texas, but Baker Botts in Austin is looking:

We are seeking an entry level corporate (M&A and capital
markets) associate. The ideal candidate will have attained a high
level of academic achievement. Outstanding offers from 2L
clerkships with firms with corporate departments will be also be
viewed favorably.
The position will start in the fall of 2014.

contact: Ms. Lindsey Kucharksi
Coordinator, Recruiting & Development
98 San Jacinto Boulevard Suite 1500 Austin, Texas 78701-4078
lindsey.kucharski@bakerbotts.com


I applied to this position as soon as I saw it posted here, and unfortunately just got a message back saying they are way past interviewing for this position. Kinda annoyed my school is not actively looking for job postings like this, just sitting on its laurels for firms to post on symplicity.


I just got the same message and I thought it was not one of the boilerplate rejections I usually get :? 8) :x

EDIT: From the way I saw it you didn't have a chance unless you had a 2L SA.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Bikeflip
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Bikeflip » Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I applied to this position as soon as I saw it posted here, and unfortunately just got a message back saying they are way past interviewing for this position. Kinda annoyed my school is not actively looking for job postings like this, just sitting on its laurels for firms to post on symplicity.



Welcome to how CDOs treat their 3Ls.

Anonymous User
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:40 pm

A firm I called back at during 2L year has a job posting up. Do you think it would be wise to discuss in my cover letter how impressed I was with the firm during call backs, or would it be best to leave that off?




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