The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

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sparty99
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby sparty99 » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:19 pm

I would LOVE to make $60-70k as a lawyer.

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:23 pm

Bros,

My ex randomly met a partner at a great firm that I want to work to at a bar last night. Without knowing who the guy was, she apparently talked a lot about me, and the guy was like hey, he sounds like the kind of guy we want at our firm, can you put me in touch with him?

Good sign I hope... But should I reach out to him or give him a few days and see if he contacts me first?

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a male human
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby a male human » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:26 pm

chrisbru wrote:Bros,

My ex randomly met a partner at a great firm that I want to work to at a bar last night. Without knowing who the guy was, she apparently talked a lot about me, and the guy was like hey, he sounds like the kind of guy we want at our firm, can you put me in touch with him?

Good sign I hope... But should I reach out to him or give him a few days and see if he contacts me first?

Gives me an idea to hire someone to stalk partners, bump into them and vouch for me.

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:28 pm

a male human wrote:
chrisbru wrote:Bros,

My ex randomly met a partner at a great firm that I want to work to at a bar last night. Without knowing who the guy was, she apparently talked a lot about me, and the guy was like hey, he sounds like the kind of guy we want at our firm, can you put me in touch with him?

Good sign I hope... But should I reach out to him or give him a few days and see if he contacts me first?

Gives me an idea to hire someone to stalk partners, bump into them and vouch for me.


To be fair, she wasn't vouching for me. She basically told him I was a huge pompous asshole who only took the LSAT so I could beat her score (partially true). I guess that's the kind of dude they go for.

*disclaimer* This is my ex's opinion of me, don't judge :D



TheBeard wrote:Take beach's advice, pick up a pt clerk gig now. I'm one of a lucky few who didn't do this but still managed to land a decent gig. I am, however, an exception at my firm since everyone else who was hired clerked as 3Ls. Also, stay persistent. Follow up on every resume you forward until you hear a decision. I applied for my gig in late July and got my offer in April of the following year. I never stopped insisting, and it seems like it paid off.


These aren't that easy to get though (depending on what city you live in I guess?) I've tried the last two years and couldn't snag anything.

rad lulz
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby rad lulz » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:47 pm

chrisbru wrote:Bros,

My ex randomly met a partner at a great firm that I want to work to at a bar last night. Without knowing who the guy was, she apparently talked a lot about me, and the guy was like hey, he sounds like the kind of guy we want at our firm, can you put me in touch with him?

Good sign I hope... But should I reach out to him or give him a few days and see if he contacts me first?

He will probably forget.

You initiate

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:49 pm

rad lulz wrote:
chrisbru wrote:Bros,

My ex randomly met a partner at a great firm that I want to work to at a bar last night. Without knowing who the guy was, she apparently talked a lot about me, and the guy was like hey, he sounds like the kind of guy we want at our firm, can you put me in touch with him?

Good sign I hope... But should I reach out to him or give him a few days and see if he contacts me first?

He will probably forget.

You initiate


That's all I needed to hear, working on a cover letter now and will email him this afternoon sometime.



Edit: What should I put for the subject of the email?

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a male human
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby a male human » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:51 pm

chrisbru wrote:
rad lulz wrote:
chrisbru wrote:Bros,

My ex randomly met a partner at a great firm that I want to work to at a bar last night. Without knowing who the guy was, she apparently talked a lot about me, and the guy was like hey, he sounds like the kind of guy we want at our firm, can you put me in touch with him?

Good sign I hope... But should I reach out to him or give him a few days and see if he contacts me first?

He will probably forget.

You initiate


That's all I needed to hear, working on a cover letter now and will email him this afternoon sometime.

Would you mention your ex, though?

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chrisbru
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby chrisbru » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:53 pm

a male human wrote:
chrisbru wrote:That's all I needed to hear, working on a cover letter now and will email him this afternoon sometime.

Would you mention your ex, though?


Absolutely. I'm not sure if she told him we dated or just referred to me as a friend (we're still pretty close). I feel like I have to mention it to trigger his memory.

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kalvano
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby kalvano » Sun Aug 25, 2013 5:40 pm

I have decided that when I finally get a job, when people ask what I do, I will tell them "slinging law and stacking Benjies."

I don't know why, but that amuses me.

NYstate
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby NYstate » Sun Aug 25, 2013 6:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I never imagined myself living in a place like this, but being part of this thread is making me appreciate how lucky I am to have the opportunity. My credentials would have given me interviews at most firms in the country last year, but it's amazing how one year and a no-offer make such a difference.


I'm the top 5 from the T-14 that's been posting here. This captures how I feel. Was told by CSO on Friday that my only hope is starting $60,000 to $70,000 at a shitlaw sweatshop and angling to move up to a second tier firm after three or four years. Pretty certain the career's over at this point because I can't bring myself to do that--with my level of debt, it doesn't make sense, especially in light of the hours and stress such a job entails. Got nothing for clerkships. I'm about 99% certain it's because of the employment situation. Was directly asked about it by a 9th Circuit and Central District of California judge (truth be told, it was the clerks who asked), and it came up in other circuit judge interviews as well.

Am starting to have fantasies about some top firm seeing my posts and contacting me with a job/interview invitation. Also fantasize about going on food stamps and using my story to become a special contributor to AbovetheLaw.


Can you get any school funded fellowship and keep looking for clerkships that start a year out as suggested by others?
If not law, what else will you do?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby a male human » Sun Aug 25, 2013 7:27 pm

kalvano wrote:I have decided that when I finally get a job, when people ask what I do, I will tell them "slinging law and stacking Benjies."

I don't know why, but that amuses me.


i tell people i'm looking for a job because "you know how it is" in the legal market. i've been calling it a "job quest" to give it a more positive spin.

but i answer online surveys with "student" instead of "unemployed" because it's embarrassing otherwise.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:43 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I ended up at a firm like this, and it could definitely be worse. Congrats dude. Look at it this way, even though the market rate is lower in these kinds of cities, you can rent a palace for $900.


Hey, thanks for sharing your experience. Are you happy? Have you tried to or thought about lateraling? The way I look at it is that partnership prospects may be better? Trying to look on the bright side.

I'm actually just getting started, so it's too early to tell if I'm happy, but the people seem great so far. Lateraling isn't really something I'm considering. My firm is tops in the (admittedly small) market, so there's really nowhere better to go for the time being. Jury's still very much out on what it's like to move to a tertiary market where I don't know anybody and enjoy the city. So far though I dig it. Great food, people are nice, and everything's cheap. It just gets really annoying to deal wi everyone from home saying "Oh man, why did you move there??"

All in all through, definitely could be tons worse. It beats the Vale, and there are worse things than being a big fish in a small pond.


Thanks again for sharing. I think I'll feel less lonely moving to a tertiary market in the middle of nowhere because I'd be bringing my wife with me. I hope it works out for you. Good luck.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:48 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I never imagined myself living in a place like this, but being part of this thread is making me appreciate how lucky I am to have the opportunity. My credentials would have given me interviews at most firms in the country last year, but it's amazing how one year and a no-offer make such a difference.


I'm the top 5 from the T-14 that's been posting here. This captures how I feel. Was told by CSO on Friday that my only hope is starting $60,000 to $70,000 at a shitlaw sweatshop and angling to move up to a second tier firm after three or four years. Pretty certain the career's over at this point because I can't bring myself to do that--with my level of debt, it doesn't make sense, especially in light of the hours and stress such a job entails. Got nothing for clerkships. I'm about 99% certain it's because of the employment situation. Was directly asked about it by a 9th Circuit and Central District of California judge (truth be told, it was the clerks who asked), and it came up in other circuit judge interviews as well.

Am starting to have fantasies about some top firm seeing my posts and contacting me with a job/interview invitation. Also fantasize about going on food stamps and using my story to become a special contributor to AbovetheLaw.


I'm the anon you were responding to. I have very similar stats (slightly lower-ranked school), and maybe my CSO is just blowing smoke up my ass, but I feel strongly that I'll eventually climb back to where I was before the no-offer. It may mean clerking for SSC for a year, or starting with a "shitlaw" firm, gaining a few years of practical experience, and then lateraling up to a vault firm who will still care about my school/grades at that point. But I agree with others who have called you out for complaining about any kind of job with a decent salary. We've been kicked in the teeth, and it sucks, but let's not compound whatever mistakes/misfortune we've had by quitting.

There are a lot of people in the vale with way less sparkling credentials, and they're still fighting. You should, too.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 25, 2013 9:35 pm

Do interviews matter for gov. honors programs? So had my interviews and was still told at the end of like half of them that I nevertheless have to apply online... what is up with that?
Also, do they check references prior to giving callbacks or after? Was surprised by one of the people asking for references and provided them with really outdated ones... do not know whether to update now (make myself look careless/unprepared/bad) or wait to make it to another round and then update via HR?

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 25, 2013 9:39 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I ended up at a firm like this, and it could definitely be worse. Congrats dude. Look at it this way, even though the market rate is lower in these kinds of cities, you can rent a palace for $900.


Hey, thanks for sharing your experience. Are you happy? Have you tried to or thought about lateraling? The way I look at it is that partnership prospects may be better? Trying to look on the bright side.

I'm actually just getting started, so it's too early to tell if I'm happy, but the people seem great so far. Lateraling isn't really something I'm considering. My firm is tops in the (admittedly small) market, so there's really nowhere better to go for the time being. Jury's still very much out on what it's like to move to a tertiary market where I don't know anybody and enjoy the city. So far though I dig it. Great food, people are nice, and everything's cheap. It just gets really annoying to deal wi everyone from home saying "Oh man, why did you move there??"

All in all through, definitely could be tons worse. It beats the Vale, and there are worse things than being a big fish in a small pond.


Thanks again for sharing. I think I'll feel less lonely moving to a tertiary market in the middle of nowhere because I'd be bringing my wife with me. I hope it works out for you. Good luck.

I am actually wondering if we are talking about the same city. Is it in the west?

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okinawa
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby okinawa » Sun Aug 25, 2013 9:53 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Do interviews matter for gov. honors programs? So had my interviews and was still told at the end of like half of them that I nevertheless have to apply online... what is up with that?
Also, do they check references prior to giving callbacks or after? Was surprised by one of the people asking for references and provided them with really outdated ones... do not know whether to update now (make myself look careless/unprepared/bad) or wait to make it to another round and then update via HR?

Yes interviews definitely matter, but be prepared for endless paperwork regardless. Whether they check references at all, much less prior to callbacks, will depend on the specific program.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:44 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I am actually wondering if we are talking about the same city. Is it in the west?


Heh, I wish it were the west. Nope, the south (not the Deep South, thank god).

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 26, 2013 12:41 am

Anyone else doing an unpaid Post Bar Law Clerk position at a DA's office? I'm realistic that this wont lead into a full time, at that office nor probably any other most likely.
What's your strategy right now for job searching? I'm still just applying to anything and everything. I'm about to start applying for non law jobs. Been inquiring with friends about entry level jobs at their (mostly tech) companies. I'm about to jump ship on law because I need money to live and I need it now - I have no family who I can get loans from, so as my funds deplete I get more desperate.
I realize leaving law now before it even starts will basically keep me from ever going back into it later. Trying to find a weekend job to get by until bar results, since if I don't pass then obviously I'm just done with it.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:03 am

Anonymous User wrote:Anyone else doing an unpaid Post Bar Law Clerk position at a DA's office? I'm realistic that this wont lead into a full time, at that office nor probably any other most likely.
What's your strategy right now for job searching? I'm still just applying to anything and everything. I'm about to start applying for non law jobs. Been inquiring with friends about entry level jobs at their (mostly tech) companies. I'm about to jump ship on law because I need money to live and I need it now - I have no family who I can get loans from, so as my funds deplete I get more desperate.
I realize leaving law now before it even starts will basically keep me from ever going back into it later. Trying to find a weekend job to get by until bar results, since if I don't pass then obviously I'm just done with it.


I'm pretty much in the same boat minus the clerk position. I am in the process of getting a non-law job and have come to the realization that I may never get a legal job. Law school was a terrible decision and I should never have left my previous field to attend it; those were 3 years I could have advanced my career in that field + debt.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby unc0mm0n1 » Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:22 pm

okinawa wrote:
unc0mm0n1 wrote:I do think there is a line between mentioning something and bragging. For instance a friend of mine just went to Paris for their honeymoon and posted on facebook. I don't find that bragging. Whereas I have another friend that is studying Cambridge and posts everyday about how it is so much different (i.e. better) than American schools because of this or that and how they wish "everybody had such an amazing opportunity", that is insufferable bragging that makes them seem like a douche.

I've never minded "I got X job!" posts; I think it's great to hear that people I know are finding work. What is insufferable is posting pictures of champagne bottles and smug comments when announcing an offer, pictures of the care package firms send with some comment about how your firm is the best in the world (with hashtags), 7-10 comments in a single week about all the great things your firm and its partners are doing for you, repeatedly bragging about how much money you are making or spending (yes, including pictures of paychecks), pictures of an expensive clothing spending spree hashtag your firm name, etc. I mean, this is basic stuff that normal people outside of the insufferable don't do.


Who does this? Those people should be punched in the face, I don't care if you went to YLS and everyone had great jobs this is still a dick move.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby a male human » Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:36 pm

TBFair it's probably more directed at non-law friends and other law friends who have jobs already who can congratulate them and plan trips together (who are currently posting pics from Europe).

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby a male human » Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:17 pm

What would happen if you pretended to be a student and applied to internships? They seem easier to get than real jobs, and you can add on experience.

NYstate
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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby NYstate » Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:25 pm

a male human wrote:What would happen if you pretended to be a student and applied to internships? They seem easier to get than real jobs, and you can add on experience.


There is a reason you have to be in school. I think it has to do with getting experience instead of salary. Otherwise they are supposed to pay you, except government and maybe some others.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:18 pm

Just got a job working in a Greek restaurant across the street from my condo complex. The owner comes from a family of lawyers, so he understood what was going on and said "Come get your work done here, make some money, and then go start your career." Maybe this won't be so bad.

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Re: The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls)

Postby FeelTheHeat » Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:20 pm

BarbellDreams wrote:One person I graduated with posted a pic of a biglaw conference room and the view with the comment along the lines of "It always sucks to go to work, but at least I get to work in style". Hope a train runs you over on the way home.


DIE DIE DIE IN A FIRE




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